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Subject: Bring Hanabi online! rss

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Pierre Beri
France
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Hey everyone. At last, with the Spiel des Jahres 2013 Hanabi has found the acknowledgement it has been deserving so bad since it first came out in 2010 in France.

This is one of my favourite games, if not my favourite, and I think it would just be perfect online. How great would a game where you are not supposed to be influenced by other players' reactions or words, be played online, where everyone is "blind and deaf" from others? Super-great in my opinion.

So if you know some PHP and Javascript (I don't, unfortunately), you will be able to code Hanabi and make it available for everyone to play, through the great Board Game Arena Studio.

More information on the BGA studio here: http://en.boardgamearena.com/#!doc/Studio

Although Antoine Bauza does not see the point of playing Hanabi online, he would not be against the project, so go go go!! Perhaps that might help get an authorization from the owner of the rights. Plus, if you're ready to code the game, maybe the BGA guys can handle the authorization part.
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Allen OConnor
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I would definitely play that. I always accidentally cheat at Hanabi
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Matt Davis
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I would code that.

Edit: In fact, I already have, but I've kept the site where it is private since I don't have Bauza's permission to make it publicly available. I'm volunteering for BGA's Studio program literally right now.
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d'Epenoux Matthieu
France
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Hello,

I am Matthieu d'Epenoux from Cocktailgames and I hold the international rights for the Hanabi game with another company called LES XII SINGES.

So far, nobody has been allowed by us to develop an online version of the game.

If some people wish to do so, I would be very grateful that they contact me in order to understand what they want to do exactly and see if we are ok on this or not.

Best regards.

Matthieu d'Epenoux
www.cocktailgames.com
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Pierre Beri
France
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Thumbs up for Matt and Matthieu!

Here are a few ideas for any developers:
- allow moving cards in your hand when you get a clue, leaving a space between two cards and (if rectangular cards are used) turning cards by 90°.
- offer the opportunity to enable/disable memory chips that appear on the cards on which you have clues and show what clue you have on them.
- ELO gain or loss: depends on the difficulty you have set for the game. Before starting a game, you can set a target score everyone can see. That could be a dummy player with a fixed ELO (23 - 1700 / 24 - 1800 / 25 - 2000). The dummy's ELO could also depend on the number of players. So the higher the target, the less ELO you lose if you lose, the more ELO you gain if you win, however the harder it is to win. This way I think you can come up with a decent ELO system to give players an indication on who they are playing with and even enable restricting some tables to ELOs >1800, >2000.
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Lee Fisher
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beri2 wrote:
Thumbs up for Matt and Matthieu!

Here are a few ideas for any developers:
- allow moving cards in your hand when you get a clue, leaving a space between two cards and (if rectangular cards are used) turning cards by 90°.
- offer the opportunity to enable/disable memory chips that appear on the cards on which you have clues and show what clue you have on them.


Personally I would just attach clues to the cards, not try to replicate any physical and/or memory aspects.
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Adam Kunsemiller
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lfisher wrote:
Personally I would just attach clues to the cards, not try to replicate any physical and/or memory aspects.


Being able to at least move the cards so that I always kept my cards in order based on their age would be critically important to my enjoyment of any online implementation. Without that then I still have a heavy memorization requirement, which is remembering the order things entered my hand, which is easily solved by letting them move around. When you also consider it is important to know this information on *everyone* elses hand at the table, this becomes essential.
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Lee Fisher
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rhitmojo wrote:
lfisher wrote:
Personally I would just attach clues to the cards, not try to replicate any physical and/or memory aspects.


Being able to at least move the cards so that I always kept my cards in order based on their age would be critically important to my enjoyment of any online implementation. Without that then I still have a heavy memorization requirement, which is remembering the order things entered my hand, which is easily solved by letting them move around. When you also consider it is important to know this information on *everyone* elses hand at the table, this becomes essential.


Oh yeah certainly!
 
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Matt Davis
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@Matthieu - BGA is, like most large sites, very good about licensing and permissions. I know that would all be cleared before anything happened.

@lfisher and rhitmojo - I agree. Your cards would always have to stay in the order in which you drew them, and I'd be inclined to just have every clue you've heard attached to every card to eliminate the memory aspect.
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Pierre Beri
France
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Maybe for hardcore sadomasochists like me it should be your choice when you create a table to enable or disable the clue memos. Playing without them could have a positive impact on ELO gain/loss.
 
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Matt Davis
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That would be an easy option to have. I don't have any idea of how ELO would work for Hanabi. Maybe rate people by average score in all their games?
 
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Pierre Beri
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Here are a few ideas if you skipped my post above.
beri2 wrote:
- ELO gain or loss: depends on the difficulty you have set for the game. Before starting a game, you can set a target score everyone can see. That could be a dummy player with a fixed ELO (23 - 1700 / 24 - 1800 / 25 - 2000). The dummy's ELO could also depend on the number of players. So the higher the target, the less ELO you lose if you lose, the more ELO you gain if you win, however the harder it is to win. This way I think you can come up with a decent ELO system to give players an indication on who they are playing with and even enable restricting some tables to ELOs >1800, >2000.
 
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Pierre Beri
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Any news, any moves on that subject?
 
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Matt Davis
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I've just heard back about BGA's Studio program. They're sort of on hold right now as they re-vamp things. It seems they had far more developers clamoring to make things than they could handle, so they're working on opening up the whole process. For now, though, that means a hold on new people coming in. So I can't speak to whether any sites are talking to the publishers to bring Hanabi online as of right now.
 
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Pierre Beri
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Matthieu.CIP wrote:
Hello,

I am Matthieu d'Epenoux from Cocktailgames and I hold the international rights for the Hanabi game with another company called LES XII SINGES.

So far, nobody has been allowed by us to develop an online version of the game.

If some people wish to do so, I would be very grateful that they contact me in order to understand what they want to do exactly and see if we are ok on this or not.

Best regards.

Matthieu d'Epenoux
www.cocktailgames.com
Hi Matthieu,
Do you have any news on a potential online implementation for Hanabi? Have you been discussing with any developers?

Thanks a lot for your answers.
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Pierre Beri
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Here is an update on where we are, AFAIK.

I've met Matthieu d'Epenoux a few weeks ago on the French Hanabi tournament and I've brought this back to his attention, because I can't wait for the online version to come real. I mentioned the BGA Studio, which Matthieu wasn't aware of and he claimed he would be ok to use it to bring Hanabi online and would think about it. Then, I sent him an e-mail with suggestions about how the interface would work.

Plus, in my team for the tournament, we had a programmer who would be glad to code this.

My e-mail was sent 3 weeks ago and I haven't had a reply yet. However, IRL, I remember Matthieu sounding enthusiastic.
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Robin Levins
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beri2 wrote:
Here is an update on where we are, AFAIK.

I've met Matthieu d'Epenoux a few weeks ago on the French Hanabi tournament and I've brought this back to his attention, because I can't wait for the online version to come real. I mentioned the BGA Studio, which Matthieu wasn't aware of and he claimed he would be ok to use it to bring Hanabi online and would think about it. Then, I sent him an e-mail with suggestions about how the interface would work.

Plus, in my team for the tournament, we had a programmer who would be glad to code this.

My e-mail was sent 3 weeks ago and I haven't had a reply yet. However, IRL, I remember Matthieu sounding enthusiastic.

Thanks for following up on this!

I know I contacted Matthieu a couple of times through BGG regarding coding/hosting Hanabi online, but never got any response. I'd love to see something come about, even if it's not my own creation. (I don't know PHP, so I don't know if BGA Studio would be something I could easily contribute to at this time or not.)
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Keldon Jones
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Sounds like there are a lot of implementations floating around out there. I've recently completed one of my own:


I've had a few friends play some games and it seems to be working well. It's got some interesting features:

- All games are "duplicate Hanabi". After playing a game you can see how other groups fared with the same shuffle and deal.
- You can watch replays of your games to relive the tricky moments and see what you could have done better.
- It supports the 3 variants that use the sixth suit.

If anyone is interested in testing it, feel free to PM me for the address. Hopefully we will soon have permission to open it up for everyone.
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Pierre Beri
France
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OK, it seems the implementation will be making some moves in the near future.
I've met Matthieu again this week-end and he appointed me to coordinate the whole stuff, contact people and put them in touch.

So I will be doing this very soon, liaising with potential developers and making sure we find the best way to implement Hanabi online.
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Juli KMeier
Germany
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Hi guys,

Do you have any news on this topic? There still seems to be no official version available on the internet.

Cheers, Julian
 
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Byron S
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referates wrote:
Hi guys,

Do you have any news on this topic? There still seems to be no official version available on the internet.

Cheers, Julian

boardgamearena.com has an online version
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arry -
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Are there any others besides BGA? It went way downhill in the recent months.
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Pierre Beri
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What do you mean by downhill and by it?
 
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arry -
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By it, I mean BGA, and by downhill, I mean it's gotten pretty damn bad.

- Rapidshare-style shame timers before a game for non-paying users (bright idea: if you provide less of a service, your customers will pay you more for it!)

- Abundance of quitters (discarded a 5 through poor play? Oh no, abandon quick!)

- Not enough good players* for the first two reasons.

* By good I mean interested in communication and seeing the game through.

So I was wondering, is there another online service that lets you play Hanabi where all of the people from BGA went?
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ben small
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arry1 wrote:
By it, I mean BGA, and by downhill, I mean it's gotten pretty damn bad.

- Rapidshare-style shame timers before a game for non-paying users (bright idea: if you provide less of a service, your customers will pay you more for it!)

- Abundance of quitters (discarded a 5 through poor play? Oh no, abandon quick!)

- Not enough good players* for the first two reasons.

* By good I mean interested in communication and seeing the game through.

So I was wondering, is there another online service that lets you play Hanabi where all of the people from BGA went?


well said arry

BGA management are complete tools. They do have the best interface, but you will find a better percentage of top level skills here:

http://keldon.net/hanabi/
 
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