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Lords of Waterdeep: Scoundrels of Skullport» Forums » General

Subject: On using both expansions... rss

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Joshua Wilson
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In the rules, under using both expansion, it's required to take away half of all the cards and buildings from the base game, out. And I'm sure this is a balancing issue, to make sure that the expansion stuff doesn't get lost in the mix. But how much is it really going to throw off the balance, if you use all of the components at once?

And does anyone else want to try this mega mix?
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Davi Rosa
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If I buy this expansion, I wouldn't play it any other way.
 
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Tristan Hall
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You'd risk neutering corruption as an effect. Though it would certainly seem more appealing and easier just to shuffle it all in.
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Ian Toltz
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It would be a pretty major balance change, actually, because of corruption.

Corruption is balanced around a certain amount of it being taken... Corruption is worse if there's more corruption, and better if there's less.

As a result, if you mix in everything, you lower the density of buildings that give corruption.

That, in turn, favors the players who go to those buildings, which in turn favors the players whose strategies happen to align with the corruption-providing buildings which come up.
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Wayne Shepherdson
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I remember seeing that there is a lord which scores off new quests. If you do not take out half the old cards, there's gonna be a lesser chance of seeing the new quests.
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Kris Rhodes
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In the rulebook only one new lord is described, and he gets four points per corruption. Nothing about scoring off new quests.
 
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Rick Teverbaugh
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But there are photos posted for all the new Lord cards and I think there are 2 that give points for new quests.
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Jacek Jezioro
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rickert wrote:
But there are photos posted for all the new Lord cards and I think there are 2 that give points for new quests.


Halaster Blackcloak & Sangalor


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Kris Rhodes
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Huh, I wonder why they went to the trouble of describing one new lord in the rulebook but not the other three.

So I take it the quest and building types referenced on the pictured cards are "skullport" and "undermountain" quests and buildings?
 
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Rick Teverbaugh
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That Lord was described on the clarifications page so I would think that it might bde the only one that needed clarifying.
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Ben Ehlers
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Speusippus wrote:
Huh, I wonder why they went to the trouble of describing one new lord in the rulebook but not the other three.

So I take it the quest and building types referenced on the pictured cards are "skullport" and "undermountain" quests and buildings?


I think there are six new lords. There's another with bonuses for any quest, and one that gets bonuses for mega-quests.
 
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P.D. Magnus
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JoshmanVGH wrote:
In the rules, under using both expansion, it's required to take away half of all the cards and buildings from the base game, out. And I'm sure this is a balancing issue, to make sure that the expansion stuff doesn't get lost in the mix. But how much is it really going to throw off the balance, if you use all of the components at once?

And does anyone else want to try this mega mix?


I see how not removing anything is easier, because there is no sorting to be done.

I don't see how it's more of a 'mega mix', though. There will be cards that don't see play because you never get to them, which isn't much different then cards not seeing play because they were set aside at the beginning. Because the removal is random, you still won't know what to expect with the game as written.

And, as others have said, it is a balancing issue.
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Brandon Holmes
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It has to be because the Skullport expansion is balanced with the assumption you will add it to the base set. When you just play Skullport you do not remove any cards.

I don't see myself using both expansions at the same time as a result. In fact I don't really see myself using Undermountain at all, maybe just to test it once. Skullport just looks too good to ever choose Undermountain over it.
 
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Patrick Fournier
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bholmes4 wrote:
Skullport just looks too good to ever choose Undermountain over it.


That's also what I thought, but we played once with each expansion, and I must say we had much more fun with Undermountain, to my great surprise. It was a 2-player game, which finished 248-248! Of course, I lost the tiebreaker.

It's only based on two games (one each), and we still need to figure out this corruption thing, but I wouldn't discount Undermountain...
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Jordan Booth
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pmagnus wrote:
JoshmanVGH wrote:

And does anyone else want to try this mega mix?

I don't see how it's more of a 'mega mix', though. There will be cards that don't see play because you never get to them, which isn't much different then cards not seeing play because they were set aside at the beginning. Because the removal is random, you still won't know what to expect with the game as written.

The balance can still be there, you need to increase the length of the game proportionally. I've played a couple 2 player base games going 16 rounds. The last two rounds was just collecting because we had completed every quest. 3 player didn't work as well, but I think it could with more cards.

Also, bear in mind; these variants the OP and I are proposing are for those who fondly enjoy the playing of the game for as long as possible in which light a slight waterig down of the harshness of a new mechanic may be looked on as a welcome option.
 
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Justaguy Gaming
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I prefer just going in and removing the cards and tiles completely. I have found there are many quests, buildings, and intrigue cards, I can do just fine without them being present. Personally, I have not noticed any damage to the variety of quests, intrigue cards, or buildings. Players seem more enthusiastic about playing the Intrigue cards and were annoyed by the "start of round" buildings before they were removed.

This means I don't have to sort everything out and setup time is almost as quick as it has always been. Also, doing without the lords that score off the expansions, personally, is a not an option to me. The main reason is they are more lords that score off buildings, they control as well as their expansion quests. That gives us 3 "builder" lords instead of just 1, making a bit less obvious and more interesting trying to guess a player's lord. Keeping all the buildings and quests, weakens these 2 lords, and I'm not going to make people play a lord, I know is at a real disadvantage.
 
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Gamer D

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bholmes4 wrote:
It has to be because the Skullport expansion is balanced with the assumption you will add it to the base set. When you just play Skullport you do not remove any cards.

I don't see myself using both expansions at the same time as a result. In fact I don't really see myself using Undermountain at all, maybe just to test it once. Skullport just looks too good to ever choose Undermountain over it.


I think you're missing out on some fun if you don't play with both simultaneously. Skullport and Undermountain have some interesting synergy, with the high value 40 point Undermountain quests making those Skullport corruption buildings look all the more tempting to use. Also I love using the Undermountain building that gives you two Intrigue cards, but I love intrigue so that's just me.

Anyway sorting out and reshuffling takes a few minutes before or after a game (I do it at home between games to set up for next time) but it's not overly annoying relative to the extra fun of using both expansions. Just my opinion.
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