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Subject: [DECK] Shaper? I Hardly Know Her rss

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Contig
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b a n j o wrote:
Kate "Mac" McCaffrey
3x Test Rub
3x Underworld Connections


I guess these two fit the name of the deck, depending on what "connections" you're talking about.
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Bryan Goodwin
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b a n j o wrote:
Kate "Mac" McCaffrey

Hardware (5)
2x Dinosaurus
3x Rabbit Hole

Event (24)
3x Diesel
3x Infiltration
3x Inside Job *** *** ***
3x Modded
3x Quality Time
3x Sure Gamble
3x Test Rub
3x Tinkering

Program (8)
2x Corroder ** **
2x Crypsis
2x Femme Fatale * *
2x Gordian Blade

Resources (8)
3x Armitage Codebusting
2x Kati Jones
3x Underworld Connections


I've done some testing with Underworld Connections, and concluded that they're too slow/unreliable to work effectively. I think the biggest problem that you'll face with this deck is that your economy will look like this: bust/bust/bust/KATI MONEY/bust/bust/bust/KATI MONEY. And your big money turns you'll have to make choices like: Install the expensive stuff OR make one big run (where?).

I won't ask about the three copies of "Test Rub" I must have missed that data pack!
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Glen Doe
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Indeed. Underworld works to supplement your income, not as a main source of income. It works equally well tgt with Kati or Opus. With Kati, it is especially useful to give you a few credits to run/install stuff while you wait for kati to grow.

A small concern i have though is that this deck is relying on 3 cards (rabbit hole) to trigger 3 cards (Underworld). 1-2 helpful AI might be a good addition to make sure that when you draw the connections, you have the 2 link.

If you have trouble fitting in cards, increasing the deck size is one option. Kate decks function just fine with more cards (mine has 50). Between diesel, quality time, test run, you have more than enough ways to make a slightly larger deck work. I also use replicators in my deck to draw out cards and reduce redundant draws.

On to your deck alone. I feel that there are too few hardwares/programs to make kate's ability really worth it, particularly in the long run. I understand from the structure of your deck that its meant to be running much faster than most shaper decks. I cant really say whether that would work without trying this deck myself and having descriptions of how you use it/how your games go.
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Glen Doe
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b a n j o wrote:
If 20 years of playing Magic the Gathering has taught me anything, it's to always plays the minimum number of cards allowed. Adding cards to help me find other cards is counter-intuitive. I'd rather rely on Diesel and Quality Time to help me find the Rabbit Holes.

I am playing 13 cards which work with her ability, which is almost 30% of the deck. Given the fact her ability only triggers once per turn, I think 13 is the correct number - especially since 2 of the 13 cannot be installed at the same time. The goal of the deck is to build the rig as fast as possible, and then run the remotes. Admittedly this strategy puts me at a disadvantage against Fast Advance, but every deck is going to have a weakness.


Now firstly, majority of magic decks, competitive or otherwise were 50-60 cards. The minimum, at least for as long as i played it, was 40 cards.

Now, Im not saying relying on diesel and quality time isnt possible. But there will be games, where you draw 1, maybe 2 underworld connections, and no rabbit hole for a few turns. do the math, when 3 cards trigger 3, this is probable.

I didnt ask you to put cards that find rabbit hole, because no card to find hardwares exist yet. I asked you to put in helpful AI. So im confused about your counter-intuitive comment.

Lastly, you have 6 cards that use her ability. Okay... ill consider it 8 on account that crypsis and femme fatale have a high chance of being installed twice. For every other hardware/program you have, you wouldnt install it more than once. So that means you going to use her ability a average of 6-7 times a game.

Now, im not saying your wrong for doing so. Like you said, and like i said in my first post, your deck is obviously built to run faster than most shapers can, and that might work great. what i am saying though, is dont kid yourself about how much of pros/cons your getting from certain abilities/combos. As long as your realistic about your decks capabilities and okay with the returns, youll maximize your deck according to what works for you.

 
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Peter O
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Shinji87 wrote:


Now firstly, majority of magic decks, competitive or otherwise were 50-60 cards. The minimum, at least for as long as i played it, was 40 cards.



Constructed Magic: 60 card minimum
Sealed/Draft: 40 card minimum

As far as optimal sizes, there was the occasional case made for 61 card decks in constructed and the occasional odd alternative win conditions involving large decks. Otherwise, it was ALWAYS the minimum size. You want to play with your best cards. Get the bad filler out of the way.
 
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Glen Doe
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tranenturm wrote:

Constructed Magic: 60 card minimum
Sealed/Draft: 40 card minimum

As far as optimal sizes, there was the occasional case made for 61 card decks in constructed and the occasional odd alternative win conditions involving large decks. Otherwise, it was ALWAYS the minimum size. You want to play with your best cards. Get the bad filler out of the way.


Your right. My mistake.

With regard to optimal sizes, magic is definitely 60, unless your deck has a special combo in mind etc. In the case of netrunner, kate is the one runner i would say has a convincing reason to have more than her minimum cards.

Because of her ability, kate benefits from having more than usual unique hardwares and/or programs. Also, when coupled with using cards such as rabbit hole, replicator and aesop's workshop etc, the negative effects of having more cards (lesser chance of finding what you need) decreases. If you deck doesnt have bad fillers to begin with, all the better, the advantages of having more cards might outweigh the disadvantages.
 
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Bryan Goodwin
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b a n j o wrote:

The deck has a ton of economy cards. The Underworld Connections simply act as a buffer.

b a n j o wrote:

The goal of the deck is to build the rig as fast as possible, and then run the remotes.

Shinji87 wrote:

Underworld works to supplement your income, not as a main source of income. It works equally well tgt with Kati or Opus. With Kati, it is especially useful to give you a few credits to run/install stuff while you wait for kati to grow.

A small concern i have though is that this deck is relying on 3 cards (rabbit hole) to trigger 3 cards (Underworld). 1-2 helpful AI might be a good addition to make sure that when you draw the connections, you have the 2 link.


I'll take one more swing at this one. You're building a deck intended to set up fast, but are using a drip economy resource that takes 4 turns to show a profit and is reliant on drawing/installing another 3-of to complete the combo.

Let's look at putting that combo together. You need one card from Group A (3 cards) and one from Group B (3 cards). I won't run the numbers all the way down, but assuming you're mulliganing for either of those cards, it's going to take 6 draws to have a 50% likelihood of seeing the first one (10% = 2 draws, 90% = 21 draws). For half the combo. Fortunately, those draws may have a chance to give you the other half, but I think you're looking at about 10-12 draws to get this together at a 50% reliability. How late in the game is "too late" to get the UC out? You've also mentioned consistency as a key element - how consistent should this combo be for you to consider it worthwhile?
 
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