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Subject: Keep tokens in hand rss

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Christian Bou Farhat
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Hello,

I didnt find the answer in the Rule book. When we choose a new civilization take its corresponding tokens and starts expanding... can we keep some of the the tokens aside for the next turn ? or should all the tokens be placed ?
Thank you
 
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Ben Bateson
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There is no reason NOT to place all your tokens.

You can take as many of them back in hand at the beginning of your next turn as you wish.
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Michael Nerman
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Yes, you don't have to keep attacking, but it makes sense to put the extra tokens on your regions to increase the defense of those regions.
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Hans Moleman
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christizzz wrote:
Hello,

I didnt find the answer in the Rule book. When we choose a new civilization take its corresponding tokens and starts expanding... can we keep some of the the tokens aside for the next turn ? or should all the tokens be placed ?
Thank you


As mentioned above, ZERO reason to hold back any troops...because...

1) Harder for opponents to take over your regions
2) If taken over, you get to redeploy replace at the end of the attackers turn, making it that much harder for the next person.

Only times you will have any in hand is due to the race effects:
1) Barbarians -- if you fail a reinforcement roll attempt
2) Pixies-- only one to the area
3) Amazon -- the 4 you hold over for attacking purposes
4) In hand only when you have no active region available to you (due to getting wiped off the board)


I think that's about it, but could be wrong. But to answer the question, I guess you could -- its just not that practical because you really have nothing lose outside of making you an 'easier' target

edit: 'redeploy' probably wrong choice of words; replace your fallen comrades onto spaces you already occupy
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Danny Mack
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You know, I went back and read through the pertinent rules sections again, and the OP is right. It's not stated that you must place all of your tokens. Nor is it advised by the rulebook that you should. (I've certainly never presumed that it was required.) But it is explained that conquest/ownership of regions on the board is the source of Victory Coins. That being established, I'm not sure why you would want to hold back from victory? (So it may not be required, but nobody requires us to breathe either--it just makes sense if you know that's what keeps you living.)

This leads me to further analyze your statement about "for next turn"...I just want to make sure you understand that you actually get to gather your troops from your owned regions at the start of your next turn--so you will have some for next turn (usually) anyway. At the start of your own turn, you can even completely withdraw all of your troops from any/all of your regions, placing them in hand for conquest that turn.

If this was indeed your understanding of the rules, tell me why you would want to withhold available troops from the board? I'm curious.

By the way, this is an excellent breakdown of what is normal & advised in the game, with regard to troops in hand. I don't know that I've seen it stated anywhere else quite this succinctly & clearly:
KingD21 wrote:
Only times you will have any in hand is due to the race effects:
1) Barbarians -- if you fail a reinforcement roll attempt
2) Pixies-- only one to the area
3) Amazon -- the 4 you hold over for attacking purposes
4) In hand only when you have no active region available to you (due to getting wiped off the board)
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Michael Nerman
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Also, if one of your regions is taken, you only lose one of your tokens. The rest you get back to put back on the board at the end of the current turn.
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Christian Bou Farhat
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Thank you fot ur answers
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Danny Mack
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I was looking for this thread just the other day. I'm glad it popped up again! I was talking to Eric from DOW and the topic came up of not entering the board when you've chosen a new race. He and I both agreed that the rule that "conquest is never required" would apply here, and as a result you do not have to enter the board on your turn with your new race.
Of course we also both agreed there's almost no application where it would be practical to not enter the board at all. You still have to score on your turn, and entering the map allows you to score more.
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Danny Mack
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That's why we have these forums.
"Board Game Geeks" can come here and ask all sorts of camel, refrigerator, latitude/longitude, lime green, barometric pressure, eating after midnight questions.
And you are correct if you assume players are NOT allowed to eat other players' tiles...unless there are fan powers in play that I do not know about...
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Jamie Beu
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bandit_boy7 wrote:
It's not stated that you must place all of your tokens. Nor is it advised by the rulebook that you should. (I've certainly never presumed that it was required.) But it is explained that conquest/ownership of regions on the board is the source of Victory Coins. That being established, I'm not sure why you would want to hold back from victory?


My understanding of the rules was that:
1) you may only place those tokens on the board that are sufficient to conquer an area - no more.
2) on your last conquest (i.e., when you use the reinforcement die), if you fail the reinforcement roll, those tokens that didn't make it onto the board REMAIN off the board during the redeploy phase (until your next turn, when they are back in your pool).

But now, having read this discussion, it sounds like #1 is still in effect, but #2 was incorrect.

For example, I have 5 tokens and I conquer a non-mountain region with 1 token on it. Therefore, I have to place 3 tokens there - no more, no less. (as per understanding of rules #1)
My next (and final) conquest attempt is also against a non-mountain region with 1 token on it. According to my former understanding of the rules, if I don't roll at least one dot, those 2 token remain off the board and I can only redeploy those tokens already on the board.

But if "understanding of rules #2" is incorrect, then I can still use those 2 tokens - which failed a reinforcement die roll - for redeployment to other regions.

So, what say ye?
 
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Sean West
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SwingCorey wrote:
My understanding of the rules was that:
1) you may only place those tokens on the board that are sufficient to conquer an area - no more.
2) on your last conquest (i.e., when you use the reinforcement die), if you fail the reinforcement roll, those tokens that didn't make it onto the board REMAIN off the board during the redeploy phase (until your next turn, when they are back in your pool).

#1: I'm not sure whether it's a rule or not but it would be a poor choice to use more tokens than you need to conquer a region because you could use those extra tokens to conquer more regions and score more coins. If you want more defenders there you can always add them during redeployment.

#2: is incorrect. If your reinforcement roll fails you immediately add that (those) token(s) to your other regions during redeployment.
 
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Danny Mack
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SwingCorey wrote:
My understanding of the rules was that:
1) you may only place those tokens on the board that are sufficient to conquer an area - no more.
2) on your last conquest (i.e., when you use the reinforcement die), if you fail the reinforcement roll, those tokens that didn't make it onto the board REMAIN off the board during the redeploy phase (until your next turn, when they are back in your pool).

I'm curious what part of the rules you "understood this" from?
For #1, I think there's an important difference between that which is suggested/sensible and that which is required by the rules.
For #2, if this were true, then what would be half the point of the Barbarians' racial power/limitation? In truth, this "rule" only applies to the Barbarian Race.
 
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