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Star Wars: X-Wing Miniatures Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: Digging Up The Past: Backstabber vs. Falcon / Slave 1 rss

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Chris Brown
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I've seen it discussed in threads in the past, but I still feel fuzzy about this. Is there an official ruling on these instances?

Referenced threads:
http://boardgamegeek.com/article/12614935
http://boardgamegeek.com/article/12914221

When does Backstabber get his bonus?

One thread references a ruling that Backstabber has to be outside of a printed arc on the ship card. Slave 1 has 2 printed, the Falcon only has 1 unless you consider the 360 arrow printed on the card to be a full arc. I wish we had a Fantasy Flight employee who could say, without being vague, what happens.
 
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Henrik Johansson
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The answere is in one of the linked threads: http://boardgamegeek.com/article/12922920#12922920

From the FAQ:
Q: When exactly can Backstabber trigger his
ability?
A: Backstabber triggers his ability only if no portion of
his base is inside any of the printed firing arcs on
the defender’s ship token.
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Robert M.
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Not an FFG employee or an official rules source, but this is:
Current X-wing FAQ wrote:

Q: When exactly can Backstabber trigger his ability?
A: Backstabber triggers his ability only if no portion of his base is inside any of the printed firing arcs on the defender’s ship token.

It's not vague at all, honestly. There are two 90-degree firing arcs printed on the Slave 1, and one 90-degree arc printed on the Falcon. Backstabber gets his bonus if and only if he's not in a firing arc.

ETA: ninja
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Chris Brown
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Vorpal Sword wrote:
Not an FFG employee or an official rules source, but this is:
Current X-wing FAQ wrote:

Q: When exactly can Backstabber trigger his ability?
A: Backstabber triggers his ability only if no portion of his base is inside any of the printed firing arcs on the defender’s ship token.

It's not vague at all, honestly. There are two 90-degree firing arcs printed on the Slave 1, and one 90-degree arc printed on the Falcon. Backstabber gets his bonus if and only if he's not in a firing arc.

ETA: ninja


So that red arrow in a circle around the card of the Falcon isn't considered a firing arc even though it is the same color as the firing arcs and a really nice way for them to show the secondary firing arc without tinting the whole card red. That is why this response is vague to me.

Having different rulings for Slave 1 and Falcon are stupid both thematically and mechanically. Both ships can shoot behind themselves. Ruling should be equal for both (I really don't care which). Personally I feel it should be all on the forward firing arc or "can he be shot back" which would include turret secondary weapons.

No hate to anyone answering, it just feels wrong to me.
 
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Robert M.
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killerardvark wrote:
So that red arrow in a circle around the card of the Falcon isn't considered a firing arc even though it is the same color as the firing arcs and a really nice way for them to show the secondary firing arc without tinting the whole card red.

No, it's not a firing arc. Check the rules for the Falcon:



(Edit: mucking with the image to make it readable but not enormous.)

The turret indicator reminds you that the Falcon can use its primary weapon to attack targets outside its firing arc. It's important that the Falcon still have a firing arc because it can carry missiles, which do use the firing arc.

killerardvark wrote:
Having different rulings for Slave 1 and Falcon are stupid both thematically and mechanically. Both ships can shoot behind themselves. Ruling should be equal for both (I really don't care which). Personally I feel it should be all on the forward firing arc or "can he be shot back" which would include turret secondary weapons.

The distinction between the two ships is a really good way to make both ships interesting, while differentiating them from one another both on the power curve and in play. It also provides a way to make future cards work differently for one ship than for the other--suppose, for instance, that the Gunner only worked against ships in your firing arc.
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Chris Brown
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Finally found an explanation that makes it thematic...

Backstabber's benefit comes from him getting shots at a ship where the pilot cannot see him. The Falcon's turrets are not controlled by the pilot. Slave 1 (as noted in books) has the capabilities of seeing behind him while flying, so he is able to see Backstabber when he is behind him.

Thanks for all the discussion! I may not like the decisions, but I will have to live with it! Hopefully it wont come up very often.
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David Pontier
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Slave I only has one "firing arc," that is why the rear arc is in dotted lines. Or are you saying that the Firespray can fire missiles and an HLC out of his rear arc? No, it can't. The rear arc only applies for his primary weapon just like the 360 on the falcon only applies to his primary weapon. They both have the same forward "Firing arc" and if Backstabber is outside it, then he gets his bonus.

Unless there is a FAQ I missed on the Slave, Backstabber gets an extra dice when he is behind that ship.
 
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Robert M.
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Piqsid wrote:
Slave I only has one "firing arc," that is why the rear arc is in dotted lines. Or are you saying that the Firespray can fire missiles and an HLC out of his rear arc? No, it can't. The rear arc only applies for his primary weapon just like the 360 on the falcon only applies to his primary weapon. They both have the same forward "Firing arc" and if Backstabber is outside it, then he gets his bonus.

Unless there is a FAQ I missed on the Slave, Backstabber gets an extra dice when he is behind that ship.

The Firespray has a primary firing arc, and an auxiliary firing arc. The auxiliary arc can't be used for secondary weapons, but it's definitely described as an "auxiliary firing arc". The idea that Backstabber can't attack while inside of it is based on the FAQ language that says "any of the printed firing arcs".
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Brian Huhtala
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Backstabber vs. the Firespray = Sidestabber.
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