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Subject: [DECK] Opening Moves: No-Tag NBN rss

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Justin
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NBN: Making News

Agenda (13)
3 AstroScript Pilot Program
3 Breaking News
1 Character Assassination
3 Gila Hands Arcology
3 Project Beale

Asset (10)
3 Jackson Howard
2 Marked Accounts
2 Melange Mining Corp
3 PAD Campaign

Upgrade (2)
2 SanSan City Grid

Operation (3)
3 Hedge Fund

Barrier (7)
3 Ice Wall •••
3 TMI
1 Wall of Static

Code Gate (7)
3 Enigma
3 Pop-up Window
1 Tollbooth

Sentry (7)
3 Archer ••••• •
3 Caduceus ••••• •
1 Grim

Built with http://netrunner.meteor.com/

Lots of controversy on this one! It's not Weyland, but I've found it surprisingly competitive (and fun).

13 agendas? I love the one-pointers on utility and Archer food. 5/3 just doesn't gel. Jackson can help with floods.

Only 2 SanSans? With Astroscripts and a single 4/2 as my toughest agenda, I'm not worked up about FA. It's still nice, though.

TMI?! Yeah, TMI! With playtesting, I've come to love TMI on HQ as hyper-Siphon defense. Give them a chance to derez it.

Archer? KatMan is everywhere, and hates Archer (so does Noise). Entice Andy to pop Faeries (Caduceus, assets, 1-point agendas).

Grim? This slot used to be Flare, which is super-situational at a 9 cost. For 5, I can have a more-playable situational card.

General play style: bang out early agendas, camp out under Archers (real or threatened), induce lots of runs.
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Dave Kudzma
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Thanks for posting this. I've kind of had doubts about the efficacy of Flare. It also answers the question about what I filled its slot with.

I LOVE TMI.

I like the idea of the Grim; it's one nasty surprise that they're likely not ready for. I'll be curious to know how that works out over extended play.

This build looks fun.
 
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Andrew Keddie
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astroglide wrote:
NBN: Making NewsTMI?! Yeah, TMI! With playtesting, I've come to love TMI on HQ as hyper-Siphon defense. Give them a chance to derez it.


I've been staring at TMI for a long time now and thinking it has a place in my deck. When you say give a chance to derez, do you mean by enticing them to win the trace and then re-rez it now they can't afford to beat it twice? Won't they see that coming? Any advice on good use of this card would be appreciated; it looks so good on rez:str tradeoff, and NBN can nail the trace without having to spend real money... I want to find room for this!
 
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William Frank
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CommissarFeesh wrote:
astroglide wrote:
NBN: Making NewsTMI?! Yeah, TMI! With playtesting, I've come to love TMI on HQ as hyper-Siphon defense. Give them a chance to derez it.


I've been staring at TMI for a long time now and thinking it has a place in my deck. When you say give a chance to derez, do you mean by enticing them to win the trace and then re-rez it now they can't afford to beat it twice? Won't they see that coming? Any advice on good use of this card would be appreciated; it looks so good on rez:str tradeoff, and NBN can nail the trace without having to spend real money... I want to find room for this!


He means that TMI (any tracing ice, really, as long as the trace fires) is a great defense against Account Siphon: pour a lot of money into the trace and the credit swing from Account Siphon is gone. Because of the nature of TMI, you only get to do this when you initially rez it, so you should hope that the Runner's plan is to derez ice.
 
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Sonny A.
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scifantasy wrote:

He means that TMI (any tracing ice, really, as long as the trace fires) is a great defense against Account Siphon: pour a lot of money into the trace and the credit swing from Account Siphon is gone. Because of the nature of TMI, you only get to do this when you initially rez it, so you should hope that the Runner's plan is to derez ice.


So to prevent the runner from draining your corp funds, you just throw them all away on a trace to keep your TMI up. I'm sorry, but that's just plain stupid.

At least use your credits to rez a SanSan or something like that. Or use a Draco that actually benefits from excess money dumped into it (plus it can initiate a trace that actually matters).
 
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William Frank
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SonnyDK wrote:
So to prevent the runner from draining your corp funds, you just throw them all away on a trace to keep your TMI up. I'm sorry, but that's just plain stupid.


That depends. If it bankrupts the Runner and if you have some fundraising alternatives (Melange, Marked Accounts...), it may be a fair trade.
 
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Tom Keaten
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If you have a SanSan that you could throw credits into, of course that's the best option. That said, it's certainly not stupid to throw credits into a TMI trace to avoid Siphon. Obviously, the biggest benefit is not giving them 2x the money you lost - you're going to lose it one way or another, may as well stop them from getting any benefit from it. In comparison to Draco, sure, pumping cash into Draco would allow you to give it a permanent boost, but what does all that strength give you? An ETR that can be broken without a breaker. That's hardly security, unless your only concern is Siphon defense on HQ forever, in which case sure, you can just dump everything into the trace every time.
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Justin
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The TMI slot used to be populated by Bastion. Not a fan of replacing it with Draco for a few reasons:

- the current ICE makeup is split 7/7/7 between types, and -3 barrier/+3 sentry would help runners a lot breaker-wise
- even a 50-strength Draco can be beaten like this without a breaker: "Run. Outtraced me? Okay. Run again."
- the only tag punishment I have is destroying resources

By giving them a chance to derez TMI, I mean not assuming it's a, "don't even bother if they can beat the trace" type card. Put it on HQ, and don't automatically overinvest in it to get it going. Suppose Andy tries to Siphon, and you make it a trace-4 with your NBN credits. They can pay 3 to derez it (with link). If so, you have an unpreventable dump the next time they try to Siphon. If not, you just got a big cheap wall. Your credits were toast anyway if they got through, and the most important effect is that they're not doubling off of your money. There are 21 pieces of ICE in the deck plus card draw, so you don't necessarily have to live and die by rezzed TMIs.

It's been a fun exercise for me, and proper "bet sizing" can result in all kinds of hijinx dancing around Siphons. If you play this deck or something like it, I highly recommend trying TMI out against Andy with 3 Siphons and 3 Same Old things, or some other Siphon-fest deck. If you hate it, fine, go with Bastion. It's good too. But I've been in lots of situations where a, "Siphon, pay 3 to get through Bastion with a Corroder, get one back from my Desperado, you lose 5, I gain 10" situation could have been Yet Another TMI Trace.
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Ezio Auditore
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I've experimented with TMI and love it for Siphon protection as well but I've never been able to justify 3 in my deck and without 3 (and even with) it's spotty if you will have it to protect against a siphon.

If you can justify having TMI's in your deck against runners other than criminals, at the moment that means Atman decks and the the diehard Noise players, then I love this inclusion. If it's a 3 of in your deck just to combat Siphon, I'm not a big fan, you need 1 of and it protects 1 server.

If you have a decent cash flow like it seems you do, I do like Datapike's over Enigma's lately as it's an extra credit Atman decks need to pony up for rather than running on the last click and just breaking one subroutine. I initially didn't like the extra credit cost but starting to realize how much of an extra tax that single credit adds. Enigma does work better in decks that stay low on money and decks that can punish tags but I don't see this as a problem for your deck.
 
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Justin
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Against both Noise and KatMan, I like throwing a TMI on archives. Against the latter, they might not even bother checking it, because their only interest was a freebie run to stack Datasucker tokens with a credit. I've found that Noise stays fairly broke in general, and that KatMan has economic surges (and drains) that open up economic timing windows. By and large it's there for Siphons, but I have an easier time beating KatMan and a much easier time beating Noise anyway.
 
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Alex Rockwell
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TMI is indeed good at Account Siphon defense. Unfortunately its weak in most other cases.

For purposes of spreading out strengths, and because you dont want to draw more than one TMI, I'd swap a TMI for a Bastion.


Additionally, Draco is a great 1-of in Making News. (Or even more than 1 if you want). At str 0, it helps aginst Atman, for decks not running Rototurret.
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Justin
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I playtested with this a lot more yesterday, and I think Grim is leaving. On the upside, it did what it needed to do: trash a program when it was rezzed, and then annoy afterward. On the other hand, multi-Crypsis decks, KatMan with all of the Clone Chips and econ, etc. are able to recover sufficiently quickly that I found the scoring window it opened was far too narrow in exchange for the BP-pain (significant for Datasucker pounds). One semi-interesting thing is that it wouldn't change my mind at all if Grim was ETR. If it were a mass program destruction deck, maybe. The main thing I think I'll miss is the threat of it, rather than the it. Still running it in Jinteki.

So 1x Draco could shift into Grim's slot, and 1x Bastion could shift into a TMI slot because Draco is also pulling "TMI duty" (and works better on archives). I think one works.
 
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