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Subject: Superb!... but what expansions do I really need? rss

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Carlos Soto Power
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Hi geek fellas

I'm new with CCGs but I love the Star Wars theme and I'd like to add this game to my collection, so, I ask for advice from you, experienced players.

Taking into account that I'm not the kind of guy that expands a game more than once or twice, I don't plan to buy more than two expansions for this game. So, specifically speaking: What expansions do you think contribute more to the game? I know there's a expansion that makes it possible to play this game with 4 players, but I'd be perfectly happy playing this as a two player game.

So, I'd like to hear what you think about expansions but taking into account that the "4 players" part of Balance of the Force is not a "must have" to me, and that I'm trying to get the best from just one or two expansions, since I don't plan to get more.

I sincerely thank you for all your responses
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Personally for me, a bare minimum would be 2 core sets. After that, 2 copies of Edge of Darkness. Being able to have two copies of each objective set is invaluable.
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Drew Dallas
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Namrok wrote:
Personally for me, a bare minimum would be 2 core sets. After that, 2 copies of Edge of Darkness. Being able to have two copies of each objective set is invaluable.

Pretty much this, although I could see, if you are just playing at home, going with 1 core, 1 Edge of Darkness, and 1 of each of the hoth packs to have more card variety.
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Paul Brillantes
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I currently have 2 base, 1 Edge of Darkness and one of each of the Hoth packs.

I will likely pick up the multiplayer expansion and stop there.
 
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Darksbane wrote:
Namrok wrote:
Personally for me, a bare minimum would be 2 core sets. After that, 2 copies of Edge of Darkness. Being able to have two copies of each objective set is invaluable.

Pretty much this, although I could see, if you are just playing at home, going with 1 core, 1 Edge of Darkness, and 1 of each of the hoth packs to have more card variety.


Honestly even for casual play, which is all I do, I find single objective sets completely dissatisfying. The variance in the card draw is just off the charts. I've had sessions where I draw all my best units, and the other guy doesn't draw one unit. It's boring for me, and just punishing for them.
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Matt Lernout
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I'd go with two of the Core Set and two of Edge of Darkness. That will give you the solid foundation for all six factions.

Then I'd probably go Balance of the Force (which only needs one copy), just so the multiplayer options are there.

If 2x Core and 2x Edge of Darkness sounds like too much, and you aren't adverse to not fleshing out the Scum or Smuggler factions, I'd go either with 2x Core+Balance, or else Core+Edge+Balance (this last option has the most variety, but the games will feel extra random).

Don't touch any of the Force Packs. There is some great stuff in there, but it would be hard to cherry pick one or two without unbalancing factions.
 
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Micheal Keane
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Since you're playing super-casually, Edge of Darkness.
 
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Here is my opinion on order of purchase if I were to give advice to a new player who wanted to play casually and get a good experience. (Competitive? You'll get them all or tailor to the deck you want.)

1- Core set - Because, well, you need it.
2- Core set #2 - This will give your core decks consistency with 2x of all important objective sets.
3- Edge of Darkness - This will flesh out Smugglers and Scum decks finally.
4 - Edge of Darkness #2 - This will make your Smugglers and Scum decks consistent and immediately better.

And now the force packs. Lots of general additions to decks are in these packs, and I note a few cards/sets that are really useful for specific factions. If you don't care for that faction as much, you could skip around in this list. Only Desolation really should be considered "mandatory" at this time. Old Ben's Spirit is just that much of a benefit.

5- The Desolation of Hoth (FP1) - Old Ben's Spirit is a huge card in a Jedi deck. If you don't like Jedi, this drops quite a bit in this list. Probably the single most-needed card in all the FP.
6- Escape from Hoth (FP6) - A new Jedi Luke, a Rebel Han, and Dengar for Scum are all very interesting additions to their decks. Overall, maybe the most well-rounded Force Pack.
7- The Search for Skywalker (FP2) - Echo Caverns gives Smugglers a really crazy tool, and Jabba's Orders is nice for Scum, plus plenty of units elsewhere.
8- A Dark Time (FP3) - The Hunt for Solo is a great Scum objective set. Serve the Emperor is nice for a Sith Force Balance control deck.
9- Assault on Echo Base (FP4) - General additions everywhere.
10- The Battle of Hoth (FP5) - General additions; basically if you want more Hoth sets, Troopers, Walkers, Speeders.
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David Boeren
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LonerVamp wrote:
Here is my opinion on order of purchase if I were to give advice to a new player who wanted to play casually and get a good experience.

1- Core set - Because, well, you need it.
2- Core set #2 - This will give your core decks consistency with 2x of all important objective sets.
3- Edge of Darkness - This will flesh out Smugglers and Scum decks finally.
4 - Edge of Darkness #2 - This will make your Smugglers and Scum decks consistent and immediately better.


I agree with this. More consistency is higher priority than adding new (inconsistent) factions. But once you do add Edge of Darkness, you need a second one because having only 1 copy of a pod is frustrating.

After these, I would wait a bit. Play games, get to know the system better. By the time you're ready, the new multiplayer expansion will be out and you might want to get that before starting on the Hoth cycle. Note that you will only need *one* copy of all the Force Packs and also the MP expansion.

Finally, although all we've seen is previews, the new cycle looks a lot more exciting to me than Hoth. If you manage to last this long before buying more cards I would consider getting those first and Hoth second but that's just conjecture...
 
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Carlos Soto Power
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Yeah...

But what if I, definitely, don't plan to buy 2 copies of neither the core set, nor none of the expansions? Is this game still worth the investment?

The fact is: I come from games that are complete at themselves (such as Agricola and, of course I don't own two copies of it), so, to me results inconcebible to have to buy an extra copy of a game and, even worst, to buy a second copy of the same expansion...

All this appart, I thank you all for your responses.... but, how should I interpret them? Does it mean this game isn't for me, or/and that won't I be able to play and enjoy it without adding so many stuff?

It's sad 'cause I really LOVE this theme...
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Like you, I really, desperately wanted this game to be good with just a single core set. I toughed out a dozen games that way.

But honestly, if all you can buy is a single core set, I'd try a different game. A single core set, with 1 copy of each object set just feels like half a game. It didn't even satisfy me for casual play.

I had much better luck with the Core Sets for Warhammer Invasion and Lord of the Rings: The Card Game. Especially LotR actually. It's core set is fantastic.
 
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Bryce K. Nielsen
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As said, do 1 Core + 1 Edge of Darkness + 1 Balance of Force and have fun

-shnar
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Pauli Vinni
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2 core sets + 2 copies of Edge of Darkness + one Balance of Power.
This would be best for casual gaming. You can try with one Core and one Edge, but you will see those main characters so seldom, that it would not feel like Star Wars any more (in casual setting I mean).
This is very nice game for casual playing, because it is so easy to make your own deck. 5 minutes and you have a new deck. Super in casual environment!

Two Core sets and two Edge of Darknes allso allows you to have two boxes for cards. One for the dark side and one for light side, so both players can get a box of their own and make his own deck and play with it. Tweak a deck a little and then play again and after that change the sides. Very good for casual playing!

All the other sets include maximum amount of each card set, but you don't need those other expansions anyway. But if you do, it is better to buy the whole cycle of cards (6 expansions + deluxe), because they seems to belong together.

Don't worry about the "whole game" consept. it is not very good for card games in anyway :-) Agricola is not a cheap game with all expansions. If you like the setting this is very good game for casual plaing! And the basic set that you need is not very expensive and offers a lot of options! One reason that there are only one set of each card in core and edge is to allow a lot more variation to deck types you can use. Other alternative would be to hafve very limited core set and forse players to buy guite many expansions to allow this much variation to the game.
 
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Carlos Soto Power
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I understand your reasons guys, but it still annoys me to be "almost" obligated to buy a second core set and, even more, a second of EoD. Couldn't them put more copies of the same cards in the base game?


Hannibal_pjv wrote:
...Agricola is not a cheap game with all expansions. If you like the setting this is very good game for casual plaing! And the basic set that you need is not very expensive and offers a lot of options! One reason that there are only one set of each card in core and edge is to allow a lot more variation to deck types you can use. Other alternative would be to hafve very limited core set and forse players to buy guite many expansions to allow this much variation to the game.


I don't own a single expansion for Agricola, nor for Power Grid or Fury of Dracula, e.g, but those are still very good and replayable games!

Maybe just two core sets and nothing more? At least for now? Or maybe might be better to get the base + EoD and, if neccesary, add later a second copy of the core set?

I'm just a bit confused shake
 
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Drew Dallas
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What are you confused about?

You do understand this is a game where you construct a custom deck right? It isn't a board game. It is a card game in the vein of Magic or Pokemon (except not random).

The suggestion of 2x core and EoD sets are so you can do alitle deck construction and get multiple copies of the good cards like Vader and Solo in your deck. You don't have to buy the multiple copies to play but those of us who are more into card games like consistency in a well tuned deck. If you are OK with your games being alitle more random and swingy then a single copy should suit your needs.

 
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Bryce K. Nielsen
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FinrondFelagund wrote:
I understand your reasons guys, but it still annoys me to be "almost" obligated to buy a second core set and, even more, a second of EoD. Couldn't them put more copies of the same cards in the base game?

No! If they did that, then we wouldn't have nearly the variety of cards that we have. Either that, or the game would be twice as expensive, and probably not sell as well. "$90 for a card game?!? No way!" Even though if you buy 2 Core Sets, yes you're spending that much and more, it's the initial bite that's easier to take. I can buy 1 core set, try it out for a few fun, casual games and decide if it's really worth a second set or not.

I still say, buy 1 Core and 1 EoD, try it. If you really like it, you will want to buy another copy...

-shnar
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You can still play the game with just 1 core set, or 1 core+1 expansion. Nothing says you can't still play it.

You just won't have what many of us consider to be the best experience. For instance, a buddy of mine only has 1 copy of the core and expansion, and we played this weekend. He played as Scum and I went with Jedi.

a- In 3 games, he never drew a Boba Fett or Slave 1. They were in his deck, but just by sheer luck, he didn't get either one (1 in 50 chance by draw). You double your odds with 2 copies of those cards, such that you should always see them every game at least once. This is why we call it deck consistency when you have 2 copies of each objective set.

b- I have purchased everything. This puts me at a distinct advantage over him because my deck will be more consistent (2x Luke, 2x Obi wan, 2x Yoda). It's such that I actually gimp my decks to reflect how far he has bought into the game, otherwise it would not be nearly as fun. I run my decks against him as if I had only a core+expansion. I do actually keep the force pack objectives in, but they're so secondary anyway that it's not a ridiculous advantage there. Keep that advantage in mind if you play with others.

You can always do what you want, and 1 core set is a complete game, but it's not everything it *could* be. But it's still enough for a full experience.

I will also say that I actually like the thematics of having 2x of the objective sets. I play a Luke Skywalker first turn, and by turn 3 he gets blown away by something. Normally when a main character like that gets put into a discard pile, you won't see him again. But if I have another one in hand, BAM! he's back and it adds some drama, just like Han swooping back in at the last moment on the Death Star run. (Ok, granted, he didn't die beforehand, but he appeared to discard himself from the situation.)
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FinrondFelagund wrote:
I understand your reasons guys, but it still annoys me to be "almost" obligated to buy a second core set and, even more, a second of EoD. Couldn't them put more copies of the same cards in the base game?


This is pretty much how the LCGs play out right now. The main reason (it's not confirmed necessarily from Fantasy Flight Games, but I feel pretty confident in my answer) being...

1- This is really meant to be a standalone game, but there is more for those players who wish to pursue the game further, and watch it grow and change (aka a living card game). Nothing says you have to join up for the full ride, and FFG provides a complete game for everyone to enjoy right from the starting core set. (Granted, Smugglers and Scum factions are pretty limited, but you take what you can get I guess.)

1a- If they included full suites of the cards, it would make initial deck creation somewhat confusing. FFG has decided to take much of the initial daunting task of deckbuilding and make it pretty simple. You want a Jedi deck? Grab all the Jedi objectives sets plus this one neutral set and you're good to go. It's hard to get easier than that, while still calling it a card game with deckbuilding opportunity.

Also just know that your hangup on the full experience vs buying multiples is not just you. It's a very common issue that has been discussed, and I think it's at least safer right now to build the LCG community by making accessible core sets for new players and if people want to really get deeper, they can choose to do so and buy in further. It is what it is, and they do need to make money.
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Don't think of it having to buy two copies, think of it as they split the product in half to allow a cheap(er) trial version for people who weren't sure they'd like it. Two cores is the complete game, and if that's too expensive for you, well, let's face it, this isn't the hobby for you in the first place.
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FinrondFelagund wrote:
Yeah...

But what if I, definitely, don't plan to buy 2 copies of neither the core set, nor none of the expansions? Is this game still worth the investment?

The fact is: I come from games that are complete at themselves (such as Agricola and, of course I don't own two copies of it), so, to me results inconcebible to have to buy an extra copy of a game and, even worst, to buy a second copy of the same expansion...

All this appart, I thank you all for your responses.... but, how should I interpret them? Does it mean this game isn't for me, or/and that won't I be able to play and enjoy it without adding so many stuff?

It's sad 'cause I really LOVE this theme...


You can't compare games like Agricola to games like Star Wars: The Card Game. The former is a board game while the latter is like Magic: The Gathering without the random booster packs.
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Brendon Russell
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FinrondFelagund wrote:
The fact is: I come from games that are complete at themselves (such as Agricola and, of course I don't own two copies of it), so, to me results inconcebible to have to buy an extra copy of a game and, even worst, to buy a second copy of the same expansion...
Using coolstuffinc.com prices as an example:
1 copy of Agricola - $47.49
2 copies of Star Wars core set - $53.98

So putting aside the psychological effect of buying 2 copies of the same thing, there's not a lot of difference. Just think of 2 x core set as the real base game for Star Wars.
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LonerVamp wrote:
You can still play the game with just 1 core set, or 1 core+1 expansion. Nothing says you can't still play it.

You just won't have what many of us consider to be the best experience. For instance, a buddy of mine only has 1 copy of the core and expansion, and we played this weekend. He played as Scum and I went with Jedi.

Now I think I understand better the game system. It sounds pretty ugly to be unable to find that specific character card in your deck... Taking that into account: could it be possible to houserule this game for players owning just one core set? Just a pair of ideas to allow players to find specific cards more frequently:

1. Mixing all the character cards in just one half of the deck, shuffling the other half and, finally, putting the half with character cards at the top and the other half at the bottom, to form a "not so dependant on luck" deck. Would it be too difficult to make this?

2. Giving players an "explore your deck" action, as in Race for the Galaxy, maybe?

Just some ideas from someone who has not played this game yet. Forgive me if this is out of place here blush
 
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Carlos Soto Power
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The Gas wrote:
Two cores is the complete game, and if that's too expensive for you, well, let's face it, this isn't the hobby for you in the first place.


Hehehe... you just made me LoL

If that were the case I wouldn't be here, at first... Moreover, I'm posting my doubts here 'cause I still don't own any LCG or CCG, but that doesn't mean I'm not interested on such games and, of course, I need to grab some info before throw me blindly into the pool

Finrod
 
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scwont wrote:
So putting aside the psychological effect of buying 2 copies of the same thing...
Hehe, I'm a psychologist and completely agree with your comment... Definitely, kind of a psychological illusion here surprise

laugh
 
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Just buy Edge of Darkness. Then you have similar starting decks to the core set for the smuggler & scum factions. Play with them for a while and decide if you want more consistent decks (a second core or EoD) or if you want more variety (the hoth cycle force packs).
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