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Subject: Reason.com says ultimately it's Obama's fault rss

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Boaty McBoatface
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Well it must be true then.
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Tobias Strobe
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Well, that settles it. It's all Obama's fault.

I'm pretty surprised than an unbiased and apolitical source like Reason.com would blame the president. Shocked, really.
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Boaty McBoatface
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Drew1365 wrote:
That's a fine argument against the points raised in the piece. You are to be commended for your analysis.

So how could he have 'forced' congress to pass a budget and not been seen as King Obama? Your system of government was set up to prevent the president being able to force congress to do anything (and visa vera).
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Donald
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Quote:
Indeed, the shutdown is happening because the federal government doesn't have a budget for fiscal 2014, which starts today


After that, the House and the Senate are supposed to hash out differences (always with plenty of presidential input and noodging) and then come up with a document for the president to sign. That didn't happen for all sorts of reason.

House Republicans were in no mood to do their most basic function.


Sounds like a failure of the House and Congress as well.


Quote:
But Barack Obama...he's a different beast, isn't he?

failing to kick the asses of sorry little functionaries like John Boehner and Harry Reid to pass budgets on a regular basis.

If you had forced the budget process..

You lost total control of the federal government...

Figure out how to fix the impasse ..



So the way out of this is an unconstitutional Presidential power grab? Usurp Congressional power at the expense of popular will and the rule of law? Alrighty then!

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J
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Hey Drew, it was the Republicans that refused to let the budget process continue? They are the ones that blocked the conference committee.

Are you purposefully ignoring this because it is an inconvenient truth?
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Boaty McBoatface
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jmilum wrote:
Hey Drew, it was the Republicans that refused to let the budget process continue? They are the ones that blocked the conference committee.

Are you purposefully ignoring this because it is an inconvenient truth?
No, reason is.
 
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J
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Drew1365 wrote:
That's a fine argument against the points raised in the piece. You are to be commended for your analysis.


Lol.

Drew1365 wrote:
Because Jon Stewart is so unbiased.

Drew1365 wrote:
Billythehut wrote:
Your awareness that he has an opinion isn’t an argument against the points he makes.


Doesn't matter. He will make points that support his biases like he always does.

Hypocrite is hypocritical. News at 11.
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Drew,

Why are you so upset that the US government was shut down today?
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Boaty McBoatface
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Drew1365 wrote:
The Mouth of Sauron says that Obama bears no responsibility at all.



Quote:
Q: Does the president bear any responsibility whatsoever for what’s going on, this mess?

MR. CARNEY: I’m not sure what you mean. I mean, the president –

Q: (Inaudible) — bear any — does he have any blame for the government shutdown?

MR. CARNEY: The president’s president of the United States, and it is his responsibility to try to work with Congress in a –

Q: And that hasn’t –

MR. CARNEY: — spirit of compromise.

Well, he’s — look, has he or has he not put forward a compromise budget proposal? The answer is yes.

Q: But does he bear any responsibility? It’s a simple question. Does he bear any responsibility.

MR. CARNEY: He certainly did not vote to shut the government down. And if that’s what you’re asking, no, he did not vote the shut the government down. The Republicans did.

Q: No, I’m asking if he bears any responsibility.

MR. CARNEY: Jon (sp), he did not — Republicans in Congress chose to shut the government down.

The option to keep it open was available to them. It’s an option that the majority of the House of Representatives supports, a bipartisan majority.

Q: But has the president failed to create an environment where this stuff doesn’t happen?

MR. CARNEY: Really? By having multiple meetings and dinners –

Q: I’m asking.

MR. CARNEY: No. He’s had multiple meetings –

Q: So he’s done nothing wrong at all. This is all the Republicans’ doing on their own –

MR. CARNEY: Well, Jon you can, you know, do an essay or decide for yourself and make those judgments.
Of course they would say that, this proves?
 
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Rich Shipley
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Quote:
And then...nothing happened.


Actually, the Senate has tried to go to conference with the House on the budget ~18 times since March, but each time it has been blocked by the usual idiots (Paul, Cruz, etc.)

Our government only works if the people we elect want it to. Too many people have decided to vote for people who will break government if they get the chance. These two terrorists want to be President. They would certainly lose, but it is pretty scary that 40% would probably still vote for them.
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jeremy cobert
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you are a racist and it's George Bush's fault !!!!!
 
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MGK
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Jonathan Chait wrote:
The day is young, but the least intelligent thing said about the shutdown — and we're including man-on-the-street interviews — has to be this column by Reason’s Nick Gillespie blaming President Obama. Gillespie’s argument, to the extent that it is possible to detect one amid the poseur hand-waving, runs as follows:

1. The House and Senate didn’t meet to negotiate the differences between their budgets. (Gillespie: "that didn't happen for all sorts of reasons.")

2. Obama is to blame for this because he "compounded legislative issues by failing to kick the asses of sorry little functionaries like John Boehner and Harry Reid to pass budgets on a regular basis."

3. Ergo, Obama is to blame. ("You lost total control of the federal government and thus the ability to not offer anything. Get over it.")

A couple of points. First, the lack of a conference to negotiate the House and Senate budgets didn’t happen for "all sorts of reasons." It happened for one reason: Democrats pleaded to hold one and Republicans refused. Senate Democrats have spammed my e-mail in-box pleading for a budget conference on a near-daily basis. House Republicans refused because their strategy is not to negotiate through regular order but to use the threat of a shutdown and debt default to leverage unilateral concessions. This isn’t my partisan accusation. They said this themselves, repeatedly!

Second, blaming the president for failing to "kick the asses" of leaders of the opposing party is a really dumb way to think about government, and especially so for a libertarian. Your analysis is that the president needs to compel the opposing party to accept policies it doesn’t like? That’s a libertarian analysis?

Third, Gillespie’s entire rant is beside the point, because the lack of a negotiated budget is not the cause of a shutdown. Budget conferences are designed to set long-term federal budget policy. Keeping the government open doesn’t require that. You just need to pass a “continuing resolution.” That’s it. Pass the CR, and the government stays open, and then you can either negotiate or not negotiate the federal budget.

It’s continually amazing to me that this publication publishes commentary on public policy by a writer who lacks even a rudimentary understanding of the policy process.
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Tobias Strobe
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Drew1365 wrote:
That's a fine argument against the points raised in the piece. You are to be commended for your analysis.


Yeah, that was a stupid argument I made. Just pointing out someone's obvious bias is just plain silly.

Drew1365, at 10:26 AM, today wrote:

Because Jon Stewart is so unbiased.


Oh, but that was LIBERAL bias, so I see why you're not being inconsistent.
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I love the hard hitting analysis in the link.

"President Obama was two months late with his document and it was widely dissed by liberals and conservatives alike for a wide-ranging variety of reasons."

It was widely dissed? Wait, tell us more.

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Rich Shipley
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Drew1365 wrote:
she2 wrote:
I love the hard hitting analysis in the link.

"President Obama was two months late with his document and it was widely dissed by liberals and conservatives alike for a wide-ranging variety of reasons."

It was widely dissed? Wait, tell us more.



The White House budget has routinely gotten a unanimous NO vote from both houses of Congress. I don't believe this year was an exception.


It is a long-standing tradition:

Congress Pronounces Reagan Budget Doa
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Dave G
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Ilthuain wrote:
Drew1365 wrote:
That's a fine argument against the points raised in the piece. You are to be commended for your analysis.


Yeah, that was a stupid argument I made. Just pointing out someone's obvious bias is just plain silly.

Drew1365, at 10:26 AM, today wrote:

Because Jon Stewart is so unbiased.


Oh, but that was LIBERAL bias, so I see why you're not being inconsistent.


If he ever responds to this I'll give you 20 gg.
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David Hoffman
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Arguing that Republicans are serious about governing right now has got to feel like being the last kid in class who insists Santa Claus is real.
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J
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djgutierrez77 wrote:
If he ever responds to this I'll give you 20 gg.

Drew, BJ, and Tripp don't respond to inconvenient statements or questions. It would wreck their worldview.
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Chris B
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For the first time in her life. My wife was pissed enough to call our representative. When she found out that Army wasn't going to be able to travel to Oxford for her opening match this weekend.

I was a little proud. I've called our rep or senator at least once or twice a year for the last ten years or so. Never got anywhere with it though.
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Can anyone explain what the author means by "ultimately"?
 
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It's ultimate! Like, bitchin' dude.
 
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Chad Ellis
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Drew1365 wrote:
If you had forced the budget process, most Americans would never have learned of the debt limit, whose increase you used to rail against so eloquently.


It's hard to take an article seriously when it says things like, "He's the deciderer, right, the top dog?" But this sentence here best sums up how removed the author is from reality.

Whether you think it's a good approach or a bad one, the Republicans deliberately set out to use the debt ceiling as political leverage. To claim that all Obama had to do was "see the process through" or "force" it or something is to assume that the GOP just happened to come up with the debt ceiling tactic because it fell in their laps.
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Bat Profile
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jmilum wrote:
djgutierrez77 wrote:
If he ever responds to this I'll give you 20 gg.

Drew, BJ, and Tripp don't respond to inconvenient statements or questions. It would wreck their worldview.


"World View" is quite generous considering they can only see to the end of their noses.



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Drew1365 wrote:
Let Us Be Clear: Obama Deserves Chief Responsibility for Gov't Shutdown.

Quote:
After that, the House and the Senate are supposed to hash out differences (always with plenty of presidential input and noodging) and then come up with a document for the president to sign. That didn't happen for all sorts of reason.

Drew's posts make a lot more sense once you figure out that he's actually the most enthusiastic Obama supporter on BGG. Think about it--how many times have his posts convinced you of the opposite of what he claimed to be saying?
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