Joe Trigiani
United States
Blairstown
New Jersey
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I don't think the mutineer is enough of a detriment. I haven't played many games but someone could always use the press room or play the mutiny cards if it benefits them to stay out of the brig.

I propose for 5/7 player games with a mutineer and cylon leader dealing 1 cylon motive at the start of the game then dealing the rest normally. This increases the odds of the cylon leader helping the 1 or 2 other cylons. There is still a chance they will join the humans but they at least have to play neutral until sleeper. If they get 2 cylon motives to start they can go all out to try to win before sleeper.
 
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Mindy G
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Portland
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So start the game with 3?
 
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Joe Trigiani
United States
Blairstown
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No, still draw the same amount, just make sure the first one is cylon. It might not make much of a difference but it is less likely they will draw 3 human motives if they must draw 1 cylon.
 
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Brian
United States
Nassau County
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Given a Cylon Leader that starts with one Cylon motive card:

There are 35 combinations of the remaining motive cards.

37.14% of the time the Cylon Leader would end up with three or more Cylon motive cards.

51.43% of the time the Cylon Leader have one two of each.

11.43% of the time the Cylon Leader would have three Human motive cards.

I don't like this variant because I feel like it would put the Cylon Leader at an even greater disadvantage. If I played in such a game, given those odds I'd instantly be hostile to the Cylon Leader. If he was in the 37.14%, then now his job is harder because he lost benefit of the doubt. If he was unlucky and was in the 11.43%, then he's likely to be annoyed because the humans are hostile to him.

Regarding him having to hedge his bets, 42.86% of the time he'll start with two Cylon motive cards so most of the time he can go full-on Cylon at the start of the game.

I have a simple set of variants for 5/7-player games.
1) Don't use the Cylon Leaders in 5-player games.
2) Don't play 7-player games.
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Joe Trigiani
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lankyb wrote:
Don't use the Cylon Leaders in 5-player games.

You're probably right. If we are going to make it more likely that the cylon leader is allied with the 1 other cylon they might as well be a full cylon 3 vs. 2
 
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trigiani wrote:
I don't think the mutineer is enough of a detriment. I haven't played many games but someone could always use the press room or play the mutiny cards if it benefits them to stay out of the brig.

I propose for 5/7 player games with a mutineer and cylon leader dealing 1 cylon motive at the start of the game then dealing the rest normally. This increases the odds of the cylon leader helping the 1 or 2 other cylons. There is still a chance they will join the humans but they at least have to play neutral until sleeper. If they get 2 cylon motives to start they can go all out to try to win before sleeper.
I'm still more convinced that having 1 or 2 pre-sleeper cylons is still the biggest factor in how soon the humans lose.

No1's used the Press Room in our games (I'll also admit that I've only played less than a dozen Day games. Also, someone has to "waste" an action at the Press Room. In my last game where there was only 1 CAC the whole game, so that would've worked out well for them
 
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Pasi Ojala
Finland
Tampere
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Get the Imperial Assault Campaign module for Vassal from http://www.vassalengine.org/wiki/Module:Star_Wars:_Imperial_Assault
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ackmondual wrote:
I'm still more convinced that having 1 or 2 pre-sleeper cylons is still the biggest factor in how soon the humans lose.

This.

We have played 5-player games with CL and Mutineer, and when the Mutineer (and Cylon) appears has big effect on the game. Just like having two pre-sleeper cylons, having Mutineer post-sleeper swings the game into the other direction. (Happened to me when I was the lone cylon post-sleeper. I had to execute someone to pull the Mutineer out of the deck. Although I lost, the game was still a fairly close call.)

With that few games you are seemingly guessing about the impact of the Mutineer. The game is all about actions, and playing the Mutiny cards or getting rid of them using Press Room takes actions. The effects of the mutiny cards are normally zero-sum (except in certain situations), so playing them costs actions. You are essentially making one player a card-drawing machine, which does make the game harder for humans.

 
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Robert Stewart
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In PBF372, as Mutineer Starbuck, with Major Tom filtering the Mutiny deck for all he was worth, my sitting in an Assault Raptor most of the game meant that a lot of the time, the inefficiency of being Mutineer and wanting to play Mutiny to stay out of the Brig cancelled out with the inefficiency of my wanting to stay in space to keep getting my extra actions, but not really having good actions to use them for - it was pretty much the best possible setup for a Mutineer, so I wouldn't take it as evidence of the Mutineer's impact (or lack thereof) under more general circumstances...
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