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Subject: Clarifications about stability rss

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Vladimir Shlapakov
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Hi!

So, as I understand, stability prevents from losing resources in war. For example: if I have stability at 5 and must lose 5 resources, I do not lose anything, just 1 victory point for war.

First question: do I need to reduce stability in this case (for saved resource amount), or I just have it and that's ok?

Second question: does stability help the same way in negative events?
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Koen
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first question: no, you don't reduce your stability.

2nd: seems to apply also for events, see page 8: "stability mitigates the effects of War and negative Events".



*edited after doublechecking the rules regarding 2nd question*
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Vladimir Shlapakov
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Thank You for quick answer!
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Koen
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Nobi wrote:
first question: no, you don't reduce your stability.

2nd: seems to apply also for events, see page 8: "stability mitigates the effects of War and negative Events".



*edited after doublechecking the rules regarding 2nd question*


after editing my answer I noticed that one of the designers already gave the original answer a thumbs up (saying that stability doesn't mitigate the effect of Events), but what I found on p8 contradicts that..

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Rustan Håkansson
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Stability only reduces the resource loss of wars. They never reduce the resource loss of events. So first question, correct, only 1 VP. Second question: no.

The text on page 8 is a general note on what stability is good for game-wise and what it represents thematically, the sentence after the one quoted talks about "contentment and civil preparedness for war". The direct intention of the "negative Events" part is that having stability allows you to avoid events that affect the player with the lowest stability.

However I can definitely see how this formulation can be remembered and cause confusion. I have added this clarification to the notes:

"Stability mitigates the effects of War and negative Events and permits the growth of the population." -> "Stability mitigates the effects of War, permits the growth of the population and is important for Events."
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Teik Chooi Oh
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Can I clarify, does negative Stability also amplify the loss in War? E.g. If lost war and cost is 5 gold, will a negative 4 stability means paying 9 gold or just 5 gold? (since rules clearly state how it mitigates effects by reducing costs but it does not say it increases cost).
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chooi wrote:
Can I clarify, does negative Stability also amplify the loss in War? E.g. If lost war and cost is 5 gold, will a negative 4 stability means paying 9 gold or just 5 gold? (since rules clearly state how it mitigates effects by reducing costs but it does not say it increases cost).


it does not say it so it does not increase it => you pay only the 5 gold and loose 1 VP.
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Teik Chooi Oh
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powerwis wrote:
chooi wrote:
Can I clarify, does negative Stability also amplify the loss in War? E.g. If lost war and cost is 5 gold, will a negative 4 stability means paying 9 gold or just 5 gold? (since rules clearly state how it mitigates effects by reducing costs but it does not say it increases cost).


it does not say it so it does not increase it => you pay only the 5 gold and loose 1 VP.


great. So my take a person from Stability first 4 turns with -12 (got to -14 with 2 Immortal warriors) was not illegal, as we did not count negative stability to war losses. Seem powerful as I won the game comfortably, and even finished highest stability (at 0).

EDIT: from another thread:
from the rules (in production phase) :
All nations in revolt (with negative Stability) lose 1 Book
per negative point and also 1 VP regardless of how many
negative points they have.

so whilst I may not add war resource loss, I will lose books, so this strategy not that viable!
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Lucio Pierobon
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Hi all, I'd like to summarize the effects of stability:

Positive stability:
reduces the effect of wars that might be affecting your civilization.

Negative stability:
place you anyway (not depending on how low your stability is) as "Least Stability" for what concerns events;
during the production phase, you lose as many books as you have negative stability AND 1 VP.

Please confirm this and let me know if there are any other effects related to it.

Thanks in advance
Lucio
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Paul Oakley
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Iago71 wrote:
Hi all, I'd like to summarize the effects of stability:

Positive stability:
reduces the effect of wars that might be affecting your civilization.

Negative stability:
place you anyway (not depending on how low your stability is) as "Least Stability" for what concerns events;
during the production phase, you lose as many books as you have negative stability AND 1 VP.

Please confirm this and let me know if there are any other effects related to it.

Thanks in advance
Lucio


This is correct. In addition, it is also the tie-breaker when determining turn order if two players have the same military strength.

One related minor point to which I'd like clarification myself:

Player A and player B have the same military strength and player A has -1 stability while player B has -2 stability. They are both considered to have the "least" stability as they are both negative. In this situation, is the tie broken in favour of the player order in the previous round, as both stabilities are tied at "least", or does player A go first because he has one higher stability?
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Thisisnotasmile wrote:
Iago71 wrote:
Hi all, I'd like to summarize the effects of stability:

Positive stability:
reduces the effect of wars that might be affecting your civilization.

Negative stability:
place you anyway (not depending on how low your stability is) as "Least Stability" for what concerns events;
during the production phase, you lose as many books as you have negative stability AND 1 VP.

Please confirm this and let me know if there are any other effects related to it.

Thanks in advance
Lucio


This is correct. In addition, it is also the tie-breaker when determining turn order if two players have the same military strength.

One related minor point to which I'd like clarification myself:

Player A and player B have the same military strength and player A has -1 stability while player B has -2 stability. They are both considered to have the "least" stability as they are both negative. In this situation, is the tie broken in favour of the player order in the previous round, as both stabilities are tied at "least", or does player A go first because he has one higher stability?


rules : "In the case
of a tie, higher Stability acts as a tiebreaker. If there is
still a tie, the order between the tied players from the
previous round remains."

so clearly for me it means that the guy with -1 has higher stability (but is not official of course).
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Kim Choy
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powerwis wrote:
Thisisnotasmile wrote:
Iago71 wrote:
Hi all, I'd like to summarize the effects of stability:

Positive stability:
reduces the effect of wars that might be affecting your civilization.

Negative stability:
place you anyway (not depending on how low your stability is) as "Least Stability" for what concerns events;
during the production phase, you lose as many books as you have negative stability AND 1 VP.

Please confirm this and let me know if there are any other effects related to it.

Thanks in advance
Lucio


This is correct. In addition, it is also the tie-breaker when determining turn order if two players have the same military strength.

One related minor point to which I'd like clarification myself:

Player A and player B have the same military strength and player A has -1 stability while player B has -2 stability. They are both considered to have the "least" stability as they are both negative. In this situation, is the tie broken in favour of the player order in the previous round, as both stabilities are tied at "least", or does player A go first because he has one higher stability?


rules : "In the case
of a tie, higher Stability acts as a tiebreaker. If there is
still a tie, the order between the tied players from the
previous round remains."

so clearly for me it means that the guy with -1 has higher stability (but is not official of course).

From page 19: All nations with negative Stability are considered to tie for lowest Stability.

Seems clear that all players with negative stability are tied, therefore turn order would remain the same.
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Rustan Håkansson
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All players in revolt count as lowest and equal, so no change in turn order for those with equal strength that are also in revolt. This is true for a player that just completed Versailles as well.
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C.A. Lambrecht
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Do you keep track of the negative stability past the infinite mark? Do you lose ALL of your books if you are on that space during the production phase?

Great game BTW!
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Kim Choy
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Flatlander Fox wrote:
Do you keep track of the negative stability past the infinite mark? Do you lose ALL of your books if you are on that space during the production phase?

Great game BTW!

The negative infinity symbol was a design choice/space constraint. You should always keep track of the exact amount of negative stability and lose books accordingly.

P.S. Strategically, don't put yourself in this position!
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