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Subject: Why DreadBall caused me to drop support for Mars Attacks rss

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Bobby Warren
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Mantic sent out a private message on Kickstarter asking at least some of the people who stopped backing the Mars Attacks Kickstarter what they could do better to get me back as a supporter. I responded and thought I would share:

Quote:
I dropped for several reasons. The first time I dropped was because the pledge levels were disjointed. I came back when they were cleaned up and the DreadBall team was added. I left again and will likely not support another Mantic Kickstarter because of issues with the DreadBall rewards.

1. Metals instead of plastic. I never wanted metal figures and will likely never use them. I ended up paying a good chunk of extra change for something I will never use. My previous experience with Mantic's metal bits, the Enforcer's arms and weapons, left a bad taste in my mouth. Also the sheer size of some of the DreadBall figures means they would have been a little top-heavy and unstable in plastic and look to be useless on the game board in metal. Since we can't get a guarantee of what materials are used for the figures, I can't back it.

2. Not getting the season 2 upgrade packs. Not a huge deal until local stores started getting them in. I wouldn't be bothered if mine were on the way and I was getting them within a reasonable amount of time, but not getting them because orders were higher than expected while the retailers get them is unacceptable.

3. Packing issues with teams. Season 1 had the issue where the Forge Fathers and Veer-myn teams were packed 10 to a bag. It didn't affect me, but set a trend. In season 2 the Z'zor were mis-packed so we didn't receive complete teams. (Aren't the replacement Jacks supposed to come with the season 2 upgrades – another miss.)

4. Failure to have the hard plastic Enforcers in the Deadzone shipment. Not a big deal in and of itself, but another indication that maybe too much has been taken on at once.

5. Lack of response to e-mails. Not just to me, but I see several people complaining about a lack of response to issues and questions about DreadBall on the Kickstarter page and Boardgame Geek, while it appears that Deadzone and Mars Attacks are getting all the attention. I e-mailed Tim King with a couple of issues late on Sunday and on Monday morning (Arizona time) and haven't heard anything back from him, but I am getting constant e-mails about the Mars Attacks campaign.

It boils down to the impression that Mantic is more interested in meeting deadlines than getting the product right and to their backers.


As an FYI, my issues with the metal bits for the Enforcers for Warpath were that the sword and pistol arm parts are poorly cut and do not go together well. The heavy weapons which are multiple parts do not align with the plastic bodies they are supposed to fit on to.
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Mike Gingold
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I wish I received this email from Mantic so I can give a similar reply. Mantic has really dropped the ball.
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Bobby Warren
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Mikeg99 wrote:
I wish I received this email from Mantic so I can give a similar reply. Mantic has really dropped the ball.

They have to like me better than you.
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J Ry
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That's a big bummer.

For myself I've had mostly good experiences with their customer service.
But I've been dealing with Sarah mainly.
And Tim on occasion.

I can understand the issues with the metal bits.
I wasnt happy about them in Dreadball either.
I have yet to assemble them to see how it effects gameplay.
Hopefully not much.

And Ifforgot the zzor issues.
I wonder if they ever did sort that out.

For Mars attacks, I'm on the fence.
I'm in as of now Cuz I like what I see.
But there is a chance I'll be backing out of it.
Mainly due to the consistent decrease the last few days.
 
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Jake Rose
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Clearly you have to do what you think right. And though I get the annoyance with the metal/restic mix, Mantic has said Mars Attacks will use the type of plastic used for the Gears of War game figures.
 
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Bobby Warren
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ropya wrote:
And Ifforgot the zzor issues.
I wonder if they ever did sort that out.

I dunno. I didn't get my season two upgrade packs.

jakecarol wrote:
Clearly you have to do what you think right. And though I get the annoyance with the metal/restic mix, Mantic has said Mars Attacks will use the type of plastic used for the Gears of War game figures.

The overarching issue is their lack of quality control for meeting deadlines. The secondary issue is trusting that they will be able to follow-through on their promises. I don't think there is any malice on their part, but they seem to be over-extended and may have made additions to the campaigns without fully-researching the possibilities. The latest example is their issues with the hard plastic Enforcers in the Deadzone.

I'm not stopping buying Mantic games because I do like them and their games, I just can't see backing a Kickstarter by them again.
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Kristoff Bergenholm
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I, too, was not happy with the metal substitution in Dreadball. I bitched about multi-part metal models, were told a majority were single-piece castings, and then every one I received was a multi-piece figure.

I'm still waiting on a response about missing figures from their first Kings of War project.
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Charles Silbernagel
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Good for you Bobby. I've backed Deadzone and Dreadball, and overall have been happy with things to date. I too had forgotten about the Z'zor shipment not containing enough figures to field a proper team, but only because I had so many other figures to work with that it didn't bother me too much. However, had I been really keen on building and playing that team right away I know I'd have been much more upset.

I'm a little tired of getting emails about Mars Attacks too. I've already given Mantic almost $1000 between DB and DZ. You'd think that'd be enough. While there are some nice figures in the Mars Attacks campaign, I'm simply not interested and don't really see a way to tell them to PFO because I neither need or want them.
 
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Jake Rose
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Obsidian3d wrote:


I'm a little tired of getting emails about Mars Attacks too. I've already given Mantic almost $1000 between DB and DZ. You'd think that'd be enough. While there are some nice figures in the Mars Attacks campaign, I'm simply not interested and don't really see a way to tell them to PFO because I neither need or want them.


Feeds animal almost 1000 goodies.

Acts surprised and upset when animal nudges his hand for more goodies.

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Robert Ehlers
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It seems to me that Mantic has taken on too much at once and customer service, quality, and not meeting expectations is the result.

Hopefully just some growing pains for them right now that will be worked through in time.

I am so glad I didn't back this project, as the metal minis would have made me quite unhappy. I also don't appreciate the continual marketing spam for buy more buy more as my 'thank you' from companies after I invest in them. Perhaps standard operating procedure, charities and other stores do the same, but that doesn't mean it won't stop me from supporting them in the future to avoid being hassled.

 
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Michael Off The Shelf Board Game Reviews
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Bobby4th wrote:
ropya wrote:
And Ifforgot the zzor issues.
I wonder if they ever did sort that out.

I dunno. I didn't get my season two upgrade packs.

jakecarol wrote:
Clearly you have to do what you think right. And though I get the annoyance with the metal/restic mix, Mantic has said Mars Attacks will use the type of plastic used for the Gears of War game figures.

The overarching issue is their lack of quality control for meeting deadlines. The secondary issue is trusting that they will be able to follow-through on their promises. I don't think there is any malice on their part, but they seem to be over-extended and may have made additions to the campaigns without fully-researching the possibilities. The latest example is their issues with the hard plastic Enforcers in the Deadzone.

I'm not stopping buying Mantic games because I do like them and their games, I just can't see backing a Kickstarter by them again.


I am ignorant I guess and I am/was/are/wutevah backer for Dreadball and Deadzone, what issues are those 2 games having?
 
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Tim McCormley
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Bobby4th wrote:
It boils down to the impression that Mantic is more interested in meeting deadlines than getting the product right and to their backers.

I can sympathize with your perspective.

Personally, I had a very different experience, although I confess the packaging of the figures was a little rugged. It was hard to tell what I was getting, and I wasn't even aware of any missing/mispacked figures. Also, I agree that some of the figures were poorly designed. The Skittersneak Stealer figures in particular are a little too much. They take up too much space on the game board.

As to customer service, I also had a very different experience. I got extremely timely and regular updates to my pledge. The only delay I had in a shipment was due to a shipping mistake that Mantic instantaneously corrected. The original figures eventually showed up, and Mantic told me to keep the extra figures, rather than have me pay the cost of shipping them back.

I'm happy enough with Mantic products to have purchased "Dreadball Ultimate," which, again, arrived without any noticeable delays or defects in the product.

Tim
 
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Shawn Grubaugh
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Bobby4th wrote:
The latest example is their issues with the hard plastic Enforcers in the Deadzone.




In all fairness they did say it was because they were not up to the standard they wanted and were including free Enforcers with first shipments and will send the Hard plastic ones when up to standards.
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J Ry
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lotsokids wrote:
Bobby4th wrote:
The latest example is their issues with the hard plastic Enforcers in the Deadzone.




In all fairness they did say it was because they were not up to the standard they wanted and were including free Enforcers with first shipments and will send the Hard plastic ones when up to standards.


Is is an example of what I'm used to with mantic.
They always make it right in the end. As least by me.

Nothing in concrete in life.
Especially with ks.

But regarding the metal Dreadball minis, I understood that there was some kind of alternate offer if you really didn't like them that you just had to contact them regarding it.
Unless I misunderstood?
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Bobby Warren
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lotsokids wrote:
Bobby4th wrote:
The latest example is their issues with the hard plastic Enforcers in the Deadzone.


In all fairness they did say it was because they were not up to the standard they wanted and were including free Enforcers with first shipments and will send the Hard plastic ones when up to standards.

True, but I would think a company which made it's mark with hard plastic molds would be more sure of their ability to produce something and get it done.

I am not done buying Mantic games, just backing their Kickstarters.

Their packing of the DreadBall packages is also a minor issue. I don't see why grouping things like the MVPs into bags wouldn't make packing easier and also inventorying the rewards easier for us.

I am surprised at how many backers the project has lost the few days.

http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/1744629938/mars-attacks-the...

ropya wrote:
But regarding the metal Dreadball minis, I understood that there was some kind of alternate offer if you really didn't like them that you just had to contact them regarding it.
Unless I misunderstood?

Really? I would like to do this.
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Bobby Warren
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armor_11 wrote:
As to customer service, I also had a very different experience. I got extremely timely and regular updates to my pledge.

I don't doubt that my issues will be handled. However, the delays in getting responses is probably because they have just finished shipping out part of a large Kickstarter (DreadBall), prepping to ship out another (Deadzone), while having another going on now (Mars Attacks). Plus I bet they have Loka getting ready to ship soon and wonder if they have some Kings of War they are dealing with as well.

They are too stretched out. Other companies have grown too fast and needed time to get their staffing levels and business assets to the right level to maintain their level of business. I really hope Mantic gets through everything without having a major issues.
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Ted Swalwell
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Bobby4th wrote:


ropya wrote:
But regarding the metal Dreadball minis, I understood that there was some kind of alternate offer if you really didn't like them that you just had to contact them regarding it.
Unless I misunderstood?

Really? I would like to do this.


I too would be interested in this - does anyone have any more details?
 
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Jake Rose
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My understanding is they will allow you to return the metals, and will ship you restic versions when they are available, along with 'extras' to help even out the fact you paid return shipping.
 
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Mike Gingold
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jakecarol wrote:
My understanding is they will allow you to return the metals, and will ship you restic versions when they are available, along with 'extras' to help even out the fact you paid return shipping.


They are not making restic versions of the season 3 metals. They have said that the upgrade packs will always be metal.
 
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Bobby Warren
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Mikeg99 wrote:
They are not making restic versions of the season 3 metals. They have said that the upgrade packs will always be metal.

Mike,

I think the regular players are the same poses and I bet they would send you those in restic. I suspect they would probably want you to keep the prone markers and the Keepers, though that is just a guess.

Bobby4th wrote:
armor_11 wrote:
As to customer service, I also had a very different experience. I got extremely timely and regular updates to my pledge.

I don't doubt that my issues will be handled.

Tim got back to me after I sent a follow-up and copied Stewart (who is out of the office) and then Sarah.
 
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Mike Gingold
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If the regular models are the same poses then there is absolutely no reason why they should have sent metal in the first place.


Bobby4th wrote:
Mikeg99 wrote:
They are not making restic versions of the season 3 metals. They have said that the upgrade packs will always be metal.

Mike,

I think the regular players are the same poses and I bet they would send you those in restic. I suspect they would probably want you to keep the prone markers and the Keepers, though that is just a guess.

Bobby4th wrote:
armor_11 wrote:
As to customer service, I also had a very different experience. I got extremely timely and regular updates to my pledge.

I don't doubt that my issues will be handled.

Tim got back to me after I sent a follow-up and copied Stewart (who is out of the office) and then Sarah.
 
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J Ry
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Mikeg99 wrote:
If the regular models are the same poses then there is absolutely no reason why they should have sent metal in the first place.


Bobby4th wrote:
Mikeg99 wrote:
They are not making restic versions of the season 3 metals. They have said that the upgrade packs will always be metal.

Mike,

I think the regular players are the same poses and I bet they would send you those in restic. I suspect they would probably want you to keep the prone markers and the Keepers, though that is just a guess.

Bobby4th wrote:
armor_11 wrote:
As to customer service, I also had a very different experience. I got extremely timely and regular updates to my pledge.

I don't doubt that my issues will be handled.

Tim got back to me after I sent a follow-up and copied Stewart (who is out of the office) and then Sarah.



I'm thinking it was meant same poses as the standard ones.
The upgrade packs were meant to be alternate poses IIRC.
They ran out and did a in house run of the metal ones to make up the difference to keep from holding back some orders to get more in.
That and to save money.

I think if you swap them you'll get extras of the base team figures.
So same poses as those.
 
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Bobby Warren
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Did anyone reading this get alternate poses for the season three teams in restic? What about the prone player markers and Keepers for the season three teams?

Thanks!
 
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Bobby4th wrote:
Did anyone reading this get alternate poses for the season three teams in restic? What about the prone player markers and Keepers for the season three teams?

Thanks!


I only got metal for all those.
 
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Mike Gingold
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Bobby4th wrote:
Did anyone reading this get alternate poses for the season three teams in restic? What about the prone player markers and Keepers for the season three teams?

Thanks!


Acording to Mantic, all of the Season 3 upgrade packs, prones and keepers are going to be manufactured in metal only.
 
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