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Subject: influence action "where only you have a ship" rss

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Duncan P
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On page 10 of the english rules the section on influence states:

"By selecting the influence action, you may move up to two Influence Discs. these moves may be... to a hex where only you have a ship."

Does "where only you have a ship" mean the influence action could allow an interceptor located ON a hex with an undefended Influence Disc (ie no population cubes, no enemy ships) to IMMEDIATELY displace the opponent's disc, ie allow you to take over the hex outside of the combat phase?

Or does the displacement of an influence marker only occur following a successful combat phase (even if no actual combat takes place)?

The dot point above it goes to great pains to specify that the presence of another player's Influence Disc prevents you from influencing adjacently THROUGH a wormhole. If the second scenario is true why not just say you can't influence a sector that already contains an opponents Influence Disk?
 
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Radosław Michalak
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You are not allowed to remove opponent's disc during action phase.
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Wim van Gruisen
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You cannot use the action to move (or remove) opponents' influence disks.
Alphaeus wrote:
If the second scenario is true why not just say you can't influence a sector that already contains an opponents Influence Disk?

You can't influence a sector that already contains an opponents Influence Disk. There.

However, if your ship is the only one in an opponent's hex, you could use the Influence action to reflip two of your colonisation disks, if you'd already used them. If you succeed in removing opponent's disk in the combat phase, you can then settle the planets immediately.
 
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Mark Biggar
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I thought that this meant that if both you and one of your opponents had ships in an unowned hex, then neither of you could claim the hex by an influence action, but had to fight it out first. It also precludes influencing a next-door hex if someone else has a ship there. If you move a ship into an unowned hex, you can't immediately put an influence disk, it takes another action, therefore without this rule someone owning a next-door hex could steal it from you.
 
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Duncan P
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Thank you guys. I'm looking forward to getting this on the table in my gaming group.
 
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Rafael Martins
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I'm still confused.
In the rules, the following is said:

******************************************************************
These moves may be:
...
• to a hex that does not contain an Influence Disc or an enemy
Ship and is adjacent to a hex where you have a disc
or a Ship, or
• to a hex where only you have a Ship, or
...
The hex Influenced has to have a Wormhole connection to
the hex where you have a disc or a Ship.
*****************************************************************

If the restriction that you need to have a wormhole connection applies to both cases and you can't influence a sector that already contains an opponents influence disk, then aren't all cases of the second item covered by the first, meaning that it is a redundant rule and should therefore be ignored/removed? Or am I missing something?
 
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Radosław Michalak
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In fact you can influence a hex where you have only a ship and you don't have any discs and ships in adjacent hexes.
 
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David Hutton
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Radziol wrote:
In fact you can influence a hex where you have only a ship and you don't have any discs and ships in adjacent hexes.


this is my understanding as well....you can influence any of the following possibilities:

1) a hex containing no enemy ships/disc, and you have no disc/ships there but have a wormhole connection to it from a hex where you do
2) a hex containing no enemy ships/disc, and you have a ship there (this does not have to be connected to any other hexes where you have a disc or ship)

one thing the latter rule does allow for is that you go into combat in an enemy hex andwipe all enemy ships/planets, but have no spare influence discs which which to influence the hex. In this case, you could still remove the enemy disc after combat and then, as long as your turn was before anyone else could move another ship in there, you could influence it in the next round

this makes the multi-hex engines much more useful, as you can avoid being pinned by other ships you can watch for people leaving valuable hexes in their own space relatively undefended and then make a dash for it....in best case scenarios this results in you being able to build ships on either side of their territory making defense much harder

edit: typo
 
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Zach LaVone
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Radziol wrote:
You are not allowed to remove opponent's disc during action phase.


This seems like it makes perfect sense, but I can't remember reading any basis for this in the rules. Is it in the rulebook somewhere? Why isn't it clearly stated in the influence action section?
 
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Radosław Michalak
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arkofcovenant wrote:
Radziol wrote:
You are not allowed to remove opponent's disc during action phase.


This seems like it makes perfect sense, but I can't remember reading any basis for this in the rules. Is it in the rulebook somewhere? Why isn't it clearly stated in the influence action section?

It is stated that you can only influence vacant hexes.
And again what is not allowed is forbidden.
 
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Forrest & Ryan Driskel
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arkofcovenant wrote:
Radziol wrote:
You are not allowed to remove opponent's disc during action phase.


This seems like it makes perfect sense, but I can't remember reading any basis for this in the rules. Is it in the rulebook somewhere? Why isn't it clearly stated in the influence action section?


Eclipse Rulebook, Page 10 wrote:
By selecting the Influence action, you may move up to two
Influence Discs. These moves may be:
from your Influence Track, or
from a hex where you have an Influence Disc

• to a hex that does not contain an Influence Disc or an enemy
Ship and is adjacent to a hex where you have a disc
or a Ship, or
• to a hex where only you have a Ship, or
• back to your Influence Track.


The hex Influenced has to have a Wormhole connection to
the hex where you have a disc or a Ship. In the example on
the right, you could Influence hexes A, B and G.
After placing an Influence Disc, you may activate your
Colony Ships to place Population Cubes on the Population
Squares on the hex.
During the Influence action, you may turn two of your used
Colony Ships face up, even if you choose to move no Influence
Discs.

removing a disc from a hex If you remove an Influence
Disc from a hex, you must also return all cubes from the
hex to their respective Population Tracks on your board. If a
cube is returned from a gray (wild) square, you may choose
which Track it goes to. Similarly, if a cube is returned from
an Orbital, you may return it to either the Money or Science
Track.



There's the rules.

To me its clear, but the other indicator that should give it away is the rules existing from returning population cubes to YOUR board ... never talking about other player's boards.
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Geoff Speare
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Vanish wrote:
• to a hex where only you have a Ship, or


This is the problem line in the 2nd edition rules. It implies that if you have a Ship and no one else does, you can Influence the hex regardless of whether someone has a disk there. This has come up before.

The 1st Edition rule was:

Eclipse 1st Edition wrote:
from your Influence Track or from a hex where you have an Influence Disc to a hex that does not contain an Influence Disc or an enemy Ship and is adjacent to a hex where you have a disc or a Ship.


This makes it more clear (but has problems of its own which is why they rephrased it).
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Forrest & Ryan Driskel
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galfridus wrote:
Vanish wrote:
• to a hex where only you have a Ship, or


This is the problem line in the 2nd edition rules. It implies that if you have a Ship and no one else does, you can Influence the hex regardless of whether someone has a disk there. This has come up before.


Yeah, I suppose they could change it to:

"• to a hex with no influence disc where only you have a Ship"
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Mark B
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This rule makes it great for the Exiles to expand behind other players. The cloaking device allows safe passage and even bombardment of enemy players on their journey. The ships can keep moving though the non-influenced sectors and claim them. These sectors were probably placed for their discovery tiles and not retained due to a lack of planets.
 
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