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Subject: Doppelganger questions rss

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Dani Evans
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Hi there! laugh

I have so much trouble getting my head around the Doppelganger! The main problem I think is that it's possible to simply cheat - if you viewed a Werewolf and discover that one of your fellow players is a Hunter, Minion or Tanner for example, if you get killed then you can simply claim you viewed that person instead and use their ability to win.

Does the Doppelganger need to declare truthfully before voting which player they viewed? Or can they lie and scheme just as much as the other players? It seems particularly confusing when I think about the Insomniac receiving the Doppelganger role via the Troublemaker. The Insomniac can't know which team they are on unless the original Doppelganger tells them. If that person then turns around at the end of the game and says they were lying all along and they'd actually viewed a different person, the Insomniac has no way of telling if that actually happened or if they are being trolled. All other lies in the game can be deconstructed once the game is over and all character cards are known

Honestly I very much doubt this would ever happen - I play games with a really nice bunch of folks, but if I'm introducing a game then I feel like I really need to understand all the rules first and the Doppelganger seems so fuzzy
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Plum wrote:
Hi there! laugh

I have so much trouble getting my head around the Doppelganger! The main problem I think is that it's possible to simply cheat - if you viewed a Werewolf and discover that one of your fellow players is a Hunter, Minion or Tanner for example, if you get killed then you can simply claim you viewed that person instead and use their ability to win.

Does the Doppelganger need to declare truthfully before voting which player they viewed? Or can they lie and scheme just as much as the other players? It seems particularly confusing when I think about the Insomniac receiving the Doppelganger role via the Troublemaker. The Insomniac can't know which team they are on unless the original Doppelganger tells them. If that person then turns around at the end of the game and says they were lying all along and they'd actually viewed a different person, the Insomniac has no way of telling if that actually happened or if they are being trolled. All other lies in the game can be deconstructed once the game is over and all character cards are known

Honestly I very much doubt this would ever happen - I play games with a really nice bunch of folks, but if I'm introducing a game then I feel like I really need to understand all the rules first and the Doppelganger seems so fuzzy


Just like any other player, the player with the Doppelgänger card can say anything they want. At the end of the game, they can't lie about being a werewolf, simply for the reason that they open their eyes with the other werewolves (and those werewolves will see them). Theoretically, they could lie at the end of the game about which villager team person they saw (or if they saw the Tanner), but it seems like a bad idea (why would they want to?).

Regarding if someone else ends up with the Doppelgänger card (Insomniac or otherwise), they'll find out at the end of the game whose team they're really on. The Insomniac might be able to figure out if the original Doppelgänger was lying about being on whatever team they claim (if the Doppelgänger believes she was switched, she might admit viewing a werewolf and outing the other werewolves).whistle

We recommend playing with all the other roles first, before you start adding the Doppelgänger to the mix, but I love getting the role possibly more than any other.
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Dani Evans
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toulouse wrote:
At the end of the game, they can't lie about being a werewolf, simply for the reason that they open their eyes with the other werewolves (and those werewolves will see them)


Ahhhh of course! I completely overlooked that little nugget and it does answer most of my questions thank you

Am I right in thinking that the Doppelganger takes on the end-game abilities of the Hunter and the Tanner if she views them? In that case, a Doppelganger-Werewolf that gets successfully read and killed could claim to be the Doppelganger-Hunter and kill her original target or claim to be a Doppelganger-Tanner, to cheat a loss into a win. Or does she merely gain the Villager Team status from the card?

I'm sorry I'm being super pernickity but one of my players is bound to ask me at some point!

Thank you for the quick response laugh
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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If you have players that will willfully break the rules of the game, you should use a moderator, or just don't play with those people.
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Dani Evans
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MasterDinadan wrote:
If you have players that will willfully break the rules of the game, you should use a moderator, or just don't play with those people.

I don't or I wouldn't I just wanted to make sure I understood it all correctly I wondered if perhaps I'd misunderstood how it interacts with the Trapper and Tanner but I guess not

Thanks
 
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Alex G
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MasterDinadan wrote:
If you have players that will willfully break the rules of the game, you should use a moderator, or just don't play with those people.


How would you know though? Especially in a game that encourages lying.
 
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unonameless wrote:
How would you know though? Especially in a game that encourages lying.

Because lying during the game is part of the rules, lying after the vote is against the rules, and going against the rules is cheating.
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Alex G
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a1bert wrote:
unonameless wrote:
How would you know though? Especially in a game that encourages lying.

Because lying during the game is part of the rules, lying after the vote is against the rules, and going against the rules is cheating.

But then again, how would you know? Let's say I want to boot the cheater and never play with them again - how would I find out that person was cheating?
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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unonameless wrote:
a1bert wrote:
unonameless wrote:
How would you know though? Especially in a game that encourages lying.

Because lying during the game is part of the rules, lying after the vote is against the rules, and going against the rules is cheating.

But then again, how would you know? Let's say I want to boot the cheater and never play with them again - how would I find out that person was cheating?


If you don't know that he's cheating, then what difference does it make?
 
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unonameless wrote:
a1bert wrote:
unonameless wrote:
How would you know though? Especially in a game that encourages lying.

Because lying during the game is part of the rules, lying after the vote is against the rules, and going against the rules is cheating.

But then again, how would you know? Let's say I want to boot the cheater and never play with them again - how would I find out that person was cheating?
There's all sorts of ways a player can cheat, in an undetectable way, that have nothing to do with the Doppleganger. If you're a Seer, during the night, you can just look at every single card. Of course, the game is pointless to play if you do that, but it's possible. And impossible to detect, unless you install a camera and review the footage after the game.

If you're playing with people who you even suspect are doing that, it is highly recommended you defriend them as quickly as possible.
 
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Alex G
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clydeiii wrote:
unonameless wrote:
a1bert wrote:
unonameless wrote:
How would you know though? Especially in a game that encourages lying.

Because lying during the game is part of the rules, lying after the vote is against the rules, and going against the rules is cheating.

But then again, how would you know? Let's say I want to boot the cheater and never play with them again - how would I find out that person was cheating?
There's all sorts of ways a player can cheat, in an undetectable way, that have nothing to do with the Doppleganger. If you're a Seer, during the night, you can just look at every single card. Of course, the game is pointless to play if you do that, but it's possible. And impossible to detect, unless you install a camera and review the footage after the game.

If you're playing with people who you even suspect are doing that, it is highly recommended you defriend them as quickly as possible.


After 4 or 5 Game of Thrones sessions, I suspect these people of everything.
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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unonameless wrote:


After 4 or 5 Game of Thrones sessions, I suspect these people of everything.


Well, that game also involves scheming, lying, and backstabbing. But the real question is, are they cheating? And if so, why are you still playing with them?
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MasterDinadan wrote:
unonameless wrote:


After 4 or 5 Game of Thrones sessions, I suspect these people of everything.


Well, that game also involves scheming, lying, and backstabbing. But the real question is, are they cheating? And if so, why are you still playing with them?
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Alex G
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MasterDinadan wrote:
unonameless wrote:


After 4 or 5 Game of Thrones sessions, I suspect these people of everything.


Well, that game also involves scheming, lying, and backstabbing. But the real question is, are they cheating? And if so, why are you still playing with them?


They aren't but I know they would the moment anyone turns their backs. But I play with them because I love them.

I'm just goofing, the biggest reason we play with arbitrator is not to prevent cheating, but to minimize movement and noise around the table.
 
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