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Subject: Post 1st game rules questions rss

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Andrew Williams
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Just played my 1st game, re-read the rules, and I have a few small queries I'd appreciate some help with.

Section F "Returning to Plymouth" states that a player must return to port after his 4th mission. Does this mean that if you use the Ghost ship or Golden Hind you lose a mission, as both of them essentially give you 5 disks? I know the ghost ship does nothing so this is really more relevant to the Hind. That gives you 5 missions (GH,1,2,3&4), but can you only use 4?

The Admiral: "Only this player will know the exact number of guns required to attack that Galleon". For this to be true the Galleon ships must be placed face up. We placed them all face down and only revealed them when someone attacked. This must be wrong for ther above statement to be true, yes?

Sailing Order: Am I right in saying that the only benefit of sailing early is that you break ties in your favour should they arise?

Ghost Ship: I understand how this works but I don't really see what use it is. Sure you get to essentially delay your turn by 1, but you can sortof do the same by sailing last. If you place it first, you really have to place it on a spot you're not interested in because you can only place 1 disk at each location. Am I missing something? It was hardly ever taken in our game (being 1st game tho nuance is often lost).

Should the number of shipping destinations be lowered when playing with less than 5p. This is not a rules question, instead something for the more experienced players to comment on. Our 1st game was unusual in that 1 player had to drop out after the first 2 voyages. I changed the tiles from 5p to 4p and we carried on. We noticed that there was hardly any competition for sailing spaces, with people getting pretty much what they wanted unhindered. The knock on effect of this meant there wasn't much care taken when placing mission disks and the tension was diminished. Again, I'll add the caveat that this was our 1st play, so pretty much a learning game.

Finally, components. They are universally great. However, I bought my copy at Essen, and while setting up I noticed that most of the large mission discs were stuck together, most probably because the paint had dried while they were packed. I had no problem knocking them apart but in doing so, some bits of paint were lost, making them easily distinguishable. In this game that is a major problem. Any suggestions? I'm thinking opaque acrylic replacements.

 
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John Bradshaw
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Sunmachine wrote:
Just played my 1st game, re-read the rules, and I have a few small queries I'd appreciate some help with.

Section F "Returning to Plymouth" states that a player must return to port after his 4th mission. Does this mean that if you use the Ghost ship or Golden Hind you lose a mission, as both of them essentially give you 5 disks? I know the ghost ship does nothing so this is really more relevant to the Hind. That gives you 5 missions (GH,1,2,3&4), but can you only use 4?


This should be read as "after playing Mission Disk #4" rather than 4th mission. (it's been answered elsewhere in the forums.

Sunmachine wrote:
The Admiral: "Only this player will know the exact number of guns required to attack that Galleon". For this to be true the Galleon ships must be placed face up. We placed them all face down and only revealed them when someone attacked. This must be wrong for ther above statement to be true, yes?


No. The player who takes the Admiral is the player who places the Spanish Frigates so s/he is the only one who knows what the defences are, because s/he looks at them before placing them face down.

Sunmachine wrote:
Sailing Order: Am I right in saying that the only benefit of sailing early is that you break ties in your favour should they arise?


That's right. Though it can be a substantial advantage considering there's only 1 gold/silver/jewel at each location and only 2 attacks per location.

Sunmachine wrote:
Ghost Ship: I understand how this works but I don't really see what use it is. Sure you get to essentially delay your turn by 1, but you can sortof do the same by sailing last. If you place it first, you really have to place it on a spot you're not interested in because you can only place 1 disk at each location. Am I missing something? It was hardly ever taken in our game (being 1st game tho nuance is often lost).


No-one else knows which of your 5 or even 6 disks is the Ghost ship so there's scope for bluffing. Also it means you will be placing last, so you can choose a spot you know will be free with your final placement. It's a small but not insignificant advantage.

Sunmachine wrote:
Should the number of shipping destinations be lowered when playing with less than 5p. This is not a rules question, instead something for the more experienced players to comment on. Our 1st game was unusual in that 1 player had to drop out after the first 2 voyages. I changed the tiles from 5p to 4p and we carried on. We noticed that there was hardly any competition for sailing spaces, with people getting pretty much what they wanted unhindered. The knock on effect of this meant there wasn't much care taken when placing mission disks and the tension was diminished. Again, I'll add the caveat that this was our 1st play, so pretty much a learning game.


There are debates about this elsewhere in the forums and you can discuss the issue there. I'm not keen on the idea personally - others may have different views - it's your game!
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Mathue Faulkner
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Seghillian wrote:

Sunmachine wrote:
The Admiral: "Only this player will know the exact number of guns required to attack that Galleon". For this to be true the Galleon ships must be placed face up. We placed them all face down and only revealed them when someone attacked. This must be wrong for ther above statement to be true, yes?


No. The player who takes the Admiral is the player who places the Spanish Frigates so s/he is the only one who knows what the defences are, because s/he looks at them before placing them face down.

To clarify, the Spanish Galleon should be face up at the start of each round, but the Spanish Frigates should be face down. Everyone knows the strength of the Galleons, but only the Admiral will know the strength of the Frigates.

Seghillian wrote:

Sunmachine wrote:
Sailing Order: Am I right in saying that the only benefit of sailing early is that you break ties in your favour should they arise?


That's right. Though it can be a substantial advantage considering there's only 1 gold/silver/jewel at each location and only 2 attacks per location.

Also, if you're first in Turn Order, you can be a bit more of a bully in order to grab those treasure items. Of course, you do have to be aware of the Golden Hind if you don't have it, but you just don't challenge that player. Focus on the others.

Seghillian wrote:

Sunmachine wrote:
Ghost Ship: I understand how this works but I don't really see what use it is. Sure you get to essentially delay your turn by 1, but you can sortof do the same by sailing last. If you place it first, you really have to place it on a spot you're not interested in because you can only place 1 disk at each location. Am I missing something? It was hardly ever taken in our game (being 1st game tho nuance is often lost).


No-one else knows which of your 5 or even 6 disks is the Ghost ship so there's scope for bluffing. Also it means you will be placing last, so you can choose a spot you know will be free with your final placement. It's a small but not insignificant advantage.

To add to this, the game was initially playtested that you got nothing if a 1 or 2 was rolled, but players didn't like this. The Ghost Ship is just a little something for your bad luck at the Tavern. I like having the extra disc for bluffing and placing last, but I'd rather have the 2-3 Crew.


Sunmachine wrote:
Should the number of shipping destinations be lowered when playing with less than 5p. This is not a rules question, instead something for the more experienced players to comment on. Our 1st game was unusual in that 1 player had to drop out after the first 2 voyages. I changed the tiles from 5p to 4p and we carried on. We noticed that there was hardly any competition for sailing spaces, with people getting pretty much what they wanted unhindered. The knock on effect of this meant there wasn't much care taken when placing mission disks and the tension was diminished. Again, I'll add the caveat that this was our 1st play, so pretty much a learning game.

As Seghillian stated, there are debates on this elsewhere. Having said that, smart play won't just allow players to go everywhere they want. If you have the Golden Hind, then you should be pushing other players around at a couple locations. And if you are 1st in turn order, then you can do the same with players other than the Golden Hind. Going last gives you the advantage of shying aware from other people on your last disc, but all of the other players can bully you with their "1" disc without any worry...and they should if the opportunity arises.

It's rare that someone gets bullied out of a space completely, but the Jewels, Gold, and Silver are critically important. Of course, they're bonus points that can add up quickly for the same cost as the 2nd player at that destination, but they also don't add to your score immediately. I think everyone agrees that it's a HUGE advantage to going first in the Provisioning Phase. That means it's actually nice to be sitting back from the leader in terms of points for the first 2 voyages, but you also don't want to be too far behind. The treasure items are points that don't count against you in terms of turn order since they don't get added until the end of the game. This means that even if you're technically in the lead because of your treasure, you may still be able to place 1st or 2nd in the Provisioning Phase. Trade Goods act in a similar way.
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Ralph H. Anderson
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Sunmachine wrote:
Finally, components. They are universally great. However, I bought my copy at Essen, and while setting up I noticed that most of the large mission discs were stuck together, most probably because the paint had dried while they were packed. I had no problem knocking them apart but in doing so, some bits of paint were lost, making them easily distinguishable. In this game that is a major problem. Any suggestions? I'm thinking opaque acrylic replacements.


Please email customer-service@eagle-gryphon.com to report your problem with your pieces.

If you check the forum there are a couple of threads on the issue of sticking pieces. For almost everyone they were able to either unstick the pieces with no damage, or were able to place their stickers on the damaged side.

If this was not the case, then emailing for replacement parts is the answer.

I think most of your other questions have been answered - or will be answered with further play! There are a lot of good reasons to go first and last. devil

Ralph
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Sir Bay

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AZ
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[q=Finally, components. They are universally great. However, I bought my copy at Essen, and while setting up I noticed that most of the large mission discs were stuck together, most probably because the paint had dried while they were packed. I had no problem knocking them apart but in doing so, some bits of paint were lost, making them easily distinguishable. In this game that is a major problem. Any suggestions? I'm thinking opaque acrylic replacements.

[/q]

I had the same problem, but I put stickers on the sides that had issues. That being said, Griffon was really good at replacing the parts that I could not fix myself.
 
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Jo Bartok
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Sadly I have the same issue but Griffon/Eagle-Support is already on the case and are very helpful so far!
 
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Jo Bartok
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Sunmachine wrote:

Should the number of shipping destinations be lowered when playing with less than 5p. This is not a rules question, instead something for the more experienced players to comment on. Our 1st game was unusual in that 1 player had to drop out after the first 2 voyages. I changed the tiles from 5p to 4p and we carried on. We noticed that there was hardly any competition for sailing spaces, with people getting pretty much what they wanted unhindered. The knock on effect of this meant there wasn't much care taken when placing mission disks and the tension was diminished. Again, I'll add the caveat that this was our 1st play, so pretty much a learning game.


Hello,

see it as a competition thing. If you want competition, you can have it - else you may skip it (take empty slots).

I did not play enough games to make a judgement BUT indeed I am not sure if going for competition will help you win. E.g. if you "damage" one other player and thus weaken your position also, all the other players will benefit and the question is: do you really want to weaken your position? Maybe it is only worth it if you are placed 2nd and challenge the first player so that you might surpass him (while all the others also come closer to you all) ... So it might be a tactical choice that comes up more often or less often depending on game balance and experience. We will see.
 
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Mathue Faulkner
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ionas wrote:
Sunmachine wrote:

Should the number of shipping destinations be lowered when playing with less than 5p. This is not a rules question, instead something for the more experienced players to comment on. Our 1st game was unusual in that 1 player had to drop out after the first 2 voyages. I changed the tiles from 5p to 4p and we carried on. We noticed that there was hardly any competition for sailing spaces, with people getting pretty much what they wanted unhindered. The knock on effect of this meant there wasn't much care taken when placing mission disks and the tension was diminished. Again, I'll add the caveat that this was our 1st play, so pretty much a learning game.


Hello,

see it as a competition thing. If you want competition, you can have it - else you may skip it (take empty slots).

I did not play enough games to make a judgement BUT indeed I am not sure if going for competition will help you win. E.g. if you "damage" one other player and thus weaken your position also, all the other players will benefit and the question is: do you really want to weaken your position? Maybe it is only worth it if you are placed 2nd and challenge the first player so that you might surpass him (while all the others also come closer to you all) ... So it might be a tactical choice that comes up more often or less often depending on game balance and experience. We will see.

It's easy enough to damage other players while not damaging yourself in the game assuming you have priority...
 
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Jo Bartok
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True for "other players" wrong for another specific player. Thus if you are not #1 and #2 with a wide gap to #3/#4 it is hard to play vs #2 being #1 or vs #1 being #2... e.g. if #1 is far ahead you might still better play against #3 to close the gap depending on Plymouth tile order, your position and your mission options.

Anyway, its okay the way it is. I only found one issue and I hope to have a house rule fix up soon, still testing.
 
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