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Android: Netrunner» Forums » General

Subject: PSA: Fisk's ability rss

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Steven Tu
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Fisk's ability can only be used:

1. Only the first successful run you make every turn on a central server - that means if you decline to use the ability the first time you run successfully (on a central server), you can't activate it when you make another successful run (on a central server).

2. Only BEFORE you access anything - that means you can't run R&D, see the card, then make the corp draw it. Or you can't run HQ, access, then make the corp draw a card (though dunno why you would). Or you can't run Archives with Record Reconstructor, put a card back on top of R&D, then make the corp draw it with Fisk's ability.

3. (not can only, but also) In conjunction with other event:run effects or cards like Sneakdoor Beta.

4. Is a MAY not a MUST. That means Fisk gets to CHOOSE.

5. if you have a soul patch (pending confirmation from FFG)



That is all

Edit: Various clarifications
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Josh C
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Yes, it's bad. Those of us who voted for The Collective know this. But the players on OCTGN would apparently prefer we have more bad cards, so we're stuck with Fisk.

Remember this the next time you open a new data pack and find no "power" cards in it...
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Vasilis
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I really like how everyone assumes that Fisk will be released tomorrow and use the current card pool thus being very bad...
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Josh C
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Bowmangr wrote:
I really like how everyone assumes that Fisk will be released tomorrow and use the current card pool thus being very bad...


Just using the same logic of the Fisk voters who assumed The Collective would be released tomorrow and use the current card pool, thus being very overpowered...
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Game Junkie
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I am surprised by all this negativity about Fisk's ability. I think he is great, but then you have to maximize his skill instead of playing him like Gabe or Andy.

With R&D interface/Medium, you can know which cards are coming from R&D and force the corp to draw those cards in order to dig deeper.
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Troy Jennings
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Didn't even get to vote, but I would rather have less cards that are bad for the game. If you're in it for "power" cards, I would hope this was the wrong game, because I don't want to see power creep kick in.

Netrunner is asymmetrical. If you overpower just one side you break the game. It's not like other games where power cards are balanced by being available to both players.

Quote:
Just using the same logic of the Fisk voters who assumed The Collective would be released tomorrow and use the current card pool, thus being very overpowered...


But The Collective already *is* extremely powerful in the current card pool.

And can only get stronger, barring the printing of some specially-designed hate card, which is a terrible way to run an lcg.

And means that every single Runner card in the future with a [click] ability has to be carefully vetted.
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Vasilis
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capbarclay wrote:
Bowmangr wrote:
I really like how everyone assumes that Fisk will be released tomorrow and use the current card pool thus being very bad...


Just using the same logic of the Fisk voters who assumed The Collective would be released tomorrow and use the current card pool, thus being very overpowered...


Ι said the exact same thing to those who think that the Collective is overpowered.

There is absolutely NO logic in comparing these cards with the current card pool until we know for sure WHEN they are going to be realeased and what other cards are going to be available at the time.
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Hobvias Sudoneighm
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A neat thing about Fisk is that he allows Criminal to get a little more out of HQ Interface. Some mild R&D Hate without having to splash Shaper or Anarch, and without having to actually run R&D.

Normally if you have a bunch of HQ Interfaces, you can view the Corp's HQ whenever you'd like, but they are going to get a crack at playing every card they draw before you get to run and see it in HQ.

With Fisk and multiple HQ Interfaces, once per turn the Runner gets an excellent shot at accessing a card before the Corp gets the ability to play it. Accessing a card before the Corp gets to even see it is pretty good, sorta kinda a little like a partial R&D lock if you really squint at it.

Forces the issue with Fast Advance decks when they are in that "Ready and waiting for an Agenda to score" mode.
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Hobvias Sudoneighm
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Bowmangr wrote:
There is absolutely NO logic in comparing these cards with the current card pool until we know for sure WHEN they are going to be realeased and what other cards are going to be available at the time.


Right. The power of any one card is largely defined by the card pool it is operating in.

I don't think the issue of Fisk versus Collective ever should have been about power levels. The issue is which card inspires the most enjoyable game play. Collective seemed geared toward the Runner playing on a parallel track to the Corp a lot of the time, whereas Fisk's ability plays to the idea of a "dance" between Corp and Runner. Both thematically and in terms of gameplay.
 
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Vasilis
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striatic wrote:
Bowmangr wrote:
There is absolutely NO logic in comparing these cards with the current card pool until we know for sure WHEN they are going to be realeased and what other cards are going to be available at the time.


Right. The power of any one card is largely defined by the card pool it is operating in.

I don't think the issue of Fisk versus Collective ever should have been about power levels. The issue is which card inspires the most enjoyable game play. Collective seemed geared toward the Runner playing on a parallel track to the Corp a lot of the time, whereas Fisk's ability plays to the idea of a "dance" between Corp and Runner. Both thematically and in terms of gameplay.


Exactly. That is the reason why I vastly prefer Fisk than the Collective. He is WAY more interesting than "find click actions that can be abused and put them in your deck until you reach 55 cards".
It was never about power level for me. It's about interesting gameplay vs boring mechanics.
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Adrian Breuch
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Why are people calling it a soul patch?
It's a chin puff or a chin stripe, but not a soul patch.
Yes both grow below lips, but a soul patch never meets your chin.
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Mad Scientist Philip von Doomula
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Hello Fisk. My name is Deep Thought. You are still lame.



Good day.
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Tunguska's CPA
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I like how
Steven Tu
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posts about how to properly use Fisk, noting the important timing structure of his ability... and Fisk's own flavor text is "Timing is everything". Like FFG was trying to (not so) subtly tell us to pay attention. XD
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Tobin Lopes
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Bowmangr wrote:

There is absolutely NO logic in comparing these cards with the current card pool until we know for sure WHEN they are going to be realeased and what other cards are going to be available at the time.


Don't believe everything you read on the interwebs but I have heard FFG folks say on several occasions that Fisk wouldn't be released for at least 18 months. Twice I even heard two years.

So, Summer 2016, as GenCon approaches and we begin to celebrate the 4th anniversary of ANR might be the soonest that Fisk will appear in the Real Life Legal for Tournament Play card pool.

He's in torpor until then. devil

-tpl
 
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Double Plus Undead
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Trithne wrote:
Didn't even get to vote, but I would rather have less cards that are bad for the game. If you're in it for "power" cards, I would hope this was the wrong game, because I don't want to see power creep kick in.


Yeah. It's too bad they printed Scorched Earth, Personal Workshop, and all those other "overpowered" cards.

Quote:
But The Collective already *is* extremely powerful in the current card pool.

And can only get stronger, barring the printing of some specially-designed hate card, which is a terrible way to run an lcg.


So, you're an LCG designer? Cool! Which ones have you worked on??

Quote:
And means that every single Runner card in the future with a [click] ability has to be carefully vetted.


Yes, just like every card that gives tags has to be vetted for Scorched Earth, and every card which gives credits has to be vetted for Personal Workshop. It's really too bad that those cards got printed, because it's constricted the design space so much.
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Andrew Lieffring
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Tuism wrote:
Fisk's ability can only be used:

1. Only the first successful run you make every turn - that means if you decline to use the ability the first time you run successfully, you can't activate it when you make another successful run.


The first run you make on a central server. Barring Replicating Perfection, it's a valid play to run remote and then Fisk up HQ with a subsequent run.
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pirate_chef wrote:
So, you're an LCG designer? Cool! Which ones have you worked on??

(I think this kind of logic works both ways...)
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Martin Presley
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Quarashi wrote:
Hello Fisk. My name is Deep Thought. You are still lame.



Good day.


Fisk-Deep Thought will rule the Tier 2 decks with an iron fist!
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Chris Nutt
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Combine Fisk with HQ interface, Sneakdoor beta and Imp and you have a great way of putting pressure on a Corp. Making a deck around Fisk just sounds like a fun play style to me.
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Rana Puer
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I CAN'T WAIT to lose against someone who is playing Fisk and has a soul patch.

That will be my favorite Netrunner moment ever.

edit: not sarcasm, mad respect to whoever does that.
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David L.
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capbarclay wrote:
Yes, it's bad. Those of us who voted for The Collective know this. But the players on OCTGN would apparently prefer we have more bad cards, so we're stuck with Fisk.

Remember this the next time you open a new data pack and find no "power" cards in it...


Yep, all of the data packs are going to be garbage from this point forward. Because you guys voted for Fisk (I did too).
 
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Contig the fallen
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ranapuer wrote:
I CAN'T WAIT to lose against someone who is playing Fisk and has a soul patch.

That will be my favorite Netrunner moment ever.

edit: not sarcasm, mad respect to whoever does that.


This would be great if someone went to a tournament in costume to look like him.
 
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Doug Law
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beepers wrote:
I have no idea how to use this ability. What a bad card! Bad!

I tried to think and my nose started bleeding. Bad card!

Laramy Fisk's ability is entirely new and nothing may ever be released like it again. That being said it is strictly worse than Armitage Codebusting. Bad, bad card.


Well, he IS strictly worse than Armitage Codebusting considering that one is legal for play and one is not...
 
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Marius Ødegård
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capbarclay wrote:

Just using the same logic of the Fisk voters who assumed The Collective would be released tomorrow and use the current card pool, thus being very overpowered...


The Collective was overpowered even if you were only using just the basic non-card actions.

You could play diesel or easy mark every single turn. For free.
 
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It's nice to see some love for The Collective.

Both IDs are interesting, but my problem with Fisk is that any deck you make with Fisk will probably be better if you replace Fisk with Andromeda or Gabriel.

The Collective, though, while maybe abuseable and overpowered in some one-dimensional ways, is at least unique and can steer how you play in order to use his ability. It actually changes your deck and play, where Fisk almost certainly will not.

Either way, I'll likely never use Fisk and probably would only have used The Collective as something different, much like The Professor.


As a bottomline, right now as a corp, why would I dislike sitting across from Fisk who will let me put more cards into my hand? If I were sitting across from The Collective, I'm not sure what I'd expect, but it wouldn't make me smile in glee.
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