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Android: Netrunner» Forums » General

Subject: Restructure or Melange in Weyland? rss

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Ethan Bingham

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So a few days back I got Second Thoughts (!!!) and wanting to "upgrade" my Weyland deck (pretty standard) with the new cards I have found a issue.

Melange or Restructure?

The pros of Melange:

Can rez for 1 credit.

Provides "unlimited" income.

I LOVE it when a runner runs through my super-server just to trash a Melange (and this is game-changing potentially).

The cons:

My favorite thing about Weyland is that they have a very unleaky R&D. I'm running a few cards that can be trashed (Jackson H and Corporate Troubleshooter) and adding more trashable cards isn't great.

Assuming you use Melange only once (assuming the runner has Inside Job or SMC to get through my early-game server) you spend 4 clicks (1 to install and 3 to use) and 1 credit (to rez) and gain 7 credits. Not a good trade-off.

The pros of Restructure:

I'm running pretty standard economy (3 GLC, 3 HF, 3 Beanstalks and Jackson to reuse them) so 10 credits isn't a huge barrier.

I've got plenty of ways to use the money (Archer and Troubleshooter come to mind...).

I LOVE using my ID power (running core Weyland).

Untrashable.

It is a new card (I know that shouldn't sway my opinion but new cards are cool cool ).


That's all I can think of now. I've got two slots to fill and I'm just wondering what you guys think of the two in general. The more I think of it the more I like Restructure but prompting a run on my Hadrian's-Archer-Archer-Enigma-Melange server is such a waste of runner credits...

EDIT: Forgot to mention Hostile Takeover (2 of them) and Government Contracts (2 also). No Geothermal Fracking (had too much bad publicity but I might go back to them).
 
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Martin Presley
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I use neither; just 3 GLC, Beanstalk, Hedge, Takeover, and Fracking. It's already a disgusting amount of money, adding more economy would hurt the deck.
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Ken Dilloo
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hoobajoo wrote:
I use neither; just 3 GLC, Beanstalk, Hedge, Takeover, and Fracking. It's already a disgusting amount of money, adding more economy would hurt the deck.


Funny, was just adding in 2 Restructuring into my Weyland deck and thought, "Is this just too much money?" Can you ever have too much cash, though, especially if you are running troubleshooters?
 
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Martin Presley
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bigloo33 wrote:
hoobajoo wrote:
I use neither; just 3 GLC, Beanstalk, Hedge, Takeover, and Fracking. It's already a disgusting amount of money, adding more economy would hurt the deck.


Funny, was just adding in 2 Restructuring into my Weyland deck and thought, "Is this just too much money?" Can you ever have too much cash, though, especially if you are running troubleshooters?


You can never have too much money, but you can have too many economy cards, because each one takes a slot, and at a point it'd be better to put in something else.

I would put in Government Contracts or Profiteering before Restructure, because the opportunity cost for an agenda is lower, since you are required to have a certain number of them.
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Matthew Guze
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hoobajoo wrote:
I use neither; just 3 GLC, Beanstalk, Hedge, Takeover, and Fracking. It's already a disgusting amount of money, adding more economy would hurt the deck.


Would it be better to have Restructure over GLC to free up some influence for other things? The barrier to entry is different, but the rewards feel pretty good to me.
 
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Martin Presley
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talking_chicken wrote:
hoobajoo wrote:
I use neither; just 3 GLC, Beanstalk, Hedge, Takeover, and Fracking. It's already a disgusting amount of money, adding more economy would hurt the deck.


Would it be better to have Restructure over GLC to free up some influence for other things? The barrier to entry is different, but the rewards feel pretty good to me.


If I was GRNDL, sure. But Restructure is much more situational and that card draw is a big thing.
 
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Ethan Bingham

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At the moment I'm not really using all 15 influence (13 and experimenting with the last 2) so the splash cost on GLC isn't important. Also, I'm using Jackson to draw more than I thought I would and am considering using Anonymous Tip with my last two influence points but GLC giving me money and cards is pretty awesome (I'd rather use GLC than Beanstalk any day of the week and almost prefer it over Hedge Fund). I'm not really hurting on cash much, just looking for Troubleshooter fuel (he can get really expensive...).
 
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Scott Hartman
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im using both, but only 2x restructure since i find its more situational
 
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Michael Redston
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Put Restructure instead of GLC and do something useful with those 3 influence.
 
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Ethan Bingham

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@shartma: What other economy cards are you using? I find that Beanstalk, GLC (almost wrote LCG haha), and HF with Hostile and Geothermals or Governments are plenty. Using both Restructure and Melange seems a bit overkill.
 
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Alex Rockwell
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1) I would choose Restructure over Melange, for sure in Weyland. Restructure is the best thing to happen to Weyland BaBW, since Project Atlas.

2) Depending on your deck, using both might be correct, instead cutting something else. I currently have 2 deck slots where I am considering Melange, Elizabth Mills, or other cards. Currently testing Mills, simply because I want to see how it does.

********

The idea that Restructure gives you 'too much money' is, honestly, ridiculous. Weyland is able to convert "too much" money into winning game states such as "I have Sea Source + Scorches in hand. You cannot run me without losing".

The runner can avoid this with a Plascrete, however Weyland has answers to this answer. If Weyland scored 'The Cleaners', then a single Plascrete is insufficient, and the runenr must have two to be safe from this. If Weyland has Snares, then if the runner hits them it probably brings them into a position to be killed by the Sea/Double Scorch, or just the double Scorch.


Using Sea/Double Scorch requires an economy advantage over the runner, which can be difficult to acquire. Restructure is amazing for permitting this. It is also amazing at fighting runner denial tactics such as ice derezzing/destruction, and Account Siphon.
 
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Ethan Bingham

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@ Kroen: As I've said before, I'm not using all of my influence so GLC doesn't hurt and I find myself drawing cards a LOT (even with Jackson). So much that I'm considering using Anonymous Tip (that'll be my "yes I AM using that card" card). so GLC does everything I want and then some (and I get another credit off of it ).

@PRISM: I've loved Melange in the past. Early on I use it for bait (the runner runs on it and can't afford to break my Archer for example) and later on I use it as a scoring window (not many decks can run through Hadrian's-Archer-Archer-Ice Wall two turns in a row) so it definitely has it's uses. Unfortunately, if the runner sees it in R&D I've lost a great part of my economy and that doesn't happen with Restructure...
 
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Scott Rubin
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I'm having this same issue. I really want to play both, but there just aren't enough deck slots.
 
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Ethan Bingham

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I KNOW!!! I'm also trying to get my deck down to 45 cards. Netrunner deckbuilding has given me so many gray hairs...
 
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Alex Rockwell
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I would definitely cut Melange rather than cut Restructure. It is indeed difficult to get down to (49 corp/45 runner)!

So far I've played Weyland about a dozen games with Restructure, and its pretty much the best thing ever. Especially when you play 3 Jacksons, and he both helps you draw Restructures, and shuffles them back in.

Playing a Restructure is like an entire turn on Melanging. Its really, really important for corps to be fast, because runner lategames are oppressively strong. Corp needs to get its money, gets its defense, and go! Restructure is amazing at helping Weyland get its money with less clicks required, and thus it helps you to have more time to win the game, before the runner gets set up.
 
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Alex Rockwell
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Bioroid 86 wrote:
As I've said before, I'm not using all of my influence so GLC doesn't hurt and I find myself drawing cards a LOT (even with Jackson).


There are many strong cards to add to Weyland.

Sea Source, Snare, Corporate Troubleshooter, Green Level Clearance, Tollbooth, Rototurret, Chum, Data Raven, SanSan City Grid. Thats just some of them. (Yes, SanSan is great in Weyland! If you score an overadvanced Atlas, and then you draw and play a SanSan, its yet another way to win the game. You can just tutor up and push through Atlases on it, and they MUST kill it).

If nothing else, replacing a few of your ice with Tollbooth or Rototurret will improve the deck.



Replacing GLC with Restructure and saving 3 influence is one possible choice, however I prefer to play BOTH of them, because theyre both AMAZING in Weyland BaBW.



 
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Martin Presley
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Alexfrog wrote:
Bioroid 86 wrote:
As I've said before, I'm not using all of my influence so GLC doesn't hurt and I find myself drawing cards a LOT (even with Jackson).


There are many strong cards to add to Weyland.

Sea Source, Snare, Corporate Troubleshooter, Green Level Clearance, Tollbooth, Rototurret, Chum, Data Raven, SanSan City Grid. Thats just some of them. (Yes, SanSan is great in Weyland! If you score an overadvanced Atlas, and then you draw and play a SanSan, its yet another way to win the game. You can just tutor up and push through Atlases on it, and they MUST kill it).

If nothing else, replacing a few of your ice with Tollbooth or Rototurret will improve the deck.



Replacing GLC with Restructure and saving 3 influence is one possible choice, however I prefer to play BOTH of them, because theyre both AMAZING in Weyland BaBW.





Can you post your decklist so we can see how you're fitting it in?
 
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Scott Rubin
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One thing the OP mentioned is that Restructure is untrashable sans Imp or Demo Run. That is huge. If you can't defend R&D properly, having non-trashable cards is a huge deal because it keeps the runner from digging deeper. It will take a lot more runs for them to get agendas if they can get in there if you have cards that can't be trashed. I've won a lot of games where I was unable to defend R&D strongly enough simply because the runner could not dig through all the operations.
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Scott Hartman
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Bioroid 86 wrote:
@shartma: What other economy cards are you using? I find that Beanstalk, GLC (almost wrote LCG haha), and HF with Hostile and Geothermals or Governments are plenty. Using both Restructure and Melange seems a bit overkill.


the econ in my deck is
2 melange
2 restructure
3 hedge fund
3 beanstalk

3 takeovers
oversight ai + priority req for a handful of big ice
gov. contracts might make it back in but im trying out the cleaners.
 
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Ethan Bingham

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@ Apreche: Exactly. I can get away with barely defending R&D (instead I focus on my remote) for a while and not lost too many points off of it/

@ Alexfrog: Restructure is pretty much a one-use Melange that:

1 can't be trashed
2 doesn't need as much setup time
3 isn't such a drain on clicks

The more I think about it the more I feel like Restructure is a better choice (take that Whizzard!)
 
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Alex Rockwell
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hoobajoo wrote:

Can you post your decklist so we can see how you're fitting it in?


I've got multiple weyland decks I'm trying.

1) Snare/Sea/Scorch version:
Weyland BaBW 49 cards:

3 Government Contracts
3 Project Atlas
3 Hostile Takeover
2 False Lead

2 Sea Source ****
2 Snare **** (also trying different numbers of these)
3 Scorched Earth
3 Jackson Howard ***
2 Green Level Clearance **
3 Beanstalk Royalties
3 Hedge Fund
3 Restructure

3 Archer
3 Bastion
3 Caduceus
3 Enigma
3 Ice Wall
2 Rototurret **


2) Sansan Weyland:
Weyland BaBW 49 cards:

3 Government Contracts
3 Project Atlas
3 Hostile Takeover
2 Gila Hands Arcology (or other 3/1)

3 SanSan City Grid *********
3 Jackson Howard ***
3 Green Level Clearance ***
3 Beanstalk Royalties
3 Hedge Fund
3 Restructure

3 Archer
3 Bastion
3 Caduceus
3 Enigma
3 Ice Wall
3 Shadow

2 open slots (Melange? Elizabeth Mills? other?)


I also tried a Grim version, replacing things like Caduceus with Grim, but I wasnt liking it as much.
 
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Scott Rubin
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I notice that you run a few less ICE that I do. I'm very scared to go under 18, and even that is too few for me to be comfortable.

You also seem to run many copies of a low variety of ICE. I feel like the power of more ICE variety catches runners unaware. Also, if you have the same ICE in multiple places you become weak in multiple places simultaneously when the runner gets the tool to deal with that ICE.

Also, even though you have Jackson Howard, I can't go without Archived Memories. That card has won too many games for me. Scorch->Archived->Scorch or Archived->Beanstalk->Scorch after an Account Siphon.

Here's my current line of thinking.

Just Scorch (49 cards)

Weyland Consortium: Building a Better World

Agenda (11)
2 Government Contracts
3 Hostile Takeover
2 Posted Bounty
3 Project Atlas
1 The Cleaners

Asset (4)
2 Jackson Howard ••
2 Snare! ••••

Upgrade (2)
2 Bernice Mai ••••

Operation (14)
1 Archived Memories ••
3 Beanstalk Royalties
3 Hedge Fund
3 Restructure
3 Scorched Earth
1 SEA Source ••

Barrier (8)
1 Bastion
2 Hadrian's Wall
3 Ice Wall
2 Wall of Static

Code Gate (3)
3 Enigma

Sentry (7)
2 Archer
1 Grim
3 Shadow
1 Swordsman

Built with http://netrunner.meteor.com/
 
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Ethan Bingham

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"the econ in my deck is
2 melange
2 restructure
3 hedge fund
3 beanstalk

3 takeovers
oversight ai + priority req for a handful of big ice
gov. contracts might make it back in but im trying out the cleaners."


That's what my economy used to be (except no Oversights, I don't like trashing my ICE and don't lack money to rez it) but if you aren't using your influence for something important try GLC, it has everything I need (like I said, I would rather use it than Beanstalks) and then some. Even if it weren't a transaction I would still splash for it (and Jackson reusing them is just gravy).

I'll post my decklist in a few minutes.
 
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Martin Presley
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That explains it, I'm running 3x Fracking instead. I'd be excited too if I wasn't running the best agenda since Atlas.

To answer the question in the thread title though, I'd play Restructure over Melange without question in BaBW.
 
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Scott Rubin
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Oh, another thing. How come none of you guys are playing Posted Bounty?! If you want the kill, you need the Bounty. It creates the Catch-22 where if the runner doesn't or can't run the remote, they die. If they do run, they also die (SEA Source). It also enables the triple scorch on the runner that lets you start a turn with PB already advanced three times. It also enables Junebug/ Cerebral Overwriter or Ghost Branch bluffs.
 
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