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Subject: Half Breed and Super Munchkin rss

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There are a number of class/race related cards such as Super Munchkin, Half Breed, and more.

-Is it possible to put Super Munchkin, Half Breed and similar into play without any class or race on them? They are only lost at the loss of a Race or Class, and not strictly before a Race or Class has even been played.

-Can Race or Class cards be lost from play and replaced by a different one at choice?

-In order to achieve the end of adding the repeated card to the discard pile, can a Race or Class card be lost and replaced, just at choice, by another Race or Class card of exactly the same title?
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Zachary1234 wrote:
There are a number of class/race related cards such as Super Munchkin, Half Breed, and more.

-Is it possible to put Super Munchkin, Half Breed and similar into play without any class or race on them? They are only lost at the loss of a Race or Class, and not strictly before a Race or Class has even been played.

No. This one comes up on the official forums occasionally, and the intent is fairly clear that it shouldn't be allowed.

Quote:
-Can Race or Class cards be lost from play and replaced by a different one at choice?

Only if it is your turn. You can discard your current Race or Class card/s at any time on any turn, but you can only play such cards at any time during your turn. If it's your turn, you can do both of these actions simultaneously (so you don't count as having no Race between discarding the first Race and playing a new Race.

Quote:
-In order to achieve the end of adding the repeated card to the discard pile, can a Race or Class card be lost and replaced, just at choice, by another Race or Class card of exactly the same title?

Yes, provided it is your turn as above.
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Half Breed and Super Munchkin
-If one Class is on one Super Munchkin, and one wants to deploy a second, different Class, can one choose for one to replace the other, and in fact maintain the option to have one class only on Class?

-What happens in the similar scenario with Half Breed and Race cards?
 
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Tor Sverre Lund
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Zachary1234 wrote:
-If one Class is on one Super Munchkin, and one wants to deploy a second, different Class, can one choose for one to replace the other, and in fact maintain the option to have one class only on Class?

-What happens in the similar scenario with Half Breed and Race cards?


The answer for both is the same. If you want to discard your race/class, you have to discard everything, so the Super Munchkin/Half Breed goes with it.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Gawain wrote:
The answer for both is the same. If you want to discard your race/class, you have to discard everything, so the Super Munchkin/Half Breed goes with it.


This is incorrect. As I said before, provided it is your turn, you are allowed to discard one Race/Class and play a replacement Race/Class at the same time. You will not lose Half-Breed/Super Munchkin while doing so.

Besides, with these cards, you could just as easily play the second Race or Class and then discard the first one you had to achieve the same effect.

The proof that you can switch a Race or Class card is in the official FAQ:
Munchkin FAQ wrote:
Q. If I only have one Class, and am changing the Class, do I lose any items that say "if you lose your Class, discard this card"?
A. As long as you play the new Class immediately after discarding the old Class, no. Think of switching a Class as one action with two parts (discarding the old Class, playing a new Class) so that action has to complete before any other actions would start.


Edit: So to be clear, the answer is yes to both original questions, provided you take the action to replace the discarded card immediately, so it must be your turn when you do it.
 
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Tor Sverre Lund
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I might be misremembering, or they changed something after I stopped playing (wouldn't be the first time that happened). But in any case, the quote you gave has no meaning in this case, as Super Munchkin and Half-Breed aren't items. I remember pretty clearly a ruling saying that if you discarded your class, your Super Munchkin went with it. But again, they might have changed that.

Also,
Quote:
Besides, with these cards, you could just as easily play the second Race or Class and then discard the first one you had to achieve the same effect.

.. is definitely not allowed (or, again, at least wasn't). Super Munchkin could ONLY be played if you had two classes, you can't play it with just one (like you can with Half-Breed). You could play one class to replace one of the two you already had though.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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They did change the rules in 2010. Super Munchkin was updated so that its wording matched the style of Half-Breed. They also tweaked a few other rules and cards. For example, you now draw four Doors and four Treasures at the start of the game and Monster Enhancers don't change the Level of a monster any more (they change its combat strength instead). You can read more about the changes here.

And while you are correct that the FAQ entry does not specifically cover HB and SM due to those cards not being Items, the explanation of the rule (that you are switching the two Races/Classes with no time for other effects in-between) does still cover the cards. It's been officially clarified that they work that way on the main forums too.
 
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-Even when using Super Munchkin or Half Breed with one Class or Race, does the player still have the option to discard one Class or Race, and still do replacement despite the second card slot option? Does the second card option have to be used, or can you do direct replacement against the one Race or Class as before, despite such?

 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Zachary1234 wrote:
-Even when using Super Munchkin or Half Breed with one Class or Race, does the player still have the option to discard one Class or Race, and still do replacement despite the second card slot option? Does the second card option have to be used, or can you do direct replacement against the one Race or Class as before, despite such?

Yes, you can do it, provided it is the player's turn and no time passes between discarding the original Race card and playing the replacement.

For example, a Half-Elf (Half-Breed + Elf) could even discard their current Elf card and immediately play a different Elf card from their hand to remain being a Half-Elf. Or they could switch from Half-Elf to Half-Dwarf or whatever. Super Munchkin (using the post-2010 printings) works exactly the same way, but for Classes. The second slot option does not need to be used.
 
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