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Subject: Talk about echo chambers: a pointless rant rss

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There's a good bit of talk here in RSP about an "echo chamber"-- meaning everybody coming from the same perspective. I think Tripp uses term the most but others are not far behind.

The irony to me is that from my perspective it's all one big cultural echo chamber in which I do not entirely fit. Jythier describes it as me using unusual definitions of words; my usages aren't at all unusual except that they're not based on a Christian cultural context. I had a semi-lurker shmuck (who happens to be an atheist) insisting that I think religion is equivalent to culture and ignoring anything i said that refuted that. I ought to have told him that if I did I'd call him and every other atheist on this board a Christian, but obviously I don't. Yet even the atheists think and talk like Christians in most respects. The same shmuck kept quoting me dictionary definitions from a Christian cultural perspective as if that settled things. Jythier remarked that I couldn't not use unusual definitions in the thread on forgiving a shooter. Well, no sh#t, Sherlock, as the saying goes.

Oh well. I'm just putting this out there. I need to finish washing the dishes and cook some food. Maybe I'll be less cranky then.
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What do you mean by 'cook'?
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That begs the question (at least to me) of who's expected to adapt?

Should the people (or persons) in the minority be expected to adapt to the majority or the opposite? Or should no one adapt and just accept that there's going to be conflict (for lack of better term) when a culture/religious context of one person is taken as to mean something different by anothers culture/religion?

Certainly, the context of my posts and views are based on in that of Midwestern US christian. Even as an atheist, I was raised in a christian culture, and my views are based on those.
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I think a major problem is that the English language has predominantly developed within a Christian cultural context so concepts that Moshe has from his other cultural context don't translate exactly the way he thinks they will. We're speaking different languages with the same words. I never meant that it was just Moshe's problem - it's Moshe and anyone who wants to communicate with him or people who have different cultural backdrops' problem. It's a big one.
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Dispaminite wrote:
That begs the question (at least to me) of who's expected to adapt?
No one. All you need to do is acknowledge the possibility that not everyone shares your definitions of certain concepts, and then have an interesting conversation about it. No adaptation required. This is RSP, not the BORG collective.
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Jythier wrote:
I think a major problem is that the English language has predominantly developed within a Christian cultural context so concepts that Moshe has from his other cultural context don't translate exactly the way he thinks they will. We're speaking different languages with the same words. I never meant that it was just Moshe's problem - it's Moshe and anyone who wants to communicate with him or people who have different cultural backdrops' problem. It's a big one.


Even among English speakers, there's enough differences from culture to culture that can lead to such conflicts. The word "fag" comes to mind. In the US is has one very specific very negative meaning, while in the UK is has a completely different meaning.
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Venga2 wrote:
Dispaminite wrote:
That begs the question (at least to me) of who's expected to adapt?
No one. All you need to do is acknowledge the possibility that not everyone shares your definitions of certain concepts, and then have an interesting conversation about it. No adaptation required. This is RSP, not the BORG collective.


I was thinking more of the whole, and not just RSP. The "Ugly American" stereotype comes to mind.
 
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I know I am guilty of cultural bias. I have a hard time talking about alleged forms of music other than Metal without letting contempt, disdain and disgust from coming through in my statements, reasonings and comments.

It is an interesting point though, many people go around with cultural assumptions (bordering on exceptionalism at times) that can make communication difficult. I think the other thread is a good example in that there is even debate among Christians as to what Christian forgiveness means, so expecting non-Christians to toe some imaginary line isn't realistic.
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Dispaminite wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
Dispaminite wrote:
That begs the question (at least to me) of who's expected to adapt?
No one. All you need to do is acknowledge the possibility that not everyone shares your definitions of certain concepts, and then have an interesting conversation about it. No adaptation required. This is RSP, not the BORG collective.


I was thinking more of the whole, and not just RSP. The "Ugly American" stereotype comes to mind.
Not following...
 
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Metal... psh.
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Of course EVERYONE here has their cultural bias. Moshe himself not excluded.

For me one of the great benefits of RSP is becoming aware of them.

Often through the process of others pointing them out... harshly
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Venga2 wrote:
Dispaminite wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
Dispaminite wrote:
That begs the question (at least to me) of who's expected to adapt?
No one. All you need to do is acknowledge the possibility that not everyone shares your definitions of certain concepts, and then have an interesting conversation about it. No adaptation required. This is RSP, not the BORG collective.


I was thinking more of the whole, and not just RSP. The "Ugly American" stereotype comes to mind.
Not following...


American Tourists go to another country, but don't adapt to the culture of that country. So the Americans come off as rude and disrespectful in that culture, even though their behavior might be considered normal in the US.
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Further with the "forgiveness" example, before English there was forgiveness, before Greek there was forgiveness, before even Jesus there was forgiveness. It is a concept with many tweaks and variations based on culture, but there is some essential aspect to it that links all the definitions. To reject someones else's understanding of it just because it doesn't match your own cultural assumptions is arrogant.
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Dispaminite wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
Dispaminite wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
Dispaminite wrote:
That begs the question (at least to me) of who's expected to adapt?
No one. All you need to do is acknowledge the possibility that not everyone shares your definitions of certain concepts, and then have an interesting conversation about it. No adaptation required. This is RSP, not the BORG collective.


I was thinking more of the whole, and not just RSP. The "Ugly American" stereotype comes to mind.
Not following...


American Tourists go to another country, but don't adapt to the culture of that country. So the Americans come off as rude and disrespectful in that culture, even though their behavior might be considered normal in the US.


Or to use a more specific example. In the US in sit down restaurants, customers are expected to tip for a meal (pay an additional money to the service staff on top of the bill). In Germany, this doesn't exist. So a German Tourist comes to the US, goes to a sit down meal, pays the bill and leaves, but doesn't tip.

In the US, that behavior would be considered rude to the waitstaff. In Germany, it's considered normal.
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Dispaminite wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
Dispaminite wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
Dispaminite wrote:
That begs the question (at least to me) of who's expected to adapt?
No one. All you need to do is acknowledge the possibility that not everyone shares your definitions of certain concepts, and then have an interesting conversation about it. No adaptation required. This is RSP, not the BORG collective.


I was thinking more of the whole, and not just RSP. The "Ugly American" stereotype comes to mind.
Not following...


American Tourists go to another country, but don't adapt to the culture of that country. So the Americans come off as rude and disrespectful in that culture, even though their behavior might be considered normal in the US.
But that goes for tourists everywhere, and from any origin. Certainly Russians and Chinese have acquired very bad reps in this regard here, but my fellow Dutchies regularly make me feel ashamed.

But again, one is not required to adapt. It is ok to make a social faux pax because you are un aware of some custom or taboo. As long as you remain friendly and apologies if required, nor harm done. People are much more forgiving of tourists than of people who should know better.
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Or a man from the US could go to a remembrance party in some other country for an important figure in history, and act all somber instead of being jovial like everyone else.
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Maybe it's a seasonal thing. I've hated the damn holidays as long as I've been a working adult. I'm headed into the depths of my traditional holiday depression. I've been irritable at work. Hyper critical of my service techs and my boss. My coworkers have noticed. Every year I wish I could celebrate the commercial aspects of Christmas in March and just skip the extra layer of travel and expectations that fall when the weather is lousy and traffic is a bitch.

I need to buy some paper plates and go through the drive through at McDonalds.

Quote:
Maybe I'll be less cranky then.
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scribidinus wrote:

Maybe it's a seasonal thing. I've hated the damn holidays as long as I've been a working adult. I'm headed into the depths of my traditional holiday depression. I've been irritable at work. Hyper critical of my service techs and my boss. My coworkers have noticed. Every year I wish I could celebrate the commercial aspects of Christmas in March and just skip the extra layer of travel and expectations that fall when the weather is lousy and traffic is a bitch.

I need to buy some paper plates and go through the drive through at McDonalds.

Quote:
Maybe I'll be less cranky then.

Chanuka is over and the only December holiday here is my wife's birthday.
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whac3 wrote:
There's a good bit of talk here in RSP about an "echo chamber"-- meaning everybody coming from the same perspective. I think Tripp uses term the most but others are not far behind.

The irony to me is that from my perspective it's all one big cultural echo chamber in which I do not entirely fit. Jythier describes it as me using unusual definitions of words; my usages aren't at all unusual except that they're not based on a Christian cultural context. I had a semi-lurker shmuck (who happens to be an atheist) insisting that I think religion is equivalent to culture and ignoring anything i said that refuted that. I ought to have told him that if I did I'd call him and every other atheist on this board a Christian, but obviously I don't. Yet even the atheists think and talk like Christians in most respects. The same shmuck kept quoting me dictionary definitions from a Christian cultural perspective as if that settled things. Jythier remarked that I couldn't not use unusual definitions in the thread on forgiving a shooter. Well, no sh#t, Sherlock, as the saying goes.

Oh well. I'm just putting this out there. I need to finish washing the dishes and cook some food. Maybe I'll be less cranky then.


The irony here is that you feel the need to define everything in terms of a hostile outside christian culture.

This is more about your specific personal prejudices and hangups.
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windsagio wrote:
whac3 wrote:
There's a good bit of talk here in RSP about an "echo chamber"-- meaning everybody coming from the same perspective. I think Tripp uses term the most but others are not far behind.

The irony to me is that from my perspective it's all one big cultural echo chamber in which I do not entirely fit. Jythier describes it as me using unusual definitions of words; my usages aren't at all unusual except that they're not based on a Christian cultural context. I had a semi-lurker shmuck (who happens to be an atheist) insisting that I think religion is equivalent to culture and ignoring anything i said that refuted that. I ought to have told him that if I did I'd call him and every other atheist on this board a Christian, but obviously I don't. Yet even the atheists think and talk like Christians in most respects. The same shmuck kept quoting me dictionary definitions from a Christian cultural perspective as if that settled things. Jythier remarked that I couldn't not use unusual definitions in the thread on forgiving a shooter. Well, no sh#t, Sherlock, as the saying goes.

Oh well. I'm just putting this out there. I need to finish washing the dishes and cook some food. Maybe I'll be less cranky then.


The irony here is that you feel the need to define everything in terms of a hostile outside christian culture.

This is more about your specific personal prejudices and hangups.

I only called it different. Why does that equate to hostile to you? That says something about you, I think.
 
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bjlillo wrote:
whac3 wrote:
Chanuka is over and the only December holiday here is my wife's birthday.


Why don't you just celebrate the birth of our Lord and Savior then like all the normal people I know? It doesn't make any sense.

Those people round here who do that at all do it round 6 January.
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whac3 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
whac3 wrote:
Chanuka is over and the only December holiday here is my wife's birthday.


Why don't you just celebrate the birth of our Lord and Savior then like all the normal people I know? It doesn't make any sense.

Those people round here who do that at all do it round 6 January.

That actually makes the most sense with all the after Xmas sales. After all. Dec 25th was arbitrary to begin with. You might as well save some money while having a holy birthday party, more sales means more presents!
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whac3 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
whac3 wrote:
Chanuka is over and the only December holiday here is my wife's birthday.


Why don't you just celebrate the birth of our Lord and Savior then like all the normal people I know? It doesn't make any sense.

Those people round here who do that at all do it round 6 January.


That's appropriate, as it is my actual birthday.
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whac3 wrote:
I think religion is equivalent to culture


I win! Where's my moosecock?

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djgutierrez77 wrote:
whac3 wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
whac3 wrote:
Chanuka is over and the only December holiday here is my wife's birthday.


Why don't you just celebrate the birth of our Lord and Savior then like all the normal people I know? It doesn't make any sense.

Those people round here who do that at all do it round 6 January.


That's appropriate, as it is my actual birthday.

Was your mother named Miriam?
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