Recommend
3 
 Thumb up
 Hide
17 Posts

Runewars» Forums » Rules

Subject: Revised Edition Word of Vaal - can I choose to retreat a damaged unit? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Mark L
Singapore
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
I looked through the Corey document and it seems like the Latari Sorceress' Word of Vaal special ability works like a normal retreat - you have to retreat a standing undamaged unit if possible.

But now that the ability of the Sorceress has been changed such that the Latari player gets to choose the retreating unit, is the player still bound by the same restrictions? Could I choose to, for example, retreat a damaged Chaos Lord or Dark Knight such that the unit would not be able to draw a Fate card during its Initiative?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Yes. The only time you must choose an undamaged unit to rout/retreat is if you are applying it to your own units. When you choose an enemy unit, you can choose ANY of their units, damaged or not.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark L
Singapore
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
Thanks a lot for the extremely prompt reply!

You might want to add a small note to that ruling in the document, indicating that it only applies with the Original Edition rules.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
markino wrote:
Thanks a lot for the extremely prompt reply!

You might want to add a small note to that ruling in the document, indicating that it only applies with the Original Edition rules.

Good point, I'll do that when I next update it.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
SCHNEIDER Christophe
France
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Has this ability been changed with the revised Edition ???
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Garrett
United States
Laredo
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
chrischneider wrote:
Has this ability been changed with the revised Edition ???


Yes.

From the first edition:
"Word of Vaal: Your opponent must retreat one of his standing units from the battle."

Revised edition:
"Word of Vaal: Your opponent must retreat one unit of your choice from the battle."
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
This makes the Sorceress units much more useful. In the original, the Latari player rarely bothered recruiting them (usually they just came as part of another recruit). The target would almost always just retreat units that already went anyway, and so it wasn't really much better than a rout.

With the new ability, the power units need to fear the wrath of the Elves!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Garrett
United States
Laredo
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Yes! Forcing my opponent to retreat Roc Warriors before they drew fate cards was excellent!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
SCHNEIDER Christophe
France
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
A big change !!

Are there other ability changes, not writen on the "Revised Edition Gameplay Changes" file ?

Thanks
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
No, that's the only ability change.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
SCHNEIDER Christophe
France
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Thanks Scott
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David F
United States
Emeryville
California
flag msg tools
Luck in games, in measured doses, is the catalyst which enables shocking game-changers that you'll remember and talk about forever.
badge
Let the Lord of Chaos rule.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
sigmazero13 wrote:
Yes. The only time you must choose an undamaged unit to rout/retreat is if you are applying it to your own units. When you choose an enemy unit, you can choose ANY of their units, damaged or not.


Scott, could you refer me to where you got the last sentence from? Wonder if it's one of those rulings from 1ed that might need to get revised.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
selwyth wrote:
sigmazero13 wrote:
Yes. The only time you must choose an undamaged unit to rout/retreat is if you are applying it to your own units. When you choose an enemy unit, you can choose ANY of their units, damaged or not.


Scott, could you refer me to where you got the last sentence from? Wonder if it's one of those rulings from 1ed that might need to get revised.

Hmm, I need to go through my emails and see if there was one specific to this.

However, I base the sentence on two other rulings:

- The Latari Archer units can use Crack Shot to damage ANY opposing unit. Even if there is a standing, damaged unit in the opponent's army, the Latari player can deal damage to an undamaged or routed unit if he chooses, with Corey specifically saying that the only time the "damaged units first" rule applies is when damaging your own units.

- The Chaos Lord - when he uses his ability, it's been ruled that the Uthuk player can choose already-routed units, even if there are standing units in the battle.


However, you do make a good point - the current entry in my Rulings document about Word of Vaal says that must be an undamaged standing unit if possible. But that ruling was based on the original edition of the ability (when the Latari's opponent chose the unit). Because I want this document to be 100% confirmed rulings, I'll shoot an email off to Corey to get confirmation that with the change to Word of Vaal, that this ruling is also changed to match that with the Archer and Chaos Lord, but I'm pretty sure it will be confirmed.

Thanks for pointing that out!!!

(I really need to stop procrastinating and get the next version of the document put together. I have a handful of rulings that have just been sitting there waiting for me to update!)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David F
United States
Emeryville
California
flag msg tools
Luck in games, in measured doses, is the catalyst which enables shocking game-changers that you'll remember and talk about forever.
badge
Let the Lord of Chaos rule.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thanks for being thorough, just concerned since this would make Sorceresses almost as good as Necromancers, and I don't think the Latari Elves need that help... Let us know what you hear back!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
selwyth wrote:
Thanks for being thorough, just concerned since this would make Sorceresses almost as good as Necromancers, and I don't think the Latari Elves need that help... Let us know what you hear back!

I guess I feel the opposite. Prior to Banners of War, I always found the Latari Elves to be hands down the weakest race (and the Sorceresses in particular to be nearly useless).

This ability does get somewhat nasty when coupled with Leonx Riders, but I think it just bumps the Latari up to being competitive, at least based on my experiences with it

Stay tuned for confirmation, however
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Here's the answer I got.

ME
Awhile ago, you had made a ruling regarding the Latari Archer unit Crackshot ability stating that when it triggers, the Latari player can choose ANY opposing unit, regardless of damage or rout status, with the general ruling that the rule stating you must apply damage to a standing, damaged unit first only applies when you are applying damage to your own units.

In the old version of Word of Vaal (where the opponent chose which of his units retreated), you ruled that the chosen unit must be a standing undamaged unit if possible.

However, since Word of Vaal has changed so that the Latari player chooses, would the ruling similar to that made for Crackshot apply, allowing the Latari player to choose a damaged or routed opposing unit to retreat if desired? (I would say yes, so as to be consistent with Crackshot, but thought I'd get official confirmation rather than just assuming).


COREY
Yes, the Latari player may choose a damaged or routed unit using Word of Vaal.
2 
 Thumb up
0.02
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David F
United States
Emeryville
California
flag msg tools
Luck in games, in measured doses, is the catalyst which enables shocking game-changers that you'll remember and talk about forever.
badge
Let the Lord of Chaos rule.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Hmm, I'm playing Latari Elves for my next game!!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.