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Subject: Dumb rules question rss

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BP LP
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You Demo Run HQ, then Copycat or Bullfrog brings you over to Archives. If Director Haas is in Archives, does the runner take her as an agenda? The rules say you can't trash cards in Archives, but Demo Run says you trash all cards you access, even if you normally can't, and the golden rule says card text takes precedence. I'm sure this doesn't work, but would someone be nice enough to explain why?

Until then, I'm going to assume she is scored and that demo run trashes and moves everything in archives to some sort of meta-archives that you access normally, but is in an inconvenient location, such as across the room or under the table.
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Ian Neufeld
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BPLP wrote:
Until then, I'm going to assume she is scored and that demo run trashes and moves everything in archives to some sort of meta-archives that you access normally, but is in an inconvenient location, such as across the room or under the table.


As there is no precedent for a "meta-Archives" or for cards in Archives to be re-trashed, that seems a silly thing to assume.

Demo Run specifies that you make a run on HQ or R&D. As you are no longer running on HQ or R&D, it is no longer a valid event so its effect doesn't apply anymore. Same is true if you got redirected to a remote server.

Consult this thread for rulings on run deflections and their interactions with Run events: Run Deflection and Exploratory Romp - A Surprising Ruling
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ProphetOfCod wrote:
As there is no precedent for a "meta-Archives" or for cards in Archives to be re-trashed, that seems a silly thing to assume.


I have emailed Lukas about the rules for accessing the meta-archives. I hope for a swift response, as since my original post my local meta has become very stale, with it almost impossible to find a player not running the Copydemo combo. Sadly, this imbalance shows the lack of playtesting that is typical of FFG, and if this is not banned/errata'd soon, it certainly spells the end of Netrunner, and possibly the world.
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- Saturnine -
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First of all, I fail to see how a theoretical re-trashing of Archives is a gamebreaking combo (wtf?). Second of all, the override on Demo Run is not applicable to the rule that cards in archives cannot be trashed -- see FAQ:

Quote:
“Normally be Trashed”
Trashing cards that “cannot normally be trashed” only refers to
trashing cards that do not have a trash cost.
 
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This may help. From the FAQ.

“Normally be Trashed”
Trashing cards that “cannot normally be trashed” only refers to
trashing cards that do not have a trash cost.
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Ben Finkel
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BPLP wrote:
You Demo Run HQ, then Copycat or Bullfrog brings you over to Archives. If Director Haas is in Archives, does the runner take her as an agenda? The rules say you can't trash cards in Archives, but Demo Run says you trash all cards you access, even if you normally can't, and the golden rule says card text takes precedence. I'm sure this doesn't work, but would someone be nice enough to explain why?

Until then, I'm going to assume she is scored and that demo run trashes and moves everything in archives to some sort of meta-archives that you access normally, but is in an inconvenient location, such as across the room or under the table.


Not only can you not trash things that are in Archives, even with Imp, Demolition Run does not activate if it doesn't hit the server you initiated the run on: if you Demo Run HQ, you can't even trash things if you Bullfrog or Copycat to R&D, let alone a server not mentioned on the card.
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Ken Dilloo
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There are no dumb questions, just dumb titles to rule questions
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Saturnine wrote:
First of all, I fail to see how a theoretical re-trashing of Archives is a gamebreaking combo (wtf?).


I disagree. I have been playing CCGs since whatever it was that came before MtG, and I am a very talented Netrunner player, as shown by how authoritatively I speak on the game.

I have not played against the Copydemo combo myself, but I'm sick of having to design all my decks around countering it. There's more info on why the combo is so powerful here: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1090230/dumb-rules-question.

It's simply bad design on FFGs part. Things like this are why I left Magic, and I suspect many other people on this forum feel the same way.
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Dirk Meijer
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PhaseStar wrote:
This may help. From the FAQ.

“Normally be Trashed”
Trashing cards that “cannot normally be trashed” only refers to
trashing cards that do not have a trash cost.


So does that mean you cannot Imp her from Archives?
I was under the impression you could.
If not, I'll have to apologize to an opponent at the next tourney
 
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BPLP wrote:
There's more info on why the combo is so powerful here: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1090230/dumb-rules-question.


Either you have mis-copy/pasted or the joke is lost on me.
 
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dwjmeijer wrote:
PhaseStar wrote:
This may help. From the FAQ.

“Normally be Trashed”
Trashing cards that “cannot normally be trashed” only refers to
trashing cards that do not have a trash cost.


So does that mean you cannot Imp her from Archives?
I was under the impression you could.
If not, I'll have to apologize to an opponent at the next tourney ;)


You cannot trash cards that are already in Archives. There are currently no exceptions to this rule.
 
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Palpster
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meta-what now??....There is Archives and there is removed from the game, Demolition Run trashes stuff to Archives. Demolition Run does not work on Archives only on HQ or R&D. Stuff in Archives cannot be trashed (it's already in Archives). Demolition Run does not state in any form that it removes cards from the game.

I fail to see what the fuss is all about.
 
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Andrew Keddie
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Trash-talk.

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Matthew Guze
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I'm 99% sure we're just getting trolled really hard right now. I have been lurking boards since whatever it was that came before BGG, and I'm a very talented troll detector, as shown by how authoritatively I speak on the matter.
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Robbie M.
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BPLP wrote:
Saturnine wrote:
First of all, I fail to see how a theoretical re-trashing of Archives is a gamebreaking combo (wtf?).


I disagree. I have been playing CCGs since whatever it was that came before MtG, and I am a very talented Netrunner player, as shown by how authoritatively I speak on the game.

I have not played against the Copydemo combo myself, but I'm sick of having to design all my decks around countering it. There's more info on why the combo is so powerful here: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1090230/dumb-rules-question.

It's simply bad design on FFGs part. Things like this are why I left Magic, and I suspect many other people on this forum feel the same way.


Following that link was like hitting a Cell Portal.

And I'm curious as to what CCG you were playing before Magic.
 
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Gin Teki
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This thread made me chuckle. OH NO IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!
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