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Subject: How much fun is there in the base set? rss

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Omar Hamid
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Late last night I uploaded a session report on my first play of SotM, and my main point was that everyone I played with liked the game, but did not enjoy the actual games we played. We chalked it up to inexperience and are looking forward to breaking it out again. At the end of the article I asked for hero/villain/environment suggestions for 3-4 players. There ended up being good discussion on SotM in other ways, but I never really got any suggestions for the base set.

While all of the crazy sales going on lately have been great, my board game cookie jar has only a few crumbs. I know the game has been out for over two years, but do you have any suggestions? I've read that the print and play promo for Absolute Zero is worthwhile, should I focus on adding them?

I do plan on acquiring the expansions eventually, in fact, I ordered 3 minis last week that I can't wait for. But if anyone who has experience with just the base set can share some wisdom I'd really appreciate it.
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Warren Davis
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
For me, the fun was playing everybody & everything you had, & finding out who worked best. Also, people's personalities work into the mix & everybody has different heroes who they like playing & do best with. Just remember, the base set has ten heroes, which is more than you'll find in any other set...
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
I agree. The base set has a lot of game, and I've played with just the base more than anything else. The expansions have some cool heroes and villains, but the ones in the base are also great. There is plenty of variability in the box.
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
I think with SotM to really enjoy the game, everyone needs to get into the theme of it. Be the villan, be your heroes, get cheesy with the game and you'll find it a lot more enjoyable.
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Rob Rob
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
Give it another try or two. There's probably several hundred possible combinations of heroes, villains and environments with the core set alone.
 
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
I appreciate all the responses but I think I need to ask my question in a different way:

If a friend who only owned the base set called you asking for a suggestion for his first game for 3 players, would you advise him to pick whatever he fancied out of the box or would you have any suggestions for heroes to play and/or a certain villain to play against?
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Shaun Cordingley
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
I think I would personally suggest playing against Baron Blade for a first game, just to get the hang of it. I find Omnitron for a first game is decent as well, but as it flips every villain turn, that can get to be annoying to track (again, for a first game, there's nothing wrong with Omnitron other than his hatred of humans) The other two (Voss and Dawn) can just flat out beat you down.

Hero wise I'd say take your pick (although save Absolute Zero and The Visionary for some later games). I like teaching new people the game with The Wraith as building her character makes a lot of sense, particularly to anyone familiar with Batman or throwing knives at things.

As for environment, all are interesting. I'd say Megalopolis is the easiest if that is what you're looking for...Atlantis helps build some great stories though when you have to throw Legacy's ring into toxic seaweed for everyone's safety

Hope that helps

Edited for better word making
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I appreciate all the responses but I think I need to ask my question in a different way:

If a friend who only owned the base set called you asking for a suggestion for his first game for 3 players, would you advise him to pick whatever he fancied out of the box or would you have any suggestions for heroes to play and/or a certain villain to play against?


I recommend playing against Baron Blade the first time. He's the easiest villain.

For Heroes, I'd say whatever strikes your fancy. Legacy helps out the heroes, but doesn't do too much damage. The rest of them are a good balance between damage and support.

When I play we randomly decide heroes and villains.
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I appreciate all the responses but I think I need to ask my question in a different way:

If a friend who only owned the base set called you asking for a suggestion for his first game for 3 players, would you advise him to pick whatever he fancied out of the box or would you have any suggestions for heroes to play and/or a certain villain to play against?


Of the base set heroes (who are totally solid), the good ones to start out with are probably:

-Tachyon: Strong, lets you win games.
-Tempest: Strong, interesting.
-Ra: Very straight forward and potent.
-Wraith: Strong, straight forward.

Legacy is problematic, in that his base power (make everyone do +1 damage all the time) is *so* good that all you end up doing as Legacy is just using that base power every turn and otherwise not doing much, which is boring for the person playing Legacy. Absolute Zero is difficult to make work--he is an interesting puzzle, but difficult to figure out when you are new at the game, but even when you are good at the game, he can still just crash and burn based on bad card draws. Haka is fine, but kind of unspectacular (others might disagree). Fanatic is probably better than I give her credit for. Bunker is good, but requires good set up. Visionary is kind of hit or miss in terms of what she can be good at doing.

Omnitron is a good starter villain as he is funny and not hard to beat, but can put a serious hurt on heroes with some lucky card draws, so he won't seem like a total walk over.
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I appreciate all the responses but I think I need to ask my question in a different way:

If a friend who only owned the base set called you asking for a suggestion for his first game for 3 players, would you advise him to pick whatever he fancied out of the box or would you have any suggestions for heroes to play and/or a certain villain to play against?

IMO:

Villain - Baron Blade is a good start, second would be Omnitron. A good point made above for Omnitron is that could get annoying having to flip him every turn as you learn the game for the first time.

Environment - I would say Insula Primalis. Pretty straight forward and not too difficult. Megalopolis is on the easier side also, but it could get frustrating for new players as there are cards that prevent you from playing and/or drawing cards.

Heroes - I agree that a good part of the fun is exploring the games and the heroes and figuring them out as you go. Having said that, there are a couple that I would stay away from for the first game or two.

Absolute Zero: One of the more complex heroes for new players. Off the bat they may be confused that his inherent power is to damage himself, plus without knowing the cards in his deck it would be difficult to know how to play him.

Visionary: A support character that is most useful when manipulating decks and damage. Still playable for a new player, but not one I would recommend.


Re-emphasize, all of the above are good villains/environments/heroes, just my thoughts for the first game or two.

Note: just re-read the other responses and I basically agree with all that Shaun (rave_rd) said, except environments.
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Shaun Cordingley
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
Archr wrote:
[q="thehorsetronaut"]I appreciate all the responses but I think I need to ask my question in a different way:

If a friend who only owned the base set called you asking for a suggestion for his first game for 3 players, would you advise him to pick whatever he fancied out of the box or would you have any suggestions for heroes to play and/or a certain villain to play against?[/

Environment - I would say Insula Primalis. Pretty straight forward and not too difficult. Megalopolis is on the easier side also, but it could get frustrating for new players as there are cards that prevent you from playing and/or drawing cards.

Note: just re-read the other responses and I basically agree with all that Shaun (rave_rd) said, except environments.


I see nothing wrong with giving Insula Primalis a whirl as first environment, or really any of them. The main reason I usually bring up Megalopolis for a first game is that yes it does affect card playing, but I find that it's not a bad way to introduce turn manipulation (as there isn't much of that at all in Baron Blade).

Really, I'd hope environment was the least stressed about decision to be made. My first game was at the Wagner Mars base, and that is just an evil way to be introduced to environments (I hate you self destruct sequence)
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
One thing I want to throw out here since I've read your previous thread too and something about both struck me. you may(may) be looking at Sentinels in a 'wrong' way when searching for the fun. Sentinels is *very* much a team sport. It has to be approached as such, and I don't even mean 'we all win' or 'we all lose' I mean you should measure your effectiveness, gear your thinking, and derive fun for how you contribute to the team, rather than the more standard 'I got to do a lot of cool stuff on my turn!' from most games. As an example:One of my favorite characters: The Scholar.

I've done some of my best work as the Scholar having an out and out 'boring' game on my turns. Discard two cards to power my elemental forms, skip my play a card phase, and use an on-card power to draw two more cards(replacing the two I discarded) and one more at the end of my turn. That's a snoozefest from the 'Awesome stuff!' aspect, but each of those turns I sat pretty as the 'Highest HP' target and soaked 4 damage per shot from villain and environment alike, saving the team a boatload of damage. It felt awesome

The flipside is one of my other favorites:Tachyon. She does *all the things* on her turn, tossing cards willy nilly, and often times burning herself out early HP wise to do so. Some of her cards might seem piddly or ineffective, but the rapid buildup is paramount for her light speed barrage!

So you'll have turns where you tool about, and not every character works off of comboing like in some games, instead it's utilizing the tools you've got in the role you're good at(or the group needs). Also the game is made to feel like a struggle when you get to the more difficult bosses. Rarely do you feel 'super' you feel desperate(when the game is at it's best!) you feel outmatched and hemmed in, looking for a way to overcome. Some people honestly aren't looking for that experience and they won't enjoy the game because it's simply not what they want(which is fair).

I could be completely off base here, but I figured it was worth mentioning. You might've been expecting Caverna and gotten yourself into Agricola. Both good games and extremely similar, but one is not the other by a long shot ^^
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
If a friend who only owned the base set called you asking for a suggestion for his first game for 3 players, would you advise him to pick whatever he fancied out of the box or would you have any suggestions for heroes to play and/or a certain villain to play against?


I would probably suggest the following:

Play against Baron Blade
in either Megalopolis or Insula Primalis
don't use Absolute Zero.

Other than that, choose the heroes freely.
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I appreciate all the responses but I think I need to ask my question in a different way:

If a friend who only owned the base set called you asking for a suggestion for his first game for 3 players, would you advise him to pick whatever he fancied out of the box or would you have any suggestions for heroes to play and/or a certain villain to play against?


I've played two games so far.

The first game, I assigned everyone heroes randomly.

The second game (new people) I read the hero names aloud to each player, and had them pick who they wanted to be based on that. After that, my friends had a great time discovering what their characters did. Giving even that little choice made a difference.

A bonus to that 2nd game was the fun everyone had figuring out what their powers were. It was right out of the comic book of a freshly inked hero.

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Omar Hamid
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
rave_rd wrote:
Really, I'd hope environment was the least stressed about decision to be made. My first game was at the Wagner Mars base, and that is just an evil way to be introduced to environments (I hate you self destruct sequence)


I agree, we played on Wagner first and I think that was a mistake.

Shadrach wrote:
One thing I want to throw out here since I've read your previous thread too and something about both struck me. you may(may) be looking at Sentinels in a 'wrong' way when searching for the fun. Sentinels is *very* much a team sport. It has to be approached as such, and I don't even mean 'we all win' or 'we all lose' I mean you should measure your effectiveness, gear your thinking, and derive fun for how you contribute to the team, rather than the more standard 'I got to do a lot of cool stuff on my turn!' from most games.

I could be completely off base here, but I figured it was worth mentioning. You might've been expecting Caverna and gotten yourself into Agricola. Both good games and extremely similar, but one is not the other by a long shot ^^


I've been really happy with the responses in this thread. I was not expecting to play "God Mode" heroes, but as an example, in my third game I played as Tachyon. In this thread and the other you can find her talked up a handful of times. Unfortunately, for the one game I played her Baron constantly had Living Force Field out, and despite digging with her power nearly every turn, my hand was full of multiple Sucker Punches, Nimble Strikes, and Lightspeed Barrages that were close to completely ineffective. Then I was incapacitated almost mercifully around turn 7.

The first two games I played felt very similar to this. I have played alot of card games and I know that crappy luck just happens, but it was a first experience that left me both wanting more and with a sour taste in my mouth. I definitely hope to dive back into the Multiverse soon, and this thread has certainly whet my appetite
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
rave_rd wrote:
Really, I'd hope environment was the least stressed about decision to be made. My first game was at the Wagner Mars base, and that is just an evil way to be introduced to environments (I hate you self destruct sequence)


I agree, we played on Wagner first and I think that was a mistake.

Shadrach wrote:
One thing I want to throw out here since I've read your previous thread too and something about both struck me. you may(may) be looking at Sentinels in a 'wrong' way when searching for the fun. Sentinels is *very* much a team sport. It has to be approached as such, and I don't even mean 'we all win' or 'we all lose' I mean you should measure your effectiveness, gear your thinking, and derive fun for how you contribute to the team, rather than the more standard 'I got to do a lot of cool stuff on my turn!' from most games.

I could be completely off base here, but I figured it was worth mentioning. You might've been expecting Caverna and gotten yourself into Agricola. Both good games and extremely similar, but one is not the other by a long shot ^^


I've been really happy with the responses in this thread. I was not expecting to play "God Mode" heroes, but as an example, in my third game I played as Tachyon. In this thread and the other you can find her talked up a handful of times. Unfortunately, for the one game I played her Baron constantly had Living Force Field out, and despite digging with her power nearly every turn, my hand was full of multiple Sucker Punches, Nimble Strikes, and Lightspeed Barrages that were close to completely ineffective. Then I was incapacitated almost mercifully around turn 7.

The first two games I played felt very similar to this. I have played alot of card games and I know that crappy luck just happens, but it was a first experience that left me both wanting more and with a sour taste in my mouth. I definitely hope to dive back into the Multiverse soon, and this thread has certainly whet my appetite


None of her single punches are really great. You need to drop all of them and then smack the villain with the one that uses the punches in the discard. You can do a ton of damage, but you have to build to it! Sometimes it's worth playing those ineffective ones just to fuel your big boom.
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
often wrote:
thehorsetronaut wrote:
rave_rd wrote:
Really, I'd hope environment was the least stressed about decision to be made. My first game was at the Wagner Mars base, and that is just an evil way to be introduced to environments (I hate you self destruct sequence)


I agree, we played on Wagner first and I think that was a mistake.

Shadrach wrote:
One thing I want to throw out here since I've read your previous thread too and something about both struck me. you may(may) be looking at Sentinels in a 'wrong' way when searching for the fun. Sentinels is *very* much a team sport. It has to be approached as such, and I don't even mean 'we all win' or 'we all lose' I mean you should measure your effectiveness, gear your thinking, and derive fun for how you contribute to the team, rather than the more standard 'I got to do a lot of cool stuff on my turn!' from most games.

I could be completely off base here, but I figured it was worth mentioning. You might've been expecting Caverna and gotten yourself into Agricola. Both good games and extremely similar, but one is not the other by a long shot ^^


I've been really happy with the responses in this thread. I was not expecting to play "God Mode" heroes, but as an example, in my third game I played as Tachyon. In this thread and the other you can find her talked up a handful of times. Unfortunately, for the one game I played her Baron constantly had Living Force Field out, and despite digging with her power nearly every turn, my hand was full of multiple Sucker Punches, Nimble Strikes, and Lightspeed Barrages that were close to completely ineffective. Then I was incapacitated almost mercifully around turn 7.

The first two games I played felt very similar to this. I have played alot of card games and I know that crappy luck just happens, but it was a first experience that left me both wanting more and with a sour taste in my mouth. I definitely hope to dive back into the Multiverse soon, and this thread has certainly whet my appetite


None of her single punches are really great. You need to drop all of them and then smack the villain with the one that uses the punches in the discard. You can do a ton of damage, but you have to build to it! Sometimes it's worth playing those ineffective ones just to fuel your big boom.


This. If Tachyon isn't playing at least one card per turn(if not more!) you're doing it wrong ^^ She's about reckless abandon,not planning!
 
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
I'm not quite sure what you guys are trying to explain. I get that the 1 dmg cards are weak, which is why drawing mainly those, despite playing as many cards as I could per turn, led to a less than enjoyable first experience. I wanted to find out if I was doing something wrong in regards to set up specifically. I am now confident I just need to get back into the box.
 
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I'm not quite sure what you guys are trying to explain. I get that those 1 dmg cards are weak, which is why having a hand full of them led to a less than enjoyable first experience. I wanted to find out if I was doing something wrong in regards to set up specifically. I am now confident I just need to get back into the box.


It just seems odd that you went 7 rounds without pulling anything else, I suppose extreme bad luck might cover it. Tachyon in a normal game is pulling cards and playing them with wild abandon so I suppose you could glean 'your experience was atypical' from all our good intentioned rambles.
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
... my hand was full of multiple Sucker Punches, Nimble Strikes, and Lightspeed Barrages that were close to completely ineffective....
Did you mean Lightspeed Barrage, or something else? If you had some Burst cards (like Sucker Bunch and Nimble Strike), then your Lightspeed Barrage should have been at least a little effective, since it counts the Burst cards in your trash.
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
dthurston wrote:
thehorsetronaut wrote:
... my hand was full of multiple Sucker Punches, Nimble Strikes, and Lightspeed Barrages that were close to completely ineffective....
Did you mean Lightspeed Barrage, or something else? If you had some Burst cards (like Sucker Bunch and Nimble Strike), then your Lightspeed Barrage should have been at least a little effective, since it counts the Burst cards in your trash.


I definitely didnt mean Barrage. The most effective card i drew did 3 dmg to X targets, but that was it.

It just keeps sounding more and more like I need to slap the spandex back on
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I'm not quite sure what you guys are trying to explain. I get that the 1 dmg cards are weak, which is why drawing mainly those, despite playing as many cards as I could per turn, led to a less than enjoyable first experience. I wanted to find out if I was doing something wrong in regards to set up specifically. I am now confident I just need to get back into the box.


Huh. I dunno--did you get Pushing the Limit (play an extra card and draw an extra card each turn, and take 2 damage to pay for it every turn) and/or HUD Goggles in play (play yet another extra card each turn)? Yeah, most of her attacks don't do more than a point of damage, but you get to play up to 3 of them a turn, draw lots of cards, and do plenty of kooky things. Until you hit the main villain for 15 damage in one shot. 3 times in a row.
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
bakija wrote:
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I'm not quite sure what you guys are trying to explain. I get that the 1 dmg cards are weak, which is why drawing mainly those, despite playing as many cards as I could per turn, led to a less than enjoyable first experience. I wanted to find out if I was doing something wrong in regards to set up specifically. I am now confident I just need to get back into the box.


Huh. I dunno--did you get Pushing the Limit (play an extra card and draw an extra card each turn, and take 2 damage to pay for it every turn) and/or HUD Goggles in play (play yet another extra card each turn)? Yeah, most of her attacks don't do more than a point of damage, but you get to play up to 3 of them a turn, draw lots of cards, and do plenty of kooky things. Until you hit the main villain for 15 damage in one shot. 3 times in a row.


I got HUD in play early, by the time I drew Pushing the Limit I was between 10-12 HP and in retrospect I realize that I could (and at that point should) have played it, but it was my first game and drawing and reading it for the first time at that life total made me recoil. I know that's just part of learning the game but unfortunately my first three games all played similarly. It just has me chomping at the bit to play again... I need to find a way around this work thing...
 
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I got HUD in play early, by the time I drew Pushing the Limit I was between 10-12 HP and in retrospect I realize that I could (and at that point should) have played it, but it was my first game and drawing and reading it for the first time at that life total made me recoil. I know that's just part of learning the game but unfortunately my first three games all played similarly. It just has me chomping at the bit to play again... I need to find a way around this work thing...
One thing that may not be immediately apparent is that if you can't afford the life loss of Pushing the Limits, you can play it anyway and get one extra card out of the deal (as you destroy it at the start of your next turn).
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Re: How much fun is in the base set?
thehorsetronaut wrote:
I got HUD in play early, by the time I drew Pushing the Limit I was between 10-12 HP and in retrospect I realize that I could (and at that point should) have played it, but it was my first game and drawing and reading it for the first time at that life total made me recoil.


And also keep in mind that her buddy Tempest can heal her (and everyone else) by 2HP per turn (assuming the card in question is in play, but probably will be by mid game). While also shooting the bad guy for 7.

 
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