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Subject: Shooting at CE crew of an AFV with small arm fire rss

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Milton Soong
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In the last scenario my opponent's CE Tiger I was decimating my paras. I want to look up the rules if I can shoot small arm fire at the AFV to hope to inflict a MC or KIA on the exposed crew.

No where can find any direct mention, but this section seems to imply I can do this:

".7.307 vs Armored Targets: Small Arms and non-ordnance attacks [EXC: FT, DC, MOL, ATMM] have no effect vs armored targets but may leave residual FP. Any Vulnerable PRC in or on such vehicles are affected normally as Personnel targets [see Stun (D5.34), Recall (D5.341), Unprotected Crews (D5.311), and Bailing Out (D6.24)]."

Seems like:
a. I can aim my small arm fire at the AFV hex
b. The CE crew gets a +2 CE DRM
c. If I can cause a MC on the IFT, and he fails the MC, then that would result in a Stun.

Is this interpretation correct?
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Seth Owen
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Yes, or worse. Recall and bailing out could ultimately occur. Actually, CE a Tiger while it's within range and LOS of any small arms is a very good way to lose a Tiger tank.
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Mattias Elfström
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D5.34 and the following paragraphs describe what happens.

Fire away!
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Erwin Lau
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Don't forget the crew of Tiger have morale of 9 when taking MC.
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Milton Soong
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Thanks for all the answers...
 
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Perry Cocke
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Tanks whose armor is too strong for your puny To Kill #s are also vulnerable to HE ordnance attacks when CE via a Specific Collateral Attack; e.g., a 75mm HE hit against a tank that does not affect the tank itself might affect the CE crew via the 12 FP +2 CE DRM.
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Milton Soong
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We were playing S22 "Another Summer's Day". So my para only have Bazookas. The Tiger of course wisely stayed > 6 hexes away…

Milton

perrycocke wrote:
Tanks whose armor is too strong for your puny To Kill #s are also vulnerable to HE ordnance attacks when CE via a Specific Collateral Attack; e.g., a 75mm HE hit against a tank that does not affect the tank itself might affect the CE crew via the 12 FP +2 CE DRM.
 
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Brian Roundhill
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msoong wrote:
We were playing S22 "Another Summer's Day". So my para only have Bazookas. The Tiger of course wisely stayed > 6 hexes away…

Milton

perrycocke wrote:
Tanks whose armor is too strong for your puny To Kill #s are also vulnerable to HE ordnance attacks when CE via a Specific Collateral Attack; e.g., a 75mm HE hit against a tank that does not affect the tank itself might affect the CE crew via the 12 FP +2 CE DRM.


But if he had gotten close enough, it would be useful to remember the collateral attack. A bounced BAZ round might still break the crew. It is one of the things I do not remember enough.
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Milton Soong
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More careful reading of the rules also lead me to believe that an MG has two choices what to do against vehicle: he can

a) do the MG to-hit roll, and then trying to use the MG to kill mechanism. Then followed by a collateral attack. Or

b) he can just use it as small arm fire, (maybe bunching it up with other small arms fire in a FG), take the +2 CE DRM, and then hoping for a KIA on the IFT for a stun/shock result.

I have not worked out the odds yet, but b) seems like a better odds to get something to happen (though both are probably snake eyes territory)...

Milton
 
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Martin Vicca
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When swatting at tigers, b is your only option.
When dealing with early war armour, then a can be a viable alternative.
MG penetration of 4 is not great but +2 for range 0-1 and a -1 for rear target aspect can result in a net 7. If the tank has only weak armour that can be a good odds kill.
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Brian Roundhill
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msoong wrote:
More careful reading of the rules also lead me to believe that an MG has two choices what to do against vehicle: he can

a) do the MG to-hit roll, and then trying to use the MG to kill mechanism. Then followed by a collateral attack. Or

b) he can just use it as small arm fire, (maybe bunching it up with other small arms fire in a FG), take the +2 CE DRM, and then hoping for a KIA on the IFT for a stun/shock result.

I have not worked out the odds yet, but b) seems like a better odds to get something to happen (though both are probably snake eyes territory)...

Milton


With MG low TK values, the are only useful against tin-cans. A 4FP MG needs a 4 or better for an NMC with a +2 modifier, and will get a final TK value against armour of 1-3, depending on range and facing. Ironically, LMGs are better used against the armour because of their low firepower.
 
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