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King of Tokyo: Halloween» Forums » Rules

Subject: Pirate Costume vs. Robot Costume rss

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Joe Salerno
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The Pirate costume states 'When you deal damage steal 1 energy from each monster you damaged.'

The Robot costume states 'You may choose to lose energy instead of life.'

Suppose a monster wearing the Robot costume has only one energy in his possession and another monster wearing the Pirate costume damages him. Does the Robot-monster get to lose his one energy in lieu of losing a point of life before the Pirate-monster steals it, or does the Pirate-monster steal the energy before it can be used to absorb the damage from the attack?

Thanks in advance for any input on this.
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Culp Smash
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Pirate: When you deal damage steal 1 energy from each monster you damaged. This implies, in my opinion, damaging for 1 AND THE ADDED BONUS FUN of stealing 1 energy cube. Two "effects."

So... usually the attacked player must do two things: give up 1 energy and "take damage."

However, yay, in this case he's dressed as a Robot. If he had only 1 energy, then that's the 1 stolen, and he must also take the damage dealt, because he has no further energy to give in lieu of a life point for that damage (that "second" effect"). Remember, it states "lose energy instead of life" (implying "...when you are damaged") not "trade energy for never being damaged in the first place."

To further clarify, if he had 2 total, the first would be stolen and he could choose to use the second to avoid the damage and not love life points.

That's how I read it. Don't know if it helps you make a choice though. Good gaming!
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Michael Nerman
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I disagree, but don't pretend to know the official ruling, if there is one.

Choosing to lose energy instead of life is a substitution effect and I assume that choice happens before the damage is dealt. The pirating happens when the monster is damaged, so I would assume that is triggered by the damage, and so happens after it is dealt. Thus, the robot could choose to lose the energy and wouldn't have any for the pirate to steal.
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Culp Smash
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nerman8r wrote:
I disagree, but don't pretend to know the official ruling, if there is one.

Choosing to lose energy instead of life is a substitution effect and I assume that choice happens before the damage is dealt. The pirating happens when the monster is damaged, so I would assume that is triggered by the damage, and so happens after it is dealt. Thus, the robot could choose to lose the energy and wouldn't have any for the pirate to steal.


Fair point. Wording, wording. It is a quandary. So you could house rule it, maybe?
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Jonah Rees
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nerman8r wrote:
I disagree, but don't pretend to know the official ruling, if there is one.

Choosing to lose energy instead of life is a substitution effect and I assume that choice happens before the damage is dealt. The pirating happens when the monster is damaged, so I would assume that is triggered by the damage, and so happens after it is dealt. Thus, the robot could choose to lose the energy and wouldn't have any for the pirate to steal.


I agree with this interpretation too. Pirate costume allows you to steal energy after you've done damage, but Robot allows you to lose energy instead of life. If you do the latter than you don't take the damage (because you haven't lost life) and therefore the Pirate isn't damaging you.
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Michael Nerman
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Incredible Culp wrote:
nerman8r wrote:
I disagree, but don't pretend to know the official ruling, if there is one.

Choosing to lose energy instead of life is a substitution effect and I assume that choice happens before the damage is dealt. The pirating happens when the monster is damaged, so I would assume that is triggered by the damage, and so happens after it is dealt. Thus, the robot could choose to lose the energy and wouldn't have any for the pirate to steal.


Fair point. Wording, wording. It is a quandary. So you could house rule it, maybe?

House rule is a good option. The problem is that KoT has so many corner cases. I wish they would publish an official FAQ for people to print out.
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Joe Salerno
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Thank you for the excellent input! I lean toward the interpretation that the damage is mitigated by the energy cube first, and then the act of causing damage triggers the Pirate's ability. The question would then be what does "cause damage" mean? Does causing damage result in lost life points, or does the loss of life points mean that damage was caused. Which comes first? Wording, wording indeed. House ruling seems the best option.

I emailed Richard Garfield to see if he would give his opinion, but I imagine he has a million emails of the sort coming his way and would be hard pressed to answer them all.
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Michael Nerman
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2Ravens wrote:
I emailed Richard Garfield to see if he would give his opinion, but I imagine he has a million emails of the sort coming his way and would be hard pressed to answer them all.

That's a great idea! Maybe if enough people pester him, he'll write a FAQ before making the *next* expansion!
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Matthieu BONIN
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nerman8r wrote:
2Ravens wrote:
I emailed Richard Garfield to see if he would give his opinion, but I imagine he has a million emails of the sort coming his way and would be hard pressed to answer them all.

That's a great idea! Maybe if enough people pester him, he'll write a FAQ before making the *next* expansion!
Working with him on an official FAQ for the game is one of my resolution for 2014, supposing I find sufficient time to gather, sort out and sum up all the questions out there... blush
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True Blue Jon
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Mattintheweb wrote:
Working with him on an official FAQ for the game is one of my resolution for 2014, supposing I find sufficient time to gather, sort out and sum up all the questions out there... blush


I'm sure there are enough fans here that could do that for you.
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Michael Nerman
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Mattintheweb wrote:
nerman8r wrote:
2Ravens wrote:
I emailed Richard Garfield to see if he would give his opinion, but I imagine he has a million emails of the sort coming his way and would be hard pressed to answer them all.

That's a great idea! Maybe if enough people pester him, he'll write a FAQ before making the *next* expansion!
Working with him on an official FAQ for the game is one of my resolution for 2014, supposing I find sufficient time to gather, sort out and sum up all the questions out there... blush

Woot! Just so you know, despite my grumbling, I love the game. I just bought Power Up and the Halloween expansion. I would make a FAQ myself if it didn't seem like such a massive job. Plus, I'd be guessing for most of it.
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Joe Salerno
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Ditto on loving the game.
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Isaac Campos
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jonahmaul wrote:
nerman8r wrote:
I disagree, but don't pretend to know the official ruling, if there is one.

Choosing to lose energy instead of life is a substitution effect and I assume that choice happens before the damage is dealt. The pirating happens when the monster is damaged, so I would assume that is triggered by the damage, and so happens after it is dealt. Thus, the robot could choose to lose the energy and wouldn't have any for the pirate to steal.


I agree with this interpretation too. Pirate costume allows you to steal energy after you've done damage, but Robot allows you to lose energy instead of life. If you do the latter than you don't take the damage (because you haven't lost life) and therefore the Pirate isn't damaging you.

The way we play this combo is such as no matter how much energy the Robot player is paying, he is still damaged.

Because when damage is prevented the cards use the word "ignore" and Robot is not ignoring damage, it's just using energy instead of hearts.
 
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