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The Lord of the Rings: The Card Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: A clarification on the "discard" mechanic rss

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Alessandro Coli c/o Eastbiz Corp.
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Hi,

I have problems understanding the discard mechanic. Some of the player cards say something similar to

1) Action: discard this card / some other card to do something
(example: Rearguard)

while some other player cards very clearly say

2) Action: discard FROM HAND this card / some other card to do something (example: Eowyn)
3) Action: discard FROM PLAY this card / some other card to do something
(example: Beorning Beekeper)

So i wonder: when the cards just say "discard" without specifying "from where" (case 1), can the action be triggered discarding both from hand and from play?

Or ONLY from hand?

Or is it implicit that - when you discard - you always discard from play unless clearly written in the card as with Eowyn (i.e. you HAVE TO play the card - paying for it - before you can discard it) ?

Thank you!
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Andrew B
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Discard with no other text specified, I assume, as a general fact, that it is from hand.
 
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Wiedewiet
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andrewbwm wrote:
Discard with no other text specified, I assume, as a general fact, that it is from hand.

Or from the Encounter deck straight to discard pile. This mechanic is used to discern between drawing cards and 'revealing' them ('When Revealed' effects DO trigger) vs. drawing cards and not triggering the 'When Revealed' effect (but you do use other info on the cards). The Hide X effect for instance tells you to discard X cards, and only check their Threat level.

Edit: My apologies, the Hide X effect explicitly states to discard from the Encounter deck, so my reply was off topic. It's also my interpretation that when no location from which to discard is given, it's implied that you discard from hand.
 
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Scott Wheelock
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andrewbwm wrote:
Discard with no other text specified, I assume, as a general fact, that it is from hand.


I'd go the other way. "From play" should always be assumed. Rear Guard would have you discard an ally from play.

The Riddermark's Finest is meant to be discarded from play, even though it doesn't specify.

The list could go on.
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Adrian Teroux
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For Riddermark's Finest, it makes perfect sense to discard the card from play, since the actions required are both "exhaust and discard". The only way to do that is if the card is already in play.

To answer the original poster's question, please refer to page 25 of the rulebook, under "In play" and "Out of Play":

Quote:
“Out of play” states are “in a player’s hand,” “in a deck,” or “in a discard pile.” Card effects do not interact with cards in an out of play state unless the effect specifically refers to that state.


Underline mine.

Thus, the event card Rear Guard must interact with a card in play.
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Alessandro Coli c/o Eastbiz Corp.
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Hi, thank you all for the answers!

I think that the last answer leaves no room for further doubts: i had not noticed that in the rules.

So by saying "discard from play" or by just saying "discard" is the same thing. I wonder why in Beorning Beekeper they bothered to write "from play" clearly then, if it was implicit.

Anyway, i think that its not pointed very "clearly" in the rules: such a mechanic - quite common in the cards - would deserve a little paragraph by its own, while it has been addressed in a couple of "general", easy to miss and not apparently related lines.
 
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Alessandro Coli c/o Eastbiz Corp.
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Mmmm i answer to myself.... thinking about it, the pointed lines in the rules dont completely address my issue...

In fact, these lines


“Out of play” states are “in a player’s hand,” “in a deck,” or “in a discard pile.” Card effects do not interact with cards in an out of play state unless the effect specifically refers to that state.


say that a card action "discard" does not allow you to discard OTHER cards, unless they are in play.

What about the cards that say "discard THIS card to do something"? These cards - if you discarded from hand - would not interact with cards in out of play state, simply because they would not interact with cards at all... so, for those, could you discard from hand even if not written?

Maybe this is the reason why - for Beorning BeeKeeper - they bothered to write it clearly in the card: "discard FROM PLAY this card...."
 
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Douglas Tempel
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The wording to discard "Beorning Beekeeper" from play seems unnecessary, IMO. It requires the use of the card's Action, and the card HAS to be in play in order to use its Action.
 
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Brendon Russell
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verdealex79 wrote:
In fact, these lines

“Out of play” states are “in a player’s hand,” “in a deck,” or “in a discard pile.” Card effects do not interact with cards in an out of play state unless the effect specifically refers to that state.

say that a card action "discard" does not allow you to discard OTHER cards, unless they are in play.

What about the cards that say "discard THIS card to do something"? These cards - if you discarded from hand - would not interact with cards in out of play state, simply because they would not interact with cards at all... so, for those, could you discard from hand even if not written?

You're misinterpeting (perhaps just overthinking) the rules - the word "other" isn't in the rules, you added it. A card effect can interact with the same card it's written on, there doesn't have to be a different card involved.

Quote:
Maybe this is the reason why - for Beorning BeeKeeper - they bothered to write it clearly in the card: "discard FROM PLAY this card...."
Unfortunately you can't read too much into the specific wording on any cards in this game, even if you compare them to other similar cards. There are lots of examples of poor or inconsistent wording, especially from earlier in the game's history. In the case of Beorning Beekeeper, the wording on the card is just more explicit than it technically needs to be.
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