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Subject: Who has the better Gorn Design? rss

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Larry DeStefano
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What is the better Gorn ship design overall please vote.
  Your Answer   Vote Percent Vote Count
FASA's Box like Gorn
12.5% 7
STAR FLEET BATTLES
37.5% 21
TOS remastered WIZ KID design.
50.0% 28
Voters 56
This poll is now closed.   56 answers
Poll created by hadrian132
Closes: Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:00 am
 
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Nova Cat
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For the wizkids model, we've only seen the CG mock- up, which we know from previous experiences is not an accurate indication of what the real product will look like.
 
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Larry DeStefano
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Well this is more about overall design so the detail may not be as clear. But if wizkids used the fasa or SFB design they would look better as CG as well. The Fasa design is more like a flying brick, and the SFB design is like a cross betwewn fed and romulan and not very satisfying IMHO. So work with what we got and take it from there.

LIVE LONG AND PROSPER.
 
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Michael Ptak
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How about another option for Klingon Academy/Starfleet Command models? Maybe it's because they were the first Gorn ships I saw, but I liked them the most.

FASA Seemed too unimaginative and Starfleet Battles felt too same-y across the fleet.
 
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Larry DeStefano
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Norsehound wrote:
How about another option for Klingon Academy/Starfleet Command models? Maybe it's because they were the first Gorn ships I saw, but I liked them the most.

FASA Seemed too unimaginative and Starfleet Battles felt too same-y across the fleet.


Dont remember the Gorns from Starfleet coomand? what did they look like?
I agree with you as far as FASA and SFB goes.
 
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Xander Fulton
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Norsehound wrote:
How about another option for Klingon Academy/Starfleet Command models? Maybe it's because they were the first Gorn ships I saw, but I liked them the most.

FASA Seemed too unimaginative and Starfleet Battles felt too same-y across the fleet.


Have you seen the new Gorn since ADB 'remastered' them via their Mongoose partnership?



...I think those came out well.
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Larry DeStefano
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XanderF wrote:
Norsehound wrote:
How about another option for Klingon Academy/Starfleet Command models? Maybe it's because they were the first Gorn ships I saw, but I liked them the most.

FASA Seemed too unimaginative and Starfleet Battles felt too same-y across the fleet.


Have you seen the new Gorn since ADB 'remastered' them via their Mongoose partnership?



...I think those came out well.


Not bad way better then the FASA design, still like the Wizkid TOS approach better only because way back when SFB said they wanted the Gorns as a cross between the Federation and Romulan designs (and I think it is) just seems a little meeh to me. But hey thats just a matter of personal taste no right or wrong here!!!(LOL)

Live Long and prosper
 
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Dave Benhart
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I'm fond of the SFB Gorns, but that's mostly nostalgia. I liked the idea of naval "broadsides" that their ships tried to implement even if sometimes it didn't work out too well.

Which design is better? That's hard to say. Anyone have a link to the FASA design because I don't remember it.
 
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Larry DeStefano
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On the net look up FASA star trek and you will several sites that have almost all the FASA material that was printed as far as the ships go...Plus a lot of fan based and fan designed material as well. Hope this helps.
 
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Michael Ptak
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Lets see if I can find some examples of the Klingon Academy / Starfleet Command designs...



Gorn Cruiser



A Gorn Dreadnought

I felt these were good TMP counterparts if one believed the SFB ones were TOS era. I did see the makeover to the SFB models from ADB, but I don't even like the physical arrangement of the ships as much. Plus if you look at one Gorn ship, you've basically looked at them all. It's a common problem the SFB lineage has with the Kzinti, Lyrans, Klingon, and Gorn.
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Daniel Hensel
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Norsehound wrote:
Lets see if I can find some examples of the Klingon Academy / Starfleet Command designs...



Gorn Cruiser



A Gorn Dreadnought



And one of the newer destroyers.

I felt these were good TMP counterparts if one believed the SFB ones were TOS era. I did see the makeover to the SFB models from ADB, but I don't even like the physical arrangement of the ships as much. Plus if you look at one Gorn ship, you've basically looked at them all. It's a common problem the SFB lineage has with the Kzinti, Lyrans, Klingon, and Gorn.

These SFC Gorn ships just never really made much sense to me design-wise, especially the one that looks like a brick asymmetrically sliced almost all the way down lengthwise.

When I look at the FASA design, I think "barge" or "freighter". I don't think "capital ship".

The upcoming WizKids model design looks more Romulan-inspired than anything else, and has way too high of a nacelle-to-hull ratio for my taste. In my opinion, it would be a much better design if you double the size of the primary hull and lop off the two upper nacelles.

The SFB designs don't wow me either, but they're the most reasonable-looking and balanced of the designs. That's where my vote went.
 
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Randy Grundstrom
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Norsehound wrote:
Starfleet Battles felt too same-y across the fleet.


Actually having ships look alike across your entire fleet makes sense. You take one design and modify it depending on the mission you want it to do. It also allows for ease of manufacture of ships.
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FASA Gorn are bricks on warp nacelles. Just plain boring and silly.

SFB Gorn are not silly, but look way too much like slightly reconfigured Earth ships - just make the saucer sections convex and rotate the warp engines 90 degrees (and violate the Roddenberry rule of warp nacelles while you're at it).

WizKids/TOS Remastered Gorn look kinda fussy and delicate for what I would expect of their race, but make sense in universe and are not too derivative of anything else we have seen.
 
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Michael Ptak
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zathras23 wrote:
Norsehound wrote:
Starfleet Battles felt too same-y across the fleet.


Actually having ships look alike across your entire fleet makes sense. You take one design and modify it depending on the mission you want it to do. It also allows for ease of manufacture of ships.


To me it shows a lack of imagination :\ At least their fed ships show a greater degree of difference than different scales of ships.
 
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When I first saw the Star Fleet Battles SSDs and the counter silhouettes way back in the 1970s, I wasn't that impressed with the Gorn designs.

BUT - when the miniatures came out, and they put the engines on the top and bottom, I fell in love with the designs. If only because they were the first to break the paradigm of side-by-side warp engines.

I thought they worked perfectly for TOS. With a little more detailing, they would have worked in any era.

For me the modular construction was similar to the Federation - common hull and engine components, used to make variations of design.


FASA - flying bricks? Only the Borg build them uglier.

TOR-Remastered - how many nacelles do we need? Add a few extra for good measure.

SFC Video Games - OK, those FASA designs are starting to look pretty good now...
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Dan Evans
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I'm unfamiliar with the FASA and SFB designs. Anyone have a comparison?
 
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Daniel Hensel
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Cassiel33 wrote:
I'm unfamiliar with the FASA and SFB designs. Anyone have a comparison?

FASA Gorn



Star Fleet Battles Gorn
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Xander Fulton
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Mr_Tricorder wrote:
Star Fleet Battles Gorn


Those are their older, 1980s designs.

As noted, they've updated them, including some style differences within the designs to even show the distinction between "pre-war" and "war mass production" ships...

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Ghostrunner wrote:

BUT - when the miniatures came out, and they put the engines on the top and bottom, I fell in love with the designs. If only because they were the first to break the paradigm of side-by-side warp engines.


But... but... but according to the sacred scriptures of Gene, it is said, and I quote (kinda):
Lo, your warp nacelles shall come in pairs.
Verily nothing shall sit betwixt thine nacelles.
And fer chrisake's leave the Bussard collectors a clear line of sight to the stuff you're supposed to be collecting!

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adorablerocket wrote:
Ghostrunner wrote:

BUT - when the miniatures came out, and they put the engines on the top and bottom, I fell in love with the designs. If only because they were the first to break the paradigm of side-by-side warp engines.


But... but... but according to the sacred scriptures of Gene, it is said, and I quote (kinda):
Lo, your warp nacelles shall come in pairs.


Thus came the first heresy of Franz Joseph, and he said let there be ones and threes as well as twos.

adorablerocket wrote:
Verily nothing shall sit betwixt thine nacelles.


And then was born the heresy of Doug Drexler, who ordained: let us make a ship so tiny the nacelles will be buried in its bosom, but none shall care for much rear end it will kick.

adorablerocket wrote:
And fer chrisake's leave the Bussard collectors a clear line of sight to the stuff you're supposed to be collecting!


And to play havoc with this decree there arose Greg Jein, who said thein Enterprise is so passé - we shall blow it up asunder and replace it with a ship twice as large and with Transwarp Drive so it requireth no Bussard Collectors.

And then there was a cry of lament from the fans, and the heretical ship was stricken by the Scott, and Enterprise came to be again.
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Xander Fulton
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To be fair, the Franz Joseph designs came first.

It was actually in RESPONSE to the Franz Joseph designs that Gene came up with his famous 'even number of warp nacelles, must have line-of-sight between then, don't obstruct the front' policies.

Apparently, he had taken a rather hard turn to Hippy-dom in the late 70s/early 80s (obviously seen in the direction TNG took with its "kids and families on the ship" approach) and was rather put off by Franz Joseph's tech manual continuing the somewhat-more-military/naval interpretation of Star Fleet. So he came up with that rule to specifically invalidate the Franz Joseph work from canon.

EDIT: And it shows a bit in how the movies progressed, too. "The Motion Picture" was his baby, and he was quite proud of it...but it was a bit expensive for its box office take (although it was profitable), so the studio pulled in a lot of the reigns from his control when turning STII over to Harve Bennett. And Roddenberry famously took issue with a lot of the 'more military/naval' aspects of that film - ultimately a fan favorite, but one of the films he liked the least (as I recall, the only one he lived to see that he hated MORE was 'The Undiscovered Country'...he just hated seeing Star Fleet portrayed as a military organization, although that's plainly how it was written in the Original Series)
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XanderF wrote:
To be fair, the Franz Joseph designs came first.

It was actually in RESPONSE to the Franz Joseph designs that Gene came up with his famous 'even number of warp nacelles, must have line-of-sight between then, don't obstruct the front' policies.


I'd never heard that before. The rationale is plausible given his philosophy.

I'd love to learn more. Do you have some sources?
 
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TNG broke their own paired nacelle rule with ships found in the Wolf 359 Ghost fleet in Best of Both Worlds. These were specifically the Niagara and Freedom classes with three and one nacelle respectively.



Another ship in the graveyard is the Challenger class, which breaks the LOS rule (Neither nacelle can see one another though the secondary hull)

Even later they did it with the "All Good Things" enterprise, and tried to pass it off by saying the third nacelle had "double warp coils".

Part of the reason I think the KA gorn are kinda cool is that their technology is so different they don't have what commonly resemble warp nacelles except on the Gorn Cruiser.
 
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Norsehound wrote:

Even later they did it with the "All Good Things" enterprise, and tried to pass it off by saying the third nacelle had "double warp coils".


As I understand it, the retcon is that all TNG era Galaxy class kitbash designs feature double warp coils, including the Galaxy class.
 
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Justin Powell
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Star Trek Online Gorn, problem being they're 80 years in the future. Of course, we have ships spanning a hundred years or more.

 
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