Ben Michels
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I haven't been able to find an answer to this question on the forums or in the official FAQ/rulebook, so I thought I'd see what other people think. My group is going to play Death on the Wing during our next session, and I'm looking for ways to keep Belthir alive passed the first hero turn. I'm using "The Fallen Elite" plot deck which contains the card "Dark Champions":

"Exhaust this card after setup of an encounter. While this card is exhausted, each master monster gains +2 Health and adds 1 additional brown die to its defense pool. Each of its attacks gains surge: +2 damage."

The rulebook states that "Lieutenants are represented on the map by lieutenant tokens, but they are treated as monster figures for all purposes—including figure activations, unless specified otherwise." The lieutenant pack rules state that "An agent is treated as a master monster within its open monster group", but I don't know if that would apply to lieutenants.

So anyway, what does everyone here think, or can someone point me to an official ruling as to whether lieutenants included in a quest (not summoned agents) are considered master monsters? Also, if anyone has any ideas for how to keep Belthir alive past the first hero turn (I've read a lot of people saying the heros can kill him turn 1), let me hear it. This will be the second quest, so I have 2XP and 6 threat (I killed all the heros once for threat in our first quest) to work with.

Thanks in advance!
 
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Damien M
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Salt Lake City
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Re: Are lieutenants (not agents) master monsters?
No, Lieutenants are just considered Monsters. Neither minion nor master.

AFAIK.
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Darren Nakamura
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Columbus
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Re: Are lieutenants (not agents) master monsters?
stormzbowler wrote:
So anyway, what does everyone here think, or can someone point me to an official ruling as to whether lieutenants included in a quest (not summoned agents) are considered master monsters? Also, if anyone has any ideas for how to keep Belthir alive past the first hero turn (I've read a lot of people saying the heros can kill him turn 1), let me hear it. This will be the second quest, so I have 2XP and 6 threat (I killed all the heros once for threat in our first quest) to work with.


Draw out Encounter 1 as long as you can to draw cards (or ideally, win Encounter 1). Save your Tripwires and Pit Trap for Turn 1 of Encounter 2. Use them on the Melee attackers (preferably those with low Awareness).

Buy Dark Fortitude (Warlord 1) and Dark Resilience (Universal 1), and use them on Belthir.

As above, effects that apply to Master monsters would not apply to Lieutenantns.
 
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Billy Babel
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Guymon
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Re: Are lieutenants (not agents) master monsters?
ugh this is probably the worst designed mission in the entire game. Played this against logan as treasure hunter, so he can't be immobilized and has super high awareness for all traps. He stamina moves over, and uses his heroic feat to attack 3 times in a row, encounter lost before I can even do my first turn.
 
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Darren Nakamura
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Re: Are lieutenants (not agents) master monsters?
That reminds me, Web Trap (Saboteur 1) would also be a good purchase, depending on your heroes' skills and attributes. If they have low Might in general, you might be able to keep most of them in the starting area with it.
 
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Ben Michels
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Re: Are lieutenants (not agents) master monsters?
I was thinking about Web Trap. Here's a question though, would you all consider the heroes being placed on the map as entering an empty space? I'm just wondering if there is a way to play the card so that all 4 heroes have to do the might check.
 
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Darren Nakamura
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Re: Are lieutenants (not agents) master monsters?
No, placing heroes on the map does not count as entering empty spaces. The most you can hit on turn 1 of the encounter is 3 heroes, and that's only if a back-row hero moves first and enters an empty space in front of the front-row heroes. Usually, you can only hit two of them with it on turn 1, because usually the front-row heroes act first.
 
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Ben Michels
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Just to close the loop on this issue/question, everyone that responded was correct. Here is the official response I got from FFG:

"Although Lieutenants are considered to be monster and have their own monster group, they are neither masters nor minions. Therefore, anything that interacts with master/minion monster does not work for lieutenants."
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Riccardo Simoni
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stormzbowler wrote:
Also, if anyone has any ideas for how to keep Belthir alive past the first hero turn (I've read a lot of people saying the heros can kill him turn 1), let me hear it. This will be the second quest, so I have 2XP and 6 threat (I killed all the heros once for threat in our first quest) to work with.


What worked out very well for me is the Splig plot deck. Although I (obviously) lost enc I, I managed to save Belthir's 'nether parts' by playing on him Feral Instincts at the start of the encounter giving him Wilderness traits (Use this card after setup of an encounter to choose one of your monster groups. During this encounter, that group gains the Wilderness trait) and as soon as he got attacked the first time I played Dive into cover allowing him to move away 3 spaces and, more important, giving him an extra black die for the rest of heroes' turn.



Also, very important is the Elemental initial positioning. You need them to hide Belthir completely forcing the heroes to kill either one before being able to attack the LT. In my case that was a futile attempt though as among the heroes there was Steelhorns that can move monsters away by using his heroic feat.
 
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