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UFO Defense Protocol» Forums » General

Subject: BIG question about this game.... rss

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J B
United States
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I am very interested in this game, but I have a BIG reservation to investing in the kickstarter or buying it when it comes to retail stores...

That reservation is the native language of its creators. I know the game's creators are French-speaking, and I admire their efforts to learn another language so I hate to say it, but the kickstarter reads very poorly. That worries me, because I feel like it means the cards and rulebook will also be disjointed and awkwardly translated.

If this game is being designed and built by a team that doesn't speak English as their native tongue, I really hope they get native English speakers to proof-read before they go to print. I really want to like this game and invest in it, but that kickstarter page hurts my brain. PLEASE find someone that speaks English to check things before you publish! And please have that person correct your kickstarter page to reassure backers!

As is, there's no way I will buy this or invest....a sloppy kickstarter page is too telling.
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Thomas
Germany
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Also, a delivery date of November 2015 (!) is way too long. Sounds like they have no idea how to manufacture this game ... yet.

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Hank Bao
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I'm less worried about the quality of the English on the page. After all, it's not that expensive to simply hire a professional editor to look over everything prior to release.

I'm interested, but very hesitant about the funding structure. After all, if retail is going to be US$70 anyway, why should I spend $70 now for a game that I won't get to play until 2015, and not get any of the stretch goals for it?

From that perspective, there is absolutely zero incentive for me to gamble my money on a product if I can just wait for the product to release and buy for the same price!

That being said, the concept is pretty cool and I'm a huge fan of X-Com. If they had more sensible pricing structures, I'd give this a second look.
 
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J B
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disguise wrote:
I'm less worried about the quality of the English on the page. After all, it's not that expensive to simply hire a professional editor to look over everything prior to release.

I'm interested, but very hesitant about the funding structure. After all, if retail is going to be US$70 anyway, why should I spend $70 now for a game that I won't get to play until 2015, and not get any of the stretch goals for it?

From that perspective, there is absolutely zero incentive for me to gamble my money on a product if I can just wait for the product to release and buy for the same price!

That being said, the concept is pretty cool and I'm a huge fan of X-Com. If they had more sensible pricing structures, I'd give this a second look.

Sadly it seems too many companies skimp on hiring good translators or editors. Sometimes I feel like games need to just be given what years ago we used to call the "wife test." I'm aware that term is from a more sexist era, but the idea is still relevant. It is the concept of just running something from work by someone not in any way associated with the project so they can find errors that folks too close to the design and manufacture of the thing can no longer see. I think a LOT of games could benefit from that.
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Christophe Finas
France
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Hi people,

Thank you for exchanging about the game.
I will try to answer all these questions!

Feel free to continue speaking freely about the game.
Don't mind me - I'm not here... I'm invisible...


- Translations:

I've been alerted on these issues!

Right now we have two times more EU backers than US backers ; so it seems that this is a confirmed problem for our american playerbase, or all native english people.

There will be proof-reading of all game materials that will be sent to production. I don't want any awkward sentence to be into the game!

However, I won't trust professional translators on that... and that's from experience. You may read more about this below!

Spoiler (click to reveal)

I've hired professionals before for other games I published - people who worked in the industry and also translated whole published books - and I can tell that's not a good way to do things.

Simply put, professionals can be wrong and you just won't know anything about it. And don't trust that because they translated whole books or other stuff, they can do well with your specific board game.

I've had a german translator failing to accurately translate the end game objective of a previous game. On release day, german players came to me, so that I could explain the real rules to them. I can tell I was dismayed.

Instead, I plan to hire an editor to correct all sentences. Then find player to help us review all texts. I will trust a native-language review panel to tell me if things are understood correctly.

Of course it's possible nowadays to easily get all texts clear and revised.

And I am very sorry if the Kickstarter page feels awkward. I've exchanged with american people for 14 years but it's possible I udnerestimated these issues.

I'll try to have that page revised as soon as possible, but unfortunately the native US people on staff have a game developer profile more than an editor profile. Feel free to help!




Price and value:

- The retail price will be at 90$. 70$ is saving money; and of course, it's supporting the project, making it possible... and receiving the game possibly months before others do!

I expect backers to receive the game 3 months on average before people receive it from their retailers. And that will possibly be more.


Please click below to see more about it.


Spoiler (click to reveal)
Retail release might be delayed a lot from backers distribution. For retail we need to confirm distributors.

And the likely scenario is that distributors will wait for the release box, then get shipped, then will contact and ship retailers. The first shipment they usually get is of several dozen units (or one to three hundreds) and sometimes that's not enough to cover all retailers. Overall, you can expect from 2 to 5 months on average before it gets to your retailer, and it's of course possible that :

1) the distributor doesn't get it shipped there ;
2) there is no distributor that confirmed it yet in your specific country or location ;
3) and we might not sell the game ourselves from any online mean at release, for some months, as brick & mortar retailers often do not like that.


Also, I expect to provide more and more value to the Agent, Frontline and Director packs. Additional exclusive miniatures for these packs have been added two days ago (as stretch goals) and I expect to add more bonuses, as stretch goals or not.


- Why End 2015?

Delay of manufacture & customs is only 5 months or less, and current quotes for the game are very positive. So once sent to print, I expect only 5 to 6 months!


That could be soon. Why 2015 then?
Click below to read more about it!


Spoiler (click to reveal)
This is because I want time to make more artworks, more sculpts, more contents and more playtests. Funding will go into that, actually. And since it is a big game with many materials, making prototypes for playtests and reviews takes a lot of time.

That's more a designer request. The Kickstarter funding will help us produce these prototypes & send them out. By prototypes, I don't mean wooden cubes and sketches on a paper; I mean something that feels like the game, and can be played at Essen 2014 for a real experience.

Without funding, the game will not exist, and with funding the game will follow an "improving the content" course and then a "full production" course.

The earliest window to receive the game would be if I send to print in November 2014 (instead of march). Then we could expect to receive the game six months earlier than what is currently announced.

That's a quite possible scenario, but I can't foretell the future, so I proposed an end 2015 deadline to make sure I would not disappoint our backers.



I hope these answers helped!
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Thomas
Germany
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Thanks for the extensive information. The game looks really cool.

However I think the fact that you have to wait almost two years for the game to come out will make many skip this kicksarter project.


Not many gamers want to wait for a boardgame that long. I think one year is tops.

Let's hope there are lots of long-term backers out there!
 
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Adam Fortney
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Evansville
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Telparion wrote:
I hope these answers helped!

I'm sorry, but no. There is absolutely no incentive to throw my money at a project that's nearly two years from completion. Kickstarter backers have come to expect a little something extra for their efforts and patience. No stretch goals and a long wait isn't worth saving what you're saying will be twenty bucks when I can wait for retail and order online at what will probably be a much higher discount. You say that if we don't back, the project won't come to fruition, well, that's on you. And it's not looking very promising so far. If it isn't funded, I hope you reconsider your pricing structure (a la Fireteam Zero) and try again.

Rant complete.
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J B
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I'm not particularly reassured on the translation front either. Oh well. I won't back, but I promise I will take a look at this if it comes to press.
 
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Craig W
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Agreed. I feel like this Kickstarter would be better off running in late 2014 or early 2015, with the same projected delivery date. Development is just not far enough along for anyone to be confident enough to back it.

It's a great idea, but the creators are jumping the gun.
 
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Christophe Finas
France
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I understand your points.

I placed the delivery date as June, 2015, as I can estimate to send everything to print before the end of this year. That's 15 months.

I also released a gameplay presentation, which is now available on project page. (can't link it here as it's not a youtube or vimeo video)


I am not selling a game, like a store or publisher with enough funds would already (as we tend to see these times on KS - thus transforming the KS objective) ; I am giving life to a game, as a designer.

I understand things may not feel perfect. We try to do these to our best, and we'll make sure to correct & fix anything you might feel necessary.

I hope the last updates are already in the right direction!


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Christophe Finas
France
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@ Adam Fortney

The pricing structure was actually the same as Myth:
70$ for the box (without stretch goals)
100$ for the box + stretch goals


It worked very well even if they announced a retail price of 85$. Not many people were interested in the 70$ pledge; but that was because of the value the 100$ pledge had.


The main differences are elsewhere: once over-funded, Myth could add much value to the stretch goals. When they ended up over 900 000 $, you could have an incredible number of bonus miniatures for the 100$ pledge (close to 150+), and still none for 70$. I intended to follow the same route.

I believe this is a successful route, but I need to address the other issues mentioned by the community; these issues prevented the US community from joining, even if the EU community supported the game more.

A few models and sculpts are already on their way. But it seems that one of the main things that was felt differently, is the foreign-aspect of the designer & writing. It's sad, but of course there are solutions to that.


And I will think about adding a little "something special" to the 70$ pledge too, for it to feel more "Kickstartish"


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