Recommend
1 
 Thumb up
 Hide
14 Posts

Star Wars: X-Wing Miniatures Game» Forums » Strategy

Subject: Imperial list for tournament on Saturday rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Jim Chadwick

Charlotte
North Carolina
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Hi All,

I used to play X-wing and was pretty good in my local area. That was 9 months ago and the local scene dried up where I live. It's since started again, but I'm behind the ball for Wave 2 stuff. I'm still trying to get back into it without bumping into myself, but I'm getting the hang of it. The type of list I always did well was:

Darth Vader w/ Concussion missile
Backstabber
4 various Academy or Obsidian

I put the two named on the flanks and was able to swoop in and do damage. I was pretty canny with mopping up, even when I only had a couple of ships left. The problem that I am finding with the new ships is that I don't do enough damage fast enough. I can't take out an enemy ship before enough damage is done to me. I'm thinking it's mostly to do with B-wings. The last list I fought was 2 Xwings and 2 B wings with heavy lasers. It crippled me before I could get close. I figured I need more missiles, but I don't own any Wave 2 stuff. Tie Advanced are too expensive, so I spent money I don't have tonight on a Tie Bomber. Here's the list I'm thinking of taking.

Darth Vader w/ Concussion Missile and Swarm Tactics
Scimitar Squadron Bomber w/ Concussion Missile and Cluster Missiles
Dark Curse
2 x Academy Ties

The idea is to have Vader and the Bomber shoot Concussion Missiles at the enemy as soon as possible to destroy or cripple a ship. I've gotten good with Dark Curse leading the distraction Ties forward and him being the only one in range on the dangerous approach. With all the enemy firing at range 3, he usually does very well. Once I take out an enemy ship fast, it should be easier to pick apart the enemy. Even if I just take out a Rookie, it would help my cause.

Why put the Cluster Missiles on the Tie Bomber? Well, once I'm in range, I'll need to be effective. Firing the cluster at ships with 1 Evade die should do the trick, especially if I am able to give Vader's pilot skill to him. I'll hit a B wing or YT-1300 to hurt it.

I'd really appreciate some input as I don't have much time to practice. Oh....and I don't own any more Wave 2 ships. So...no shuttle or more bombers. No cards that come with any of them, either. I don't own them.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Robert M.
United States
Michigan
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmb
The problem with your first list is that "naked" TIE Fighters sometimes struggle to deal damage, as you've found. Substituting Howlrunner for Backstabber will do a lot there.

The second list will have a similar problem, after the missiles are away--and the missiles on the Scimitar Squadron Pilot won't be terribly reliable. If I were tweaking that list, I'd remove Dark Curse and put a Black Squadron Pilot with Squad Leader in his place; that will help make sure you can actually hit what you're aiming at with the TIE Bomber. Otherwise, I've flown a similar list in the past and you can certainly win with it, but you'll need luck with your missiles and good flying to pull it off. Best of luck.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Wilder

Daly City
California
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Within the parameters of what seems to be your preferred type of squadron, I'd go with something like this. It isn't hugely powerful, but it's incredibly flexible, and with even average green dice, fairly durable.

The idea would be for Vader to release the Assault Missiles in the engagement round, then hook the Scimitar up with a TL in the second round. If Backstabber, Dark Curse, and the AP are doing their jobs, the Bomber should survive to release the Clusters (hopefully on a low-Agility target).

Scimitar Squadron Pilot — TIE Bomber 16
Cluster Missiles 4

Darth Vader — TIE Advanced 29
Squad Leader 2
Assault Missiles 5

"Backstabber" — TIE Fighter 16

"Dark Curse" — TIE Fighter 16

Academy Pilot — TIE Fighter 12

One of my favorite squads ever -- I call it "A Murder of Crows" -- is:

Vader + Engine + Expert Handling (35)
Dark Curse + Stealth (19)
Backstabber (16)
Soontir Fel + PTL (30)

I won a lot of games with that one before the YT-1300 got so popular.

A good defensive variant was dropping EH from Vader, changing Backstabber to Night Beast, and putting Stealth on Fel. You want to throw a defensive Night Beast and Dark Curse in your opponent's face, and if the dice fall okay (and you're not facing a YT-1300), Vader and/or Soontir will be your end-game ships, where both are really tough to bring down.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jim Chadwick

Charlotte
North Carolina
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
@Vorpal Sword: No one in an Imperial list gets targeted faster than Howlrunner. In fact, in the ordnance thread people talk about taking Howlrunner just to distract. I don't think she's worth it at all, especially for dropping missiles.

The problem with changing out Dark Curse for the Black Squadie is that he's not going to be near the bomber. Dark Curse and the 2 Academy move up the front slowly while Vader and the Bomber flank for missile shots.

Jeff Wilder wrote:
Within the parameters of what seems to be your preferred type of squadron...


With the tournament on Saturday and most likely not getting a practice game in, I want to stick close to what I know. One body of Ties with a flanking force. I understand it and am good at it.

Jeff Wilder wrote:

Scimitar Squadron Pilot — TIE Bomber 16
Cluster Missiles 4

Darth Vader — TIE Advanced 29
Squad Leader 2
Assault Missiles 5

"Backstabber" — TIE Fighter 16

"Dark Curse" — TIE Fighter 16

Academy Pilot — TIE Fighter 12


Hmmm....I do have an extra point for an assault missile. I think that might be a better move! I want to give the Bomber a concussion missile, though, as I want him to shoot at the same round as Vader. Have the Bomber shoot before Vader (with Swarm Tactics) to burn any focus, then fire the Assault Missile. This way, Vader has a better chance of finishing off whatever he's firing on.


Jeff Wilder wrote:

One of my favorite squads ever -- I call it "A Murder of Crows" -- is:

Vader + Engine + Expert Handling (35)
Dark Curse + Stealth (19)
Backstabber (16)
Soontir Fel + PTL (30)

I won a lot of games with that one before the YT-1300 got so popular.

A good defensive variant was dropping EH from Vader, changing Backstabber to Night Beast, and putting Stealth on Fel. You want to throw a defensive Night Beast and Dark Curse in your opponent's face, and if the dice fall okay (and you're not facing a YT-1300), Vader and/or Soontir will be your end-game ships, where both are really tough to bring down.


That's part of the problem that I have with smaller and elite lists for the Empire. Fewer ships and less room for error. Lose one ship and you are toast. Also, the problem I've been running into is the Rebels having larger ships with more shields and hull points. That's why the dual missile fire in the opening salvo can really cripple the enemy. Even if used to just take down a Rookie, they will be down one ship.

One question.....do Assault missiles damage shields with their blast? Or straight to hull points (please be hull points....please be hull points)?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matthew Cordeiro
United States
Cumberland
Rhode Island
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
heychadwick wrote:
@Vorpal Sword: No one in an Imperial list gets targeted faster than Howlrunner. In fact, in the ordnance thread people talk about taking Howlrunner just to distract. I don't think she's worth it at all, especially for dropping missiles.

If you don't have Howlrunner, then the bomber becomes target #1, with your opponent hoping to shoot it down before it fires the missile. If you bump a ship and lose an action, or if you find yourself in range 1, the bomber is a sitting duck, especially with only 2 agility and no shields to absorb crits. Howlrunner a) puts your opponent in a "pick your poison" situation and b) gives your TIEs an offensive boost after the alpha strike. I can see not using Howlrunner if you have a lot of ordnance, but 2 missiles total on the bomber/Vader list still means the vast majority of your shots are primary weapon attacks.

On a non-bomber, TIE swarm squad, Howlrunner is practically a must-have.

heychadwick wrote:
The problem with changing out Dark Curse for the Black Squadie is that he's not going to be near the bomber. Dark Curse and the 2 Academy move up the front slowly while Vader and the Bomber flank for missile shots.

Why not fly them in formation? The TIE and the bomber have a similar enough dial to fly them in formation at least through the alpha strike.

heychadwick wrote:
One question.....do Assault missiles damage shields with their blast? Or straight to hull points (please be hull points....please be hull points)?

Shield first, then hull.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matthew Saville
Wales
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
I've been playtesting this version recently, looks a little simmilar to yours.

Vader - Expose, Assault Missiles

Mauler Mithel - Squad Leader

Dark Curse

Scimitar Squadron - Assault Missiles x2



Mauler is there to give you a way to offload the Scimitar's Missiles
early as possible, then conveniently forgets he has Squad Leader and
does what Mithel does best.

Vader can launch his own missile, then uses Expose for long range
sniper fire, or punishing anyone he gets behind.

Curse is Curse, and you can be as obnoxious as you like with him.

This list tore apart a 2X 2Y Rebels, as their sheilds evaporated on the first turn.
Really mauled up a 2B 2Y too, although that one was a little tougher to deal with
& was more down to my above average dice rolling.


This may help, or not, but I know it really hurts Agility 1 lists.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Dunford
Canada
Kemptville
Ontario
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
cordeiro wrote:
heychadwick wrote:
One question.....do Assault missiles damage shields with their blast? Or straight to hull points (please be hull points....please be hull points)?

Shield first, then hull.


Yep. If it says "deal damage" or "suffers damage" then you resolve damage the way you would as for an attack: shields first, then hull, which might be face down or face up if critical. If it says "damage card" (and might additionally specify face-up), then you assign a damage card, even if shields remain. Here is the text of Seismic Charge and Proton Bomb, as examples of both the former and latter, respectively:

3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jim Chadwick

Charlotte
North Carolina
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
@cordeiro:
The biggest problem I’ve had as an Imperial player is how to make that first approach without losing too much.  The Rebels can dish out the damage on the first run and can usually kill a ship, if not more.  So, I’ve developed systems that usually work for me.  It’s primarily been a body of Ties and a flanking force.  It’s important to know how to approach, as well.  I’ve gotten pretty good at figuring out how and when our ships will meet at Range 3.  That’s why I like Dark Curse in the main body to be the only guy who hits the range 3 on the main body.  It usually gives the Rebels a lot of headaches trying to hurt him at Range 3 with no other targets.  I can then bring in the flankers at Range 3 and deliver the payload of missiles. 
 
In my suggested list, I worry that the “main body” will have enough guys to threaten.  I’m used to the flanking force having a higher Pilot Skill and getting placed later, after my opponent has committed.  With the PS 2, that will be blown.  Still, I believe that I can slow the flanking force down enough to get in Range 3 to fire the payload of missiles.  With Squad Leader on Vader, I’ll get to go before most pilots to shoot the missiles.  So, even if the main enemy formation moves on the Bomber, I can get that shot off on that first turn before I’m blown.  That’s the main issue for the Bomber.  I just gave him the Cluster Missiles in case he lives longer. 
 
Why not fly in formation?  Because that’s how I lose Tie Fighters.  It’s that initial pass that is hard for me.  Using the two groups has been the best strategy that I’m familiar with.  Can I develop another one?  Sure.  In time for tomorrow’s tournament?  No.  So…I go with what works for me now.  I used to be good 8 months ago and won or came in the top 3 for all the tournaments in my local area (8-10 people).  I’ve found that surviving the initial pass then puts the Tie Fighters in the best spot. 
 
@StuffyDoll:  I’m just not comfortable with 4 ship Imperial builds.  They are so fragile and if you lose one, you are so far behind.  I like to factor in some loses and cheap Academy and Obsidians are best for me (with some characters).   I’ve done well with an Academy or two in the last little melee swirling.  Also, I happen to like to have at least one Academy to stuff in front of the enemy and choke up their movement.  I love it when I can clog their formation and they all bump into each other because I stick an Academy or two in their way.  Works great for the YT-1300. 
 
Thanks iNano78 and cordeiro for the clarification on the Assault Missile.  I do wonder, though, if the Assault is better over the Concussion?  I tend to roll average at best, so turning the blank into a hit is amazing for me.  If I am hinging a lot on this initial shot, shouldn’t I ensure that I’ll actually do some damage?  Argh…..better averages for the chance to do more damage overall. 
 
I do like Swarm Tactics with Vader and can boost those Academy up once the furball starts.
 
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Dunford
Canada
Kemptville
Ontario
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
heychadwick wrote:
Thanks iNano78 and cordeiro for the clarification on the Assault Missile.  I do wonder, though, if the Assault is better over the Concussion?  I tend to roll average at best, so turning the blank into a hit is amazing for me.  If I am hinging a lot on this initial shot, shouldn’t I ensure that I’ll actually do some damage?  Argh…..better averages for the chance to do more damage overall. 


Assault Missiles have the potential to do the most damage in a single shot. I've done 6 damage with each of 2 Assault Missiles in one match before. It was pretty epic! But they're the hardest Missile to hit with,* since they don't come with any built-in modifiers (like Proton Torpedoes/Concussion Missiles/Homing Missiles (which leaves you with your Target Lock)). Assault Missiles are best if you have a Focus to spend, and perhaps a reroll from Jonus. Thus, it's usually best to put Assault Missiles on Vader or a ship with Push the Limit (Rhymer; a Firespray); otherwise, you have to be patient and save your Target Lock for a turn.

* - Actually, Cluster Missiles are also hard to hit with, especially against high-agility targets, if you don't have some external way to modify them (e.g. Jonus, Marksmanship, a Focus token, etc).
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Wilder

Daly City
California
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
heychadwick wrote:
I tend to roll average at best, so turning the blank into a hit is amazing for me.

If it makes you feel better, everybody in the entire world -- literally everybody -- tends to roll average.
6 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jim Chadwick

Charlotte
North Carolina
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Just wanted to say THANKS to everyone who posted. The event only had 5 people show up, which sucks for being short one. The first game I played against an elite list of 4 with tons of stuff, including Cloaking Devices. In my approach, Vader was within 1 of the guy and didn't fire missiles. The Concussion cleared off the dodge and focus that the guy had through PTL. Vader fires and gets 3 hits! The other guy dodged all three....

Through the mix up, I flubbed one round with Vader and managed to only get 1 evade on 5 dice vs. 2 hits. A few others pinged him down until he eventually was killed. I blew up an Obsidian and Mauler Mithel. The Interceptor had 1 hull point left. Vader and 1 left and I was just set up to fire 4 Tie Fighters at range 1 at Vader's rear (with no shots back). The timer went off! We played it and I would've blown him in 30 seconds. As it was, we tallied points. I killed 32, but my Vader was worth 35. I lost! I was destroying him, but didn't kill enough in time. Ugh. A lose.

Next round had me sitting out. Only one guy won two complete victories for 10 points.

Third round I played against another guy who was 1/1. I Got Vader's missile off early and crippled an Xwing, but the Bomber didn't get to fire yet. His Cluster did manage to ping the last shield off the B wing. I then was able to finally get a shot off with the last Concussion missile and blasted the B wing down. Win for me.

So, the other guy scored 3 wins and got 15. I got two wins for 10 and came in 2nd place.

Thanks!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
J Chav
United States
Taylorsville
Utah
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Aren't you supposed to finish the round...
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Wilder

Daly City
California
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Danath wrote:
Aren't you supposed to finish the round...

I was wondering about that. I figured he was describing how things were set up at the end of the turn.

In case that's not true: When time is called, you're supposed to finish the current turn.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jim Chadwick

Charlotte
North Carolina
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
...... really?

SHAZBOT!!!!!! cry
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.