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Suburbia» Forums » Rules

Subject: Question about Casino and PR Firm rss

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Colin Booth
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I was wondering if the PR Firm and Casino conditional powers are applied retroactively to all red lines that have been passed, or only to red lines that are crossed after the tile has been placed. I can see arguments for either:

The argument for is that the vast majority of tiles have their conditional effect affect the game retroactively (Power Stations immediately increase your income by +3 if you have three yellow tiles in play when the Power Station is built) and there is nothing on the tile or the manifest that explicitly states that it only takes effect for later line crossings.

The argument against is that the initial tile play would be a significant bump in earning power or growth potential, that it makes sense within the theme of the game (definitely for PR Firm, less so for Casino), and tiles that are only affected by later tiles are in the game.

If it wasn't for Skyscraper and Fancy Restaurant, I'd say that the conditional was for all red lines crossed since the start of the game. But since those two tiles have conditionals that only care about changes after they are built it muddies the water some.

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Brent Mair
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Roy
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Only from the moment you place the tile. I can see the argument otherwise but it isn't how it is meant to be played.
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Stephen Rochelle
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Perhaps it makes more sense if you consider that no tiles are "retroactive" -- when you place Power Plant, you don't actually care about the sequence of your yellow tiles, or the fact that you began the game with some but built others. You just have some on the board right now, regardless of how or when they came to be there.

Likewise, when you build PR Firm, you have a population at some value, and nothing cares about the history of that population. If, however, placing PR Firm causes the population to move and cross a red line (because you stuck it beside a Condo or something), that text will start applying from that moment forward.

This can be particularly important when you start hitting the edge of the income or rep track -- there is a particular order of resolution, none of which cares about past history or retroactive calculation.
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Colin Booth
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Thanks!

Stephen: I guess retroactive is the wrong word. Most tiles with a conditional evaluate the entire board state when played, as well as reevaluate that state every turn for changes based on the Tile Effect Resolution Order. My question really was: does PR Firm/Casino take current board state into account when played (like most conditionals) or does it only trigger on changes? (which has been answered as "triggers on changes only").

I think what was happening is that I was giving the phrase "after you pass each |" an overly liberal interpretation and thinking about it as "for each | passed" instead. With a strict reading there is still some ambiguity (the non-ambiguous statement would be "for each | passed after building") but it's a significantly longer stretch for the super broken interpretation.
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Steve Yates
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There are a few different classes of tiles and they act in different ways. The different behaviors are easy to understand when considered thematically.

Most tiles that interact with each other complement or negatively impact each other in some way. These are normally order independent. Having a park next to a residential area improves your borough's Reputation. It does not matter whether the park was there first or whether it was later added. Similarly, schools will attract families to your residences, whether they are built first or later.

From the questions that get posted here, these tile interactions seem to be difficult for many to understand. People often ask if the power of a tile gets reactivated for every tile adjacent to it, or just the new one. There is no reactivation at all, you are just scoring the benefit (or penalty) of the interactions between the new tile and any existing tiles that interact with it in someway. Interactions only between existing tiles have already been accounted for.

Certain other tiles (Fancy Restaurant, Skyscraper, etc.) only interact with new tiles placed after it. A new Fancy Restaurant is a big draw and increases your income by 3. If another restaurant opens later (even if it is just a Fast Food Restaurant), the original is no longer the "New Hotness" and no longer contributes such a steady stream of revenue, so your Income decreases.

The Casino and PR Firm are something else. They both have an immediate cost in terms of Reputation or Income, but then provide a benefit of mitigating some of the negative effects of your city getting bigger. They can't solve any past issues but can help things going forward.

There's probably a couple other classes I didn't mention. Suburbia always impresses me how all of the tile effects just seem to make sense thematically.
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