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Subject: *Just which* A&A should I get? rss

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Jeremy Beaver
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Perusing the wiki page, there are *tons* of editions out there that I'm really unsure as to what to get. I need to know which VERSION to go after. I am not looking whether the game is worth my time or not...it has the "Axis & Allies" title on it and that's good enough for me.

However, I'd hate to buy the incorrect version so I'm hoping someone here can help me out; I'm definitely looking for:

1) seamless gameplay + rules
2) as historically accurate as much as possible


That said, I own the *original* A&A board game (1984 MB Classic).

I'm going to list the released A&A games and if there are any 2nd editions, I'll point it out:


'84 A&A Classic (own)

'99 A&A Europe (released as 2nd edition '12 as AA Europe: 1940)

'01 A&A Pacific (released as 2nd edition '12 as AA Pacific: 1940)

'04 A&A D-Day (own; is there *any* plan to release this as a 1940 version?)

'06 A&A Battle of the Bulge (a must-own for me, specific operations)

'07 A&A Guadalcanal (a must-own for me, specific operations)

'08 A&A Anniversary Edition (Avalon Hill)

'09 A&A: Spring 1942

'11 A&A: 1941

'12 A&A: 1942 (2nd edition)

'13 A&A: World War I (a must-own for me)

So, with this massive list, as far as I can tell, the games to own based on VERSION are:

A&A Europe 1940 (2nd edition)
A&A Pacific 1940 (2nd edition)
A&A D-Day (own)
A&A Battle of the Bulge
A&A Guadalcanal
A&A World War I

I'm confused as to which of the following I should own for the BASE version of the Axis & Allies line.

'08 A&A Anniversary Edition (Avalon Hill)
'09 A&A: Spring 1942
'11 A&A: 1941
'12 A&A: 1942 (2nd edition)

Would it be the '12 AA: 1942 version that is the "ultimate" version to own in terms of owning the basic A&A game with updated units and the latest revised rulebook?

Lastly, are the following ever going to get updated? Europe & Pacific eventually did...twice as the 1940 versions. I'd hate to get 'em only to have a "1940" version released in a year or two:


A&A D-Day
A&A Battle of the Bulge
A&A Guadalcanal
A&A World War I

Thanks in advance!
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I really enjoy playing A&A D-Day and A&A Battle of the Bulge... the global and theater games are fun but require a longer play window.
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Moshe Callen
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I think Axis & Allies: Pacific is arguably the best of the series even now.
 
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Kevin Chapman
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1942 (2nd edition) is the current "flagship" game. 1941 is more of an "introductory" game, with simpler rules and fewer pieces.

FYI, Europe 1940 and Pacific 1940 are not "2nd editions" of the original Europe and Pacific games - they are completely different games. Be aware that there are 1st and 2nd editions of both Europe 1940 and Pacific 1940 (the 2nd editions are better).

There are no plans to update D-Day, Bulge, or Guadalcanal. These games are all currently out of print.

As for 1914, only the future will tell.
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Moshe Callen
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For A&A 1914, go look at my review.
 
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I first bought and played the actual flagship 1942 2nd Ed. - it offers a good value and complexity for the money, I think.
I played the Axis and was destroyed by the Allies after a few rounds of bad purchasing and bad dice rolling. The was frustrating, but the more I read about A&A strategies the more I think that I will have a lot of fun playing this game in the future. So after all I immediately bought Europe 1940 2nd Ed. and Pacific 1940 2nd Ed. - the latest versions - for the "grand AA experience".
 
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Jeremy Beaver
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Krieghund wrote:
1942 (2nd edition) is the current "flagship" game. 1941 is more of an "introductory" game, with simpler rules and fewer pieces.

Just what I needed to know, thanks.

Quote:
FYI, Europe 1940 and Pacific 1940 are not "2nd editions" of the original Europe and Pacific games - they are completely different games. Be aware that there are 1st and 2nd editions of both Europe 1940 and Pacific 1940 (the 2nd editions are better).

Good to know; would it be redundant to own Europe/Pacific and Europe/Pacific 1940? Or are they scenarios at least 3-5 years apart, considering the "1940" tag?

Quote:
There are no plans to update D-Day, Bulge, or Guadalcanal. These games are all currently out of print.

These small windows into specific operations of the war, especially that of the Eastern Front, are my favorite types of wargaming; not updating them will just be fine with me.

Quote:
As for 1914, only the future will tell.

See above


Thanks for your help since it boils down to:

A&A (1984 Classic, gotta own/keep this)
A&A: 1942 (2012 2nd edition)
A&A Europe (1999)
A&A Europe: 1940 (2012 2nd edition)
A&A Pacific (2001)
A&A Pacific: 1940 (2012 2nd Edition)
A&A D-Day (2004)
A&A Battle of the Bulge (2006)
A&A Guadalcanal (2007)
A&A World War I (2013)

This list enables one to own "everything" A&A related, correct?

Furthermore, Global War is just pairing up the Europe & Pacific game boards, yes?

Again, thanks in advance!
 
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Jeremy Beaver
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whac3 wrote:
For A&A 1914, go look at my review.
And that is one hell of a review.

I'm going to be reading it, all right!
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Kevin Chapman
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beaverpapa wrote:
would it be redundant to own Europe/Pacific and Europe/Pacific 1940? Or are they scenarios at least 3-5 years apart, considering the "1940" tag?

It wouldn't necessarily be redundant. The original Europe starts on the eve of Operation Barbarossa, and the original Pacific on the eve of Pearl Harbor. The 1940 games start earlier, with the US and USSR still neutral. They are very different experiences. Also, the 1940 games can be combined, while the originals cannot (at least not easily).

I agree with Moshe that the original Pacific is one of the better A&A games. Europe, not so much.

beaverpapa wrote:
Thanks for your help since it boils down to:

A&A (1984 Classic, gotta own/keep this)
A&A: 1942 (2012 2nd edition)
A&A Europe (1999)
A&A Europe: 1940 (2012 2nd edition)
A&A Pacific (2001)
A&A Pacific: 1940 (2012 2nd Edition)
A&A D-Day (2004)
A&A Battle of the Bulge (2006)
A&A Guadalcanal (2007)
A&A World War I (2013)

This list enables one to own "everything" A&A related, correct?

Pretty much, except that there are a large number of folks who think that the Anniversary Edition is the best A&A game of all. They feel it hits the "sweet spot" between 1942 and 1940. It's just hard to find one for a reasonable price.

Also, if you're a "piece junkie" you may want to pick up 1941 just for the sculpts it has that you won't find in any other game (Tiger tanks, etc.).

beaverpapa wrote:
Furthermore, Global War is just pairing up the Europe & Pacific game boards, yes?

Yes.
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Why no mention of the 2004 AA Revised edition?
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Moshe Callen
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Sappington wrote:
Why no mention of the 2004 AA Revised edition?

[flame-retardant suit]Because it's just not that good of a game.[/flame-retardant suit]
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beaverpapa wrote:

Thanks for your help since it boils down to:

A&A (1984 Classic, gotta own/keep this)
A&A: 1942 (2012 2nd edition)
A&A Europe (1999)
A&A Europe: 1940 (2012 2nd edition)
A&A Pacific (2001)
A&A Pacific: 1940 (2012 2nd Edition)
A&A D-Day (2004)
A&A Battle of the Bulge (2006)
A&A Guadalcanal (2007)
A&A World War I (2013)

This list enables one to own "everything" A&A related, correct?

Furthermore, Global War is just pairing up the Europe & Pacific game boards, yes?

Again, thanks in advance!

Just to confirm, I think the Original "Classic Game" is listed here on BGG as 1981 if you are trying to figure out what version you have, but was first published by MB in 1984. It has its own entry here:

Axis & Allies

That was the first version many of us played many years ago.

One you don't have is the version under the entry we are talking under the forums here: Axis & Allies Revised

It is the 2004 version. Most people call it Axis & Allies Revised, and they even name it that way on the Avalon Hill (Hasbro) website. It came out under the Avalon Hill Games, Inc. label.

Many people, but not everyone of course, think it was the best version until Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition came out (and some people still like it better than Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition).

Once Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition came out, it was limited in release and went out of print. Larry Harris added some of the features in Anniversary to the current versions.

So basically this is what I have as a list, just to clarify:

Older Versions:
Axis & Allies (Original Version; 1984 for MB)
Axis & Allies: Europe
Axis & Allies: Pacific
Axis & Allies (Revised Edition 2004)
Axis & Allies: D-Day
Axis & Allies: Battle of the Bulge
Axis & Allies: Guadalcanal
Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition

Current Versions:
Axis & Allies: 1942 (Current Flagship Edition; get 2nd Edition)
Axis & Allies 1941 (Like a Novice/Gateway Version)
Axis & Allies Pacific 1940 (Get Second Edition)
Axis & Allies Europe 1940 (Get Second Edition)
Axis & Allies: WWI 1914

Axis & Allies Pacific 1940 and Axis & Allies Europe 1940 can be combined together to form what people call Axis & Allied Global 1940. That is the biggest version to play with the most rules. It is the closest version to Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition.

Here is a link to Larry Harris' page, and they also describe the different editions:

http://www.harrisgamedesign.com/phpBB3/index.php
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Kevin Chapman
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Sappington wrote:
Why no mention of the 2004 AA Revised edition?

It's out of print, and it's been replaced by the far better 1942 2nd edition.

droberts441 wrote:
One you don't have is the version under the entry we are talking under the forums here: Axis & Allies Revised

It is the 2004 version. Most people call it Axis & Allies Revised, and they even name it that way on the Avalon Hill (Hasbro) website. It came out under the Avalon Hill Games, Inc. label.

Many people, but not everyone of course, think it was the best version until Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition came out (and some people still like it better than Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition).

Whenever I hear someone sing the praises of Revised, I always have to ask if they're talking about the OOB rules or the Larry Harris Tournament Rules. There were many problems with the OOB rules, and LHTR fixed them.
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1. Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition is your first pick.
2. Axis & Allies Revised 2004 is your second pick. LTHR!
3. Axis & Allies: 1942 2nd Edition is your 3rd pick.
 
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erna3113 wrote:
1. Axis & Allies Anniversary Edition is your first pick.
2. Axis & Allies Revised 2004 is your second pick. LTHR!
3. Axis & Allies: 1942 2nd Edition is your 3rd pick.


Why are you putting the Revised 2004 version in top of the 1942 2nd Edition?
Better rules? Better pieces? Better gameplay?

I ask, because I own the Revised 2004 version and thinking about replacing it with the 1942 2nd edition...

 
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Revised second edition or anniversary edition if you wanna get a little more spendy. Stay away from D-Day and Battle of the bulge, not great offerings. Pacific and Europe are fun, although I found Europe to be pretty unbalanced.
 
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erna3113 wrote:
2. Axis & Allies Revised 2004 is your second pick. LTHR!
And where do I find the LTHR?

It surely isn't in my 2004 Revised rulebook...
 
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beaverpapa wrote:
erna3113 wrote:
2. Axis & Allies Revised 2004 is your second pick. LTHR!
And where do I find the LTHR?

It surely isn't in my 2004 Revised rulebook...
Went to his website and downloaded the LTHR 2.0 PDF and it's just...the 2004 Rulebook, practically verbatim...
 
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There are some differences. This chart should help you to see them. The Anniversary Edition is also compared/contrasted in the chart. Since the core rules of AA42 are very similar to those of the Anniversary Edition, the chart also offers insight into the differences between AA42 and Revised/LHTR.
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Krieghund wrote:
This chart should help you to see them.

Thank you; that was helpful!
 
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whac3 wrote:
Sappington wrote:
Why no mention of the 2004 AA Revised edition?

[flame-retardant suit]Because it's just not that good of a game.[/flame-retardant suit]


Curious about this. I own 2004 revised and would like to know if it's worth replacing with a newer version. What are the perceived flaws of Revised?
 
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Magnus Maximus wrote:
whac3 wrote:
Sappington wrote:
Why no mention of the 2004 AA Revised edition?

[flame-retardant suit]Because it's just not that good of a game.[/flame-retardant suit]


Curious about this. I own 2004 revised and would like to know if it's worth replacing with a newer version. What are the perceived flaws of Revised?

I think it attempts to fix things that weren't problems in the original/Gamemaster version. (Yes, I know the original strictly speaking had A-bombs.)

1. Revised introduced the idea of victory cities. It was really an attempt to make a game about hat-ifs more historical and so thee really aren't that many. The rules don't specify how many to play to but most people settled on 9. It makes gameplay much less flexible but really doesn't improve historicity. The thing is though that historicity was never a problem for the original as it was always about modeling one specific aspect of the war. Later games therefore use mny more VCs to restore some of the versatility.

The set up of units is designed from the mistaken point of the view that the original favored the Axis. That's just wrong. To win at the original A&A, the Axis have to hit hard and fast. If they don't lay the groundwork of victory in the first few rounds, they never will. On the whole therefore the game favors the Allies, not the Axis. Hence in Revised the Allies re simply favored even more. Axis victories are not impossible but for competent players they're a whole lot more rare.As I say that's compared to a game that already favored the Allies.

Then of course the black-colored seas etc of the board are just awful. It's enough of an A&A game that it's playable but it is easily the weakest of the series-- which is to say it's the least good of a collection of fine games.
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I have definitely noticed that it's hard to win as Axis - it didn't bother me too much as that seemed historical enough. I'm curious now to try the newer versions to compare. Did they go back and attempt to restore the better balance of the original in the 1942 version?
 
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Magnus Maximus wrote:
I have definitely noticed that it's hard to win as Axis - it didn't bother me too much as that seemed historical enough. I'm curious now to try the newer versions to compare. Did they go back and attempt to restore the better balance of the original in the 1942 version?

I don't know. I own the original, revised, the anniversary edition, Pacific, Europe and 1914. I don't own any of the 1942 series.
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Magnus Maximus wrote:
Did they go back and attempt to restore the better balance of the original in the 1942 version?

Yes, but be sure to get the 2nd edition of 1942.
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