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Subject: Relic Knights SDE Exclusives to be available at retail rss

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Jonah Rees
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This has been discussed in another thread but in case anybody doesn't keep abreast of all the threads and only browses new ones I thought this would be a good topic to start a new thread for. Soda Pop Miniatures have confirmed via the Forgotten King Kickstarter that the Kickstarter Exclusive Relic Knights promos will now be available at retail once the KS orders for Relic Knights have been fulfilled:

Forgotten King Kickstarter FAQs wrote:
Are the Relic Knight, Super Dungeon Explore models available in this Kickstarter?

The Relic Knight SDE models will not be part of this Kickstarter. However, we have come to the decision that AFTER all Relic Knight backers have received their entire pledges we will make them available through our web store.


I imagine that this is going to cause a bit of a shit storm and likely a lot of mud slinging between SPM and CMON regarding who's responsibility it is to ensure items remain exclusives and who has broken this exclusivity promise.

Personally I think it's a good thing that they're going to be available to stop people scalping and make them available to all those who want them. Although to somewhat contradict myself I think that if something is labelled exclusive it should remain so. But weighing up my two lines of thought I am on the make them available side of the fence, even though it potentially puts me in an awkward position as I allowed several people to piggy back on my pledge for them.
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Frank Franco
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Fuck exclusives.
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Aaron Seymour
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I agree with the sentiment of the other poster. If they make available all the game-play components that are out of print or exclusive, I might consider buying the game. I hate it when a company Kick Finishes a project with exclusives, in order to reward its backers and encourage pledges, thus punishing anyone who would otherwise have purchased it at retail. Why would an anal-retentive completionist such as myself ever buy a CMON product at market?
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Lester Festertester
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Yep! KS Exclusives are incredibly bad future retail sales!! Look at Zombicide!! Failed so badly at retail it had to kickstart not one, but TWO expansions. And the Exclusives from the second kickstarter made the game sell so poorly that they are now working on a competitive version to make up for the devastatingly bad sale of the previous sets!! I hope that does not have any exclusive because I don't know how CMON will survive the losses!(sarcasm)
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Hijo de Cain
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CMON have make a lot of money with Zombicide, but I will never buy a retail game of them, and probably none of my gamers friends.

It have no sense.

Look AQ, 21 extra heroes, a complete expansion, a better box just exclusive. So why I should pay the same money to get the half?

Same happen with Rivet Wars, maybe here there are less exclusives and more free stuff, I'm agree with that politic

And of course what about Zombicide Season 2, there is no reason to buy it at retail. You are loosing tons of content.

I would like to know the game sales of those games. Anyway I'm quite sure CMON will still do it more and more times, this is very profitable to them, at least on KS campaigns.

I don't like exclusive politics, I prefer free stuff. But this is just my point of view.
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Jonah Rees
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HijodeCain wrote:
I would like to know the game sales of those games. Anyway I'm quite sure CMON will still do it more and more times, this is very profitable to them, at least on KS campaigns.


Guillotine Games have stated numerous times that the original Zombicide has sold far more at retail than it did during the KS so the exclusives certainly didn't have an affect on the impact of that game. It's probably too earlier to know for the second one though or Rivet Wars.

I agree that the number of exclusives CMON offer in their KS is ridiculous though.
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JR Wr
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Well, I'm glad they are getting released for the sake of my fellow gamers being able to get them.

But it passes me off personally that I shelled out the $60 so long ago that get these on the premise that I wouldn't be able to get them later on.

Granted I'll get them sooner.
And probably cheaper as I imagine.
I'm figuring about $15 each.

And I imagine it'll irritate everyone who I helped piggy back on.

But for everyone else, I'm happy they are getting general release.

As for the amount of exclusives.
Yeah, they are crazy.

AQ looks great.
And I wanted it.
The ONLY reason I was tempted to do the KS at all was because of the amount of exclusives.
And that's why they did it. To get people to back.

But won't back it until I know about the shipping cost.
Which means odds are I'll miss out on the KS deal.

Which means I'll NEVER buy the game.
I really love complete experiences.

I came into Battlelore and Heroescape late and paid a small fortune for complete collections. Minus the Aqualia expansion.
And those weren't exclusives, just out of print.
Exclusives are viewed worse.

And considering that AQ exclusives affect game play, it's a no go for me.
I'll not pay 5 times the price for the complete experience.

I'm to the point, where if a project has more than token exclusive, I won't back it on principle.
I don't like the thought of late comers missing out on massive amounts of play value.
A character or couple things, cool.
But to the point to where half the figures released for a game are KS exclusive and can never be had again?

Nope.

Look at at the new SDE expansion.
No exclusives, and it's banking.
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Chad Caughmann
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jonahmaul wrote:
I imagine that this is going to cause a bit of a shit storm and likely a lot of mud slinging between SPM and CMON regarding who's responsibility it is to ensure items remain exclusives and who has broken this exclusivity promise.


If I were Soda Pop, I'd blame it on CMON by default. CMON gained a reputation for stretching the meaning of "limited" or "exclusive" after a sale long before Kickstarter was a big deal.
 
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Ron Price
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As somebody who expended (a small amount of) effort to get a set via one of the generous sponsors on this site who added to their pledge for others, I approve of this heartily. I've already got mine, but I'm not excited that they're exclusive.

I've got "all the stuff" for Zombicide and I love it (the stuff, that is--not the having of it). Do I feel like I "need" it? No--but evidently I do, because I keep buying into the Kickstarters. I skipped Arcadia Quest and Rivet Wars because the add-ons seemed sort of like extortion--"get it now, son, or you may never be able to!"--and now it's unlikely I'd ever buy the games knowing how much is out there that I can't* get.**

What bugs me most, though, is that if I love the game, and I play it with people who also love it, I have to explain to them that they can't buy the game we just played. It's less of a big deal now with Zombicide, since there's a lot more of it out there, but it was a big deal when the game first came out and more than half the survivors were unavailable at retail.

I want to buy a game, not join a club. And I'm supporting the new SDE Kickstarter partly to help them show that you don't have to flood the project with exclusives to get people to back it.


* Yes I know, "secondary market... willing to pay... not their fault you missed out, etc.,"

** I realize as well that I'm a crazy completionist. What can I say? When I get into something, I get into it.
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Magic Pink
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ropya wrote:


And I imagine it'll irritate everyone who I helped piggy back on.


Speaking as one of those, not at all. I'm thrilled they won't be exclusives; they're a terrible idea.
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Deft Titan
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I'm one of those that is going through a BGG member to get the FK models. It certainly is hoop to jump through. It's a little annoying, but I won't lose sleep over it.

The annoying part is that I feel CMON & SPM both are too wishy-washy on what they say. They say one thing, change their mind, go a different direction. You gotta keep a business alive, I suppose, but I just don't trust anything as written in stone anymore.

I have to wonder if the FK models are a limited run. After the stock sells out in the store, will they make more and keep selling? I ask because we all knew they would sell the excess kickstarter models at conventions anyway, this just opens it up to everyone that can't make it to a convention.

DT
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Jonah Rees
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DeftTitan wrote:
I have to wonder if the FK models are a limited run. After the stock sells out in the store, will they make more and keep selling? I ask because we all knew they would sell the excess kickstarter models at conventions anyway, this just opens it up to everyone that can't make it to a convention.

DT


Judging my the loose definition of exclusive when it comes to Candy and Cola (who keeps getting new stock runs) I imagine that if they've made the decision to sell retail they will keep making more. The leftovers from the KS are likely to be minimal and would sell out incredibly quickly.

Glad to hear positive thoughts from those who managed to piggy back on to pledges though. They've had to put their trust in others to get them and gave money to people they'd probably never met months and months ago so glad to hear they are supportive of the retail release, and continuing to receive their miniatures from the sponsors.
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Chad Caughmann
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GM_Keeop wrote:
I just attempted to purchase a retail version of Myth and it's so buried in cross-Kickstarter models, booster packs, and exclusives that I could spend a year hunting it all down and spend 4 times the money I should.


Buried in cross-Kickstarter and exclusives, huh? That's a pretty big exaggeration.

It had 1-cross Kickstarter model in it....the Twilight Knight, which shouldn't be that shocking because it has been a cross-promotion in TONS of Kickstarters, most recently including SDE. Not until the Recon Kickstarter came out did they mention 1 of the Myth heroes would be usable in it...but that certainly wasn't information during the Kickstarter.

Myth had a small handful of exclusives...certainly Pauling in comparison to the amount of non-exclusive free content, and Pauling in comparison to many other comparable Kickstarters.

Booster packs? Yeah, there was a LOT of free stuff added during the Kickstarter that could be considered Booster packs, but almost none of that stuff was exclusive. You'll be able to purchase almost all those items later at retail.

You have reason to be frustrated that you missed a hell of a deal, but you WILL have a chance to buy almost all of it at retail. That's certainly better than a MOUNTAIN of exclusives you'd likely meet be able to get.
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Cat O\'Mighty
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I'm a Relic Knight backer, and quite happy that everyone will be able to get these figures (when they happen to be in stock )

Here's what Deke said on the SPM forum:
"I would just like to say that we very carefully read and discussed both sides' arguments. You all had very valid points and our final decision does not constitute our disagreement with them (except maybe the most hyperbolic of them ). Ultimately, we made this decision based on what we think is best for the game and our preferred ethos of making our games available for everyone regardless of when they discover them."
http://community.sodapopminiatures.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2...
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Magic Pink
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thetang22 wrote:
GM_Keeop wrote:
I just attempted to purchase a retail version of Myth and it's so buried in cross-Kickstarter models, booster packs, and exclusives that I could spend a year hunting it all down and spend 4 times the money I should.


Buried in cross-Kickstarter and exclusives, huh? That's a pretty big exaggeration.

It had 1-cross Kickstarter model in it....the Twilight Knight, which shouldn't be that shocking because it has been a cross-promotion in TONS of Kickstarters, most recently including SDE. Not until the Recon Kickstarter came out did they mention 1 of the Myth heroes would be usable in it...but that certainly wasn't information during the Kickstarter.


There's several MYTH crossover models in the RECON KS actually and more to come.
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Arjen Schouten
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This is good news. I still don't understand why these miniatures were available with the Kickstarter of a completely different game in the first place. It's like selling hotdogs in a bookshop.
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kinda sucks for people like me. I gave up on some relic knight stuff just so i could afford to get these "Exclusives". Kinda over CMoN exclusives. I seem to always draw the short straw!! And if there argument about everyone getting SDE stuff no matter when they heard about it then they better make Limited stuff like "nyan nyan" UNLIMITED!
 
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Aloha!
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GM_Keeop wrote:
Vargen666 wrote:
This is good news. I still don't understand why these miniatures were available with the Kickstarter of a completely different game in the first place. It's like selling hotdogs in a bookshop.


You just perfectly described the last four or five board game Kickstarters I've looked at. It's madness.
Because dumping hundreds of dollars on one of their games isn't enough. I get the idea, really I do, but that kind of thing will blow up in their faces eventually. I was content to ignore those characters, but their existence bugged the crap out of me.
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For those that don't know, there is a Myth-only backer level in the Recon Kickstarter. At $40, it's much more approachable than $120...and will get you everything Myth related.

The other thing to note about the Myth/Recon crossover content is that the content is usable in BOTH games. It's not like the Relic Knights Kickstarter where they were trying to sell you something that couldn't even be used in the game you were Kickstarting. Instead, the content was initially designed for Myth or Recon, then given additional value by making it usable in another game as well. That doesn't seem too coniving to me.
 
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Xuzu Horror
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Also am not fond of exclusives. I had not even considered buying SDE, but now I may look into it.
 
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JR Wr
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Vargen666 wrote:
This is good news. I still don't understand why these miniatures were available with the Kickstarter of a completely different game in the first place. It's like selling hotdogs in a bookshop.


Well, a similar model does exist.
We were at books a million yesterday.
They have a yogurt shop inside.
And it's working well enough.

Tongue in cheek.
I agree it sucks if they have no game content for the current project.
That's one thing Mercs is doing right with Recon.
At least the Myth crossovers work in both games.
So if you don't like Myth you can still use them in recon.

As for these, they at least allowed you to only pledge for them if that's all you were interested in.

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Kevin
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Speaking and relic knights backer who purchased three sets of the SDE models with the intent to resell them, I am fine with this decision. My intent in buying extra was to provide them at cost to people who missed out in RK. So it precludes an over inflated secondary market and I can probably still offload the extras I bought for $60 as a set and not lose money. It seems like the only people who lose are those who intended to scalp sets at over inflated prices.
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