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Subject: Interacting with ice timing questions rss

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At what point can I use false lead when the runner is approaching a bioroid piece of ice? Do the have the opportunity to jack out after I sacrifice my false lead?

At what point during a run can I use counters on ice. Let's say I have a Victor 2.0 with a counter on it that does brain damage. The runner approaches and placed a parasite on it using SMC, can I spend the counter before the ice gets datasuckered to death?
 
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Chris Wood
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1. The Runner initiates a run and declares the attacked server.

If the attacked server has one or more pieces of ice protecting it, go to [2]. If the attacked server does not have ice protecting it, go to [4].

2. The Runner approaches the outermost piece of ice not already approached on the attacked server.

2.1 Paid abilities can be triggered.

2.2 The Runner decides whether to continue the run.

...Either the Runner jacks out: go to [6] (cannot jack out if this is the first ice approached this run)

...Or the Runner continues the run: go to [2.3]

2.3 Approached ice can be rezzed, Paid abilities can be triggered, Non-ice cards can be rezzed (in any order).

2.4 Players check to see if the approached ice is rezzed.

If the approached ice is rezzed, go to [3]. If the approached ice is unrezzed, the Runner passes it: go to [2] if there is another piece of ice protecting the server, go to [4] if there is not another piece of ice protecting the server.

3. The Runner encounters a piece of ice. (“When encountered” conditionals meet their trigger conditions)

3.1 Icebreakers can interact with the encountered ice, Paid abilities can be triggered.

3.2 Resolve all subroutines not broken on the encountered ice.

...Either the run ends: go to [6]

...Or the run continues: if there is another piece of ice protecting the server, go to [2]; if there is not another piece of ice protecting the server, go to [4].

4. The Runner approaches the attacked server.

4.1 Paid abilities can be triggered.

4.2 The Runner decides whether to continue the run.

...Either the Runner jacks out: go to [6]

...Or the Runner continues the run: go to [4.3].

4.3 Paid abilities can be triggered, Non-ice cards can be rezzed (in any order).


False Lead And any counters on ICE Can be used during any of the above paid abilities windows. However for False Lead it's best to use it during the Approach phase (Step 2.3) since in the Encounter phase the runner goes first, breaks your subroutines with clicks, and then your false lead does nothing.

That also depends on how many clicks does the runner have. Keep in mine if the runner has 1 click remaining False Leads does nothing
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Tobin Lopes
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Sheshonk wrote:
At what point can I use false lead when the runner is approaching a bioroid piece of ice? Do the have the opportunity to jack out after I sacrifice my false lead?

At what point during a run can I use counters on ice. Let's say I have a Victor 2.0 with a counter on it that does brain damage. The runner approaches and placed a parasite on it using SMC, can I spend the counter before the ice gets datasuckered to death?


During 2.3 each player must trigger all their effects first (typically with corp going first but the runner gets to decide that - protocol is that the runner either asks the corp about effects or the corp just starts). This means that you need to burn the Viktor counter BEFORE the runner starts to resolve their SMC - assuming the runner chose you to trigger your effects first (which is the play 99.999% of the time). Assuming that, then no, you cannot use the counter before death to datasucker because the runner gets to choose the order of resolution during encounters and the Viktor would go away. :/

-tpl
 
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Chris Wood
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You do not choose triggered effects first or second. active player is ALWAYS first.

Now if you are talking about choosing paid abilities, yes, the runner can choose not to use any paid abilities, and then the corp can use theirs and then the runner can use their paid abilities again. But "triggered" and "paid abilities" are 2 very different things.
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Tobin Lopes
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Taloncarde wrote:
You do not choose triggered effects first or second. active player is ALWAYS first.

Now if you are talking about choosing paid abilities, yes, the runner can choose not to use any paid abilities, and then the corp can use theirs and then the runner can use their paid abilities again. But "triggered" and "paid abilities" are 2 very different things.


Yep, you're right. I used the wrong terms (a big deal in rules questions ) . Triggers fire according to order chosen by active player (important for things like Femme v. Data Raven or Tollbooth), active player has a chance to use paid abilities, opponent then has chance, and active player has one more chance.

-tpl
 
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tobinlopes wrote:
Taloncarde wrote:
You do not choose triggered effects first or second. active player is ALWAYS first.

Now if you are talking about choosing paid abilities, yes, the runner can choose not to use any paid abilities, and then the corp can use theirs and then the runner can use their paid abilities again. But "triggered" and "paid abilities" are 2 very different things.


Yep, you're right. I used the wrong terms (a big deal in rules questions ) . Triggers fire according to order chosen by active player (important for things like Femme v. Data Raven or Tollbooth), active player has a chance to use paid abilities, opponent then has chance, and active player has one more chance.

-tpl


Active player only has one more chance IF their opponent did something. If the active player declines, and so does their opponent, then too bad; you missed your chance.

Just adding that in for completion's sake.
 
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Chris Wood
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tobinlopes wrote:
Taloncarde wrote:
You do not choose triggered effects first or second. active player is ALWAYS first.

Now if you are talking about choosing paid abilities, yes, the runner can choose not to use any paid abilities, and then the corp can use theirs and then the runner can use their paid abilities again. But "triggered" and "paid abilities" are 2 very different things.


Yep, you're right. I used the wrong terms (a big deal in rules questions ) . Triggers fire according to order chosen by active player (important for things like Femme v. Data Raven or Tollbooth), active player has a chance to use paid abilities, opponent then has chance, and active player has one more chance.

-tpl


No, again a common misconception on triggers. Triggers for the ACTIVE PLAYER always go first. The only order chosen is you choose the order of your triggered effects. Runners turn, runners triggered effects resolve first, etc.
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Gregory Pettigrew
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CommissarFeesh wrote:
Active player only has one more chance IF their opponent did something. If the active player declines, and so does their opponent, then too bad; you missed your chance.

Just adding that in for completion's sake.


If we want to be really complete, even if the active player uses paid abilities, if the opponent declines, the window closes.
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