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Subject: My fiancee is a hell of a criminal :( rss

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Rafał Cywicki
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[this is more or less a rant, sorry, but I need to get this off my chest]

I've been playing A:N with my fiance for over a year now. Since we got the game she always been playing Weyland BABW and Gabe and she barely deckbuilds, just adds one or two new cards from time to time. With Weyland I can live - it is tough to beat but I win more than I lose, and it is a good Tournament exercise to play against Tag'n'Bag. But I'm getting really sick and tired of her Gabe.

Basically this is a simple "All the good stuff" Gabe, with highlights being the usual: Account Siphon, Emergency Shutdown, Inside Job, Desperado, Sneakdoor, FOA, Comromised Employee. Add some simple economy (Sure Gamble, Bankjob, Kati) and some of the most efficient breakers in the game, then add Medium and you're good to go. To apply more salt to the wound she added E3 Feedbacks to basically shutdown all HB decks she encounters. Oh, and the latest addition being Gorman Drip, which is ridiculous (in how good it is).

I'm playing different varieties of decks (yes, I tried FA). But nothing seems to work in a long run. And the worst thing is I'm getting really sick and tired of the way Criminal makes the Corp helpless, while getting more and more money all the time.

And I hate how good that deck is Early game. If I Ice HQ the mashes R&D with medium or installs Sneakdoor on second turn. If I put Ice on R&D she makes first turn Account Siphon. Most of our games are basically decided in first three turns and mostly by the starting hand. If I can Ice up all centrals without going bankrupt I have some small chance to not loose in first four rounds of the game. If not then it is a gamble - whether she has AC or Medium on starting hand. Typically in the Early game she can manage to steal one or two agendas easy and that's a halfway to victory.

If by some crazy chance I manage to survive that and somehow get two pieces of ice rezzed on HQ, R&D and one on Archives I can basically start playing. By that time I have a HQ full of agendas and it is just the matter of time before she assembles a rig, pays a small fortune to enter the HQ, derezzes all the Big Ice, Account Siphons me dry and steals whatever she wants. The times I manage to win is mostly because somehow her economy backfired and took longer than usual to set up.

Now the Big box for Criminal is coming out and I encourage her to check new cards out, but the thing is - there nothing noteworthy for her. She is like a shark that stopped evolving because it is already a perfect killing machine. And most of the time I have to admit, there is nothing better for her than those combos. I encourage her to try a different approach but why bother, her deck works perfectly - she even came the first in the local tournament last week. I want her to keep playing and try to enjoy our sessions, but at the same time I become more and more frustrated with her deck - to the point that I threw my cards today when she Sneakdoored me, Shutdowned my Tollbooth, and Siphoned me, and bashed my remote all in one turn
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Ian Neufeld
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Quote:
If I can Ice up all centrals without going bankrupt I have some small chance to not loose in first four rounds of the game.




Quote:
she added E3 Feedbacks to basically shutdown all HB decks she encounters.







Quote:
it is just the matter of time before she [...] Account Siphons me dry




Just my thoughts on how to counter some of the problems you're facing. Also keep in mind you have a phase after the runner declares they are not jacking out to dump money into rezzing Assets to make the Account Siphon a lot less appealing.
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Rafał Cywicki
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Thanks. I intend to try Next Desing anyhow. But I already tired the 2.0 bioroids and they are barely a solution to the problem. You can still click and E3 through them then Emergency Shutdown them - adding the fact that they are more expensive you're How does it work for you?
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Grzegorz Pijas
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So you need to learn to play
At our tournaments at top lvls its the corporation who wins more.
How does she manage her memory?
Sneakdoor,medium,gormandrip what else??
Play Jinteki pe and kill her.
Play Jinteki rp and make her weep everytime she needs to check remote.
Play HB CI and hide agendas in 20 card hands.
Etc etc.
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Rafał Cywicki
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I consider myself a seasoned player - it is not that I need learn to play, I'm just tired to play against that sick Criminal combo cards.

And man, I'm building decks right and left - it's not that she kills one of my decks... she kills most of them outright. Haven't played Jinteki in a while but I remeber she once packed Public Sympathy just because I played one, and that one card shuts down Jinteki Kill decks similiar to how E3 shuts HB. I might go for the Replicating Perfection - but I already see how she will focus on centrals and between Gabe and Deperado she'll make the ID basically blank.

As for Memory: After you Install Desperado (which you would want to do even if it didn't give you MU) and you have 2 MU to spare for the fun stuff, even after you install Corroder, Ninja and Gordian. After some time when she doesn't need Medium or Sneakdoor anymore, she just trashes it in favor of other stuff. Simple as that. Her memory checks out
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Cedric Bertolini
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chomoon wrote:
[this is more or less a rant, sorry, but I need to get this off my chest]

Man, I envy you and pity you at the same time. I'm playing with my gf and we have a similar problem, in reverse. But in my case it's more a matter of skill than deck. We countered it with heavy handicap, but it's probably not a solution for you.

Have you tried playing a Corp deck specifically targetteg at countering Gabe, in order to have her try another faction? One way could be to play NBN with light ice and heavy tag punishment to mitigate Shutdown and punish Siphon. Draco in NBN:MN is a good soft-counter to Siphon. Closed Accounts too. Shipment from SanSan helps alleviate low econ. SanSan City Grid and Red Herrings will force her to find real credits. NBN:TWIY* has +1 hand size, helps protect agendas in HQ. Flare can kill Desperado, or splash Power Shutdown. Compromised Employee dies to Character Assassination. Draco is resilient to Emergency Shutdown. Pop-up Window is excellent against denial and protects against Inside Job.
 
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Rafał Cywicki
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Alsciende wrote:

Man, I envy you and pity you at the same time. I'm playing with my gf and we have a similar problem, in reverse. But in my case it's more a matter of skill than deck. We countered it with heavy handicap, but it's probably not a solution for you.

Have you tried playing a Corp deck specifically targetteg at countering Gabe, in order to have her try another faction? One way could be to play NBN with light ice and heavy tag punishment to mitigate Shutdown and punish Siphon. Draco in NBN:MN is a good soft-counter to Siphon. Closed Accounts too. Shipment from SanSan helps alleviate low econ. SanSan City Grid and Red Herrings will force her to find real credits. NBN:TWIY* has +1 hand size, helps protect agendas in HQ. Flare can kill Desperado, or splash Power Shutdown. Compromised Employee dies to Character Assassination. Draco is resilient to Emergency Shutdown. Pop-up Window is excellent against denial and protects against Inside Job.


Thanks, I'm playing NBN:MN right now and I run some of the cards you listed. Thing is that it still dies half the time to her Early Game pressure. At times I manage to sneak Braeking News and throw Closed Accounts at her, and that gives me a bit of an edge.

Having Draco on HQ isn't that good. Even if I dump all the money on it I end up with 10-or-so-strenght Sentry with Trace 2 subroutine. For a Gabe with a Comromised Employee's and Desperado that practically nonexistent piece of ice.

And killing Desperado with a Flare seems to be an expensive option - 9 to rez and then a trace to win (against all wealthy Criminal) :/ I think it would end up as just another Emergency Shutdown target. I'll consider Power Shutdown, instead.
 
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Grzegorz Pijas
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Oh yeah i forgot you are a lucky bastard
I think everyone would love to have a gf which wins with them more often then not
Go watch some filmed games by strong corp players, play hb with a lots of assets and rez them in response to as, you know that?
Play control nbn with 3 closed accounts and sea source and destroy her economy.
Etc etc cryminal is very strong but far from unbeatable especially when played by no tournament players.
We can hook up sometime at octgn if you like and i would show you some tricks or will beat Your gf (PL here )
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Rafał Cywicki
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Playing SEA Source and Closed Accounts in the same deck seems bit counterproductive does it not?

If the runner is rich (and that's when you want to play Closed Accounts) you really have to pay lot for the trace on this one and the runner knows he really needs to beat it. If he can you yourself end up with no money and worthless Closed Accounts. If he can't... he ends up with a tag and no money, but you end up having wasted lots of money on that.

I think I'd rather use it with suprise Breaking News

I don't play on OCTGN. I tried and it felt soulless. We might meet at some tournament though (I'm at Pyrkon this weekend)
 
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Grzegorz Pijas
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It does not for me.
First of all if you get ss from start you can w8 for kati or prof contacts and kill them
Second in later stage you can syphon money from runner, for two you have trace 5 so 4/5 for runner, if they know you have ca they will try to beat the trace, and if you are rich you can create economical advantage.
Of course breaking news> ca is also very good.
Take some assets like market accounts, priv contacts and see if she s gonna destroy them.
 
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Rafał Cywicki
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Consider the sceanario:
You have 10 credits and Runner has 10 credits.

You play SS (8 creds remaining) and bump trace with your ID money to Trace 5. Runner would gladly pay 5 to avoid tag and CA. So lets bump it more. You pay two creds extra. Runner would have to pay 7 - but knowing that you might play CA it's still a bargain for him. You might consider playing two more to make the Trace 9. He still can beat it, and probably should - he will end up with no money anyways and might as well avoid the tag. So there is no way around this you must bump trace to 11 (paying 6 more) to make the tag land. A this point runner shrugs his shoulders and the tag lands. Then you still need to play CA (one more credit and one more click). You've spent 9 credits two cards and most of your turn to land one tag and make runner poor. You don't even have credits to trash a resource if runner has any. Probably you would be better off playing SS with trace 9.

In rare cases when runner has much weaker economy than corp, that's a good move, in all other cases... not so much. I'd rather have the money for rezzing ice tbh
 
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Grzegorz Pijas
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I have diffrent experiences
 
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James W
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This is one of those brag blogs, right? =)

So, last week I went to the doctor because I've been having some serious back pain. It turns out that my wallet is just so stuffed with cash that I've been compensating for the weight without noticing.

Don't you just hate it when that happens?
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Sebastian Zarzycki
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The best weapon against Criminal is to kill kill kill their rig. Use Power Shutdown with Jackson Howard, maybe even recycle it from archives.

...or just switch to Jinteki and play shell game.
 
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Aaron Smith
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Might be worth taking a look at the deck in this thread:
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/1141751/deck-the-red-coa...

He does admit that the large amount of bioroid ice makes it a little vulnerable to E3 Implants, which you said she has in her deck, but it still could be pretty strong. It has tons of Economy, and if she spends all her time going after all of it, she's going to be too broke to do anything else.
 
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Cedric Bertolini
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chomoon wrote:
Playing SEA Source and Closed Accounts in the same deck seems bit counterproductive does it not?

If the runner is rich (and that's when you want to play Closed Accounts) you really have to pay lot for the trace on this one and the runner knows he really needs to beat it. If he can you yourself end up with no money and worthless Closed Accounts. If he can't... he ends up with a tag and no money, but you end up having wasted lots of money on that.

I think I'd rather use it with suprise Breaking News

I don't play on OCTGN. I tried and it felt soulless. We might meet at some tournament though (I'm at Pyrkon this weekend)

Try Bernice on HQ. Base trace 5, if you have less than 6 credits, dump everything in the trace. She'll end up either broke or with 3 tags. Then Closed Accounts / Scorched Earth.
 
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Gin Teki
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chomoon wrote:
She is like a shark that stopped evolving because it is already a perfect killing machine.(


HAHAHA! Spilt my coffee. Quality line, may have to borrow in future.
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Jesse M
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Take a look at this Jinteki deck. It's very strong versus criminals.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1133579/octgn-android-netrun...
 
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T1: Chimera on HQ, Ice wall/Paper wall/Wraparound on R&D, click for credit.

This is by far my most successful opening play and I won 5/6 corp games last year at worlds. My runner game was junk as I took a gamble on Kit and Cypher which did not pay off. Went 1/6 as runner.
 
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Grzegorz Pijas
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Try my destroyer hb list and switch for operation economy, you should destroy her
 
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Evan
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chomoon wrote:
Having Draco on HQ isn't that good. Even if I dump all the money on it I end up with 10-or-so-strenght Sentry with Trace 2 subroutine. For a Gabe with a Comromised Employee's and Desperado that practically nonexistent piece of ice.


A lot of the value of Draco on HQ is just as a Panic Button for Siphons, but Chum or even Sensei or RSVP can add a lot to it for a fairly low cost.
 
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