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Doomtown: Reloaded» Forums » General

Subject: Problem rss

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Kenneth Sheffield
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It certainly was easier to get the desired hands but that also lead to a higher likelihood of Cheatin' so things could get ugly in both directions.

I never heard of mass switching to sealed.

It did lead to new formats such as Bicycle (only one of each value) and Double Barrel (not more than 2 of any particular card)
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Todd Rowland
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Bicycle is even included in the rulebook this time too IIRC. It's an alternate but it's there.

Also, while yes you can build towards certain hands, that's part of the meta of the game. Can you always get them? I suppose that depends as much on what your opponent does to affect your game as it does your own play.
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Scott Sexton
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As others have said, the meta for deck construction was the push and pull between loading up on certain values so that you could build nice hands for combat without exposing yourself to risk due to having weaker cards or by cheating too often (either in the events phase or in combat). If you went all in with the most powerfull cards around, the greater the odds were that you opened yourself up to the nasty penalties for cheating. If you avoided cheating, you would run the risk of having weaker hands in combat and having less power or synergy amongst the cards in your deck.

It leads to very interesting deck building dilemmas. The Bicycle variant and sealed deck were both very popular formats in my area.
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Eric Jome
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Bannoran wrote:
If I remember rightly first time round the more cards that got released didn't it just lead to everybody just getting the poker hands they wanted every time?


Cheatin! cards, sir. Cheatin! cards.

It seems a lot of people quit the old Doomtown in the early Episodes. That's understandable. I'm not sure that early game was as rigorously playtested as it should have been. Things like the Headline rule got added to limit the power of Events, for example.

If I had to guess, it seems likely that problems the old game had will be the first things fixed this time. And if you didn't play the game after Pine Box, you missed out on by far the best era of the game.
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Scott Sexton
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cosine wrote:
Bannoran wrote:
If I remember rightly first time round the more cards that got released didn't it just lead to everybody just getting the poker hands they wanted every time?


Cheatin! cards, sir. Cheatin! cards.

It seems a lot of people quit the old Doomtown in the early Episodes. That's understandable. I'm not sure that early game was as rigorously playtested as it should have been. Things like the Headline rule got added to limit the power of Events, for example.

If I had to guess, it seems likely that problems the old game had will be the first things fixed this time. And if you didn't play the game after Pine Box, you missed out on by far the best era of the game.


Yeah, the high water mark for me and most players I knew was the Kingdom Come storyline event and the immediate fallout fiction Rob drafted.
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David Boeren
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I'm wondering whether there will be any built-in punishment for Cheating or if it will only be through including specific Cheatin! cards.

Netrunner for instance has a default way to punish Tags, but also includes cards that allow different forms of tag punishment.
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Scott Sexton
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dboeren wrote:
I'm wondering whether there will be any built-in punishment for Cheating or if it will only be through including specific Cheatin! cards.

Netrunner for instance has a default way to punish Tags, but also includes cards that allow different forms of tag punishment.


I think the way I would do it is to make "cheatin'" cards a bit more dual purposed then what they were. Most folks wouldn't run them in serious decks because a well crafted deck wouldn't cheat much. I think if the cheatin' cards had other uses (like offering a small bonus if you played it as something other than as a reaction to cheatin) you'd see them used more often.
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David Boeren
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Yes, that's exactly the issue I was thinking of. It's not reliable enough to:
1. Have your opponent cheat
and
2. Happen to have the card in your hand at that exact moment

Therefore, these cards are hard to justify in a deck. A second use would help with that. I actually like that better than a built-in cheating penalty because that would just reduce cheating as a whole making anti-cheating cards even MORE unusable.
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Scott Sexton
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dboeren wrote:
Yes, that's exactly the issue I was thinking of. It's not reliable enough to:
1. Have your opponent cheat
and
2. Happen to have the card in your hand at that exact moment

Therefore, these cards are hard to justify in a deck. A second use would help with that. I actually like that better than a built-in cheating penalty because that would just reduce cheating as a whole making anti-cheating cards even MORE unusable.


I happened to run some cheatin' cards in my high octane Agency deck through the run of the game for a couple of reasons though:

1- There were some that worked well for building Dead Man's Hands.
2- The combat cheatin' cards were extremely powerful.
3- The ability to threaten cheatin' cards is enough to cause your opponent to be less aggressive towards you. Fighting on your own terms is vital in this game.
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Christopher Hanson
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Jackalope Stampede was the first major fix against Cheatin' hands once the game progressed to "who can get their five of a kind out first" decks.

Another format was Kansas City; you forfeit if you ever reveal a cheating hand.
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Dan Knight
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StagCutlery wrote:
Jackalope Stampede was the first major fix against Cheatin' hands once the game progressed to "who can get their five of a kind out first" decks.

Another format was Kansas City; you forfeit if you ever reveal a cheating hand.


Damn you Jackalope Stampede... /waves fist
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