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Subject: What Kind of Game is Attack Wing? rss

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There seems to be quite a bit of angst and consternation with the direction Attack Wing is taking. I wonder if this has something to do with the way we perceive and play the game.

Is Attack Wing primarily a Casual Game with the OPs added for continued promotion and expansion of the game?

Or, is Attack Wing primarily about the OPs with competition being the driving force behind the game?

What do you perceive to be Wizkids approach and what about the customers?

For me, Attack Wing is a casual play game. I don't play in OPs (primarily an availability and timing issue). I love the Star Trek universe. I love the game mechanics. I really enjoy playing the game with a group of guys. Because I'm a completionist, I want every available ship and card. But realistically, I know I can't have them all. With so many ships coming out, and my budget being what it is, I'm going to have to start picking and choosing.

To this point, I've been able to get all the OP stuff via eBay, but circumstances have changed and I doubt I'll be able to get it all. I'm really hoping to get the Gorn and Tholian ships, but my dream for a DS9 model has sailed, and I'm going to do my best to ignore the Borg OP stuff.

As long as Wizkids keeps making regular expansions like they have been, I'm going to continue with the game. I'll enjoy it and have fun. Whatever they do with the OP doesn't really bother me all that much. Of course I'm only a casual, at-home gamer.
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    What does "OP" stand for?

 
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Sagrilarus wrote:

    What does "OP" stand for?



Organized Play -- the official Wizkids Tournament system.
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Brook Gentlestream
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For now, I'm still having fun playing out all the scenarios in each expansion.
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It's a good game.

So far that is all I need it to be. cool
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M King
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It's two...two...two games in one.

(reference to a very old commercial)
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Will Sanchez
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in my experience, the game is primarily Casual Players focusing on grabbing OP prizes. Very few of the people I run into would qulify as "competitive". Sure, they want to do well in matches but the number of people who are willing to play outside of OP events even for practice is maybe only 20% of the total players. There are even people who come into events and take a build off the top of their heads five minutes before turning fleet sheets in. There's also all the events that have had to cater to people who don't want to spend as much money decking out their fleet and resort to "faction only" play.

I'm not suprised though either, X-Wing around here fares about the same. At our store championship last week, maybe only 3 people out of the 14 were serious about it and there were a few players who hadn't even played more than 3 games. And whenever x-wing day comes around, every last one of them is about 2-on-2 and 3-on-3 and random scenarios instead of practice matches. Maybe it's just my area.
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Andrew Lepperd
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Midwest Razorback wrote:
There seems to be quite a bit of angst and consternation with the direction Attack Wing is taking. I wonder if this has something to do with the way we perceive and play the game.

Is Attack Wing primarily a Casual Game with the OPs added for continued promotion and expansion of the game?

Or, is Attack Wing primarily about the OPs with competition being the driving force behind the game?

What do you perceive to be Wizkids approach and what about the customers?

For me, Attack Wing is a casual play game. I don't play in OPs (primarily an availability and timing issue). I love the Star Trek universe. I love the game mechanics. I really enjoy playing the game with a group of guys. Because I'm a completionist, I want every available ship and card. But realistically, I know I can't have them all. With so many ships coming out, and my budget being what it is, I'm going to have to start picking and choosing.

To this point, I've been able to get all the OP stuff via eBay, but circumstances have changed and I doubt I'll be able to get it all. I'm really hoping to get the Gorn and Tholian ships, but my dream for a DS9 model has sailed, and I'm going to do my best to ignore the Borg OP stuff.

As long as Wizkids keeps making regular expansions like they have been, I'm going to continue with the game. I'll enjoy it and have fun. Whatever they do with the OP doesn't really bother me all that much. Of course I'm only a casual, at-home gamer.


So far it seems like they're landing on the side of making the real marquee must-have ships retail expansions, and making the LEs a bit more niche/marginal stuff, with some evidence that they're willing to re-use the sculpts for retail releases if you want that particular class of ship. Every film/show headlining version of the Enterprise is announced now, as a standard retail expansion.

All of the big-time ships and captains from the other factions are likewise available as a standard retail purchase. So for casual play, it's not like they're making the essentials inaccessible.

Even from a tournament standpoint, the most powerful captain in the game remains starter Picard, and each of the starter ships remains competitive. I realize that it makes things more inconvenient for the compulsive completests, but my anecdotal experience has been that the LEs and now the limited drafting element are creating excitement for local play. I think that's important to keep the game healthy and expanding with a brisk release schedule for casual OR tournament play.

I've enjoyed it both ways, personally. Since I am the TO at my venue, when I get to play I usually just like to do some kind of thematic casual thing.
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Ted Kay
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Midwest Razorback wrote:
There seems to be quite a bit of angst and consternation with the direction Attack Wing is taking. I wonder if this has something to do with the way we perceive and play the game.

Is Attack Wing primarily a Casual Game with the OPs added for continued promotion and expansion of the game?

Or, is Attack Wing primarily about the OPs with competition being the driving force behind the game?

What do you perceive to be Wizkids approach and what about the customers?

For me, Attack Wing is a casual play game. I don't play in OPs (primarily an availability and timing issue). I love the Star Trek universe. I love the game mechanics. I really enjoy playing the game with a group of guys. Because I'm a completionist, I want every available ship and card. But realistically, I know I can't have them all. With so many ships coming out, and my budget being what it is, I'm going to have to start picking and choosing.

To this point, I've been able to get all the OP stuff via eBay, but circumstances have changed and I doubt I'll be able to get it all. I'm really hoping to get the Gorn and Tholian ships, but my dream for a DS9 model has sailed, and I'm going to do my best to ignore the Borg OP stuff.

As long as Wizkids keeps making regular expansions like they have been, I'm going to continue with the game. I'll enjoy it and have fun. Whatever they do with the OP doesn't really bother me all that much. Of course I'm only a casual, at-home gamer.


For me, Attack Wing is my first miniatures war game love. I've dabbled briefly in Warmachine prior, but when I saw X-Wing featured on Will Wheaton's Tabletop, and my roommate told me that there was a game coming out using the same engine with the Star Trek IP, I was excited. We picked up the game at Gencon and I haven't stopped since, sometimes to the consternation of those close to me. The first day I owned it, I played a pickup game with a couple young men out of the starter who had played X-Wing before. The first round I won handily, but they both turned it around on me by joining together- "This is Enterprise hailing the Klingons!"- to take out my Khazara.

When the Dominion War launched, my enthusiasm grew. DS9 is my favorite Trek. Getting to play for extra ships, the amazing resources and participation prizes and meet new people who shared my hobby was an excellent experience. When I saw the grand prize model at Gencon, I swore I had to have it, but although that didn't happen I've had a lot of fun and established several play groups I wouldn't have met otherwise.

Casually or in tournaments, I enjoy this game. Scenarios are great fun, particularly those that alter the playing field. OP fleets are a great exercise in maximizing synergy on ships. Playing OPs has taught me many important lessons- the advantages of maneuvering, the importance of fixing dice results on either side, the ability to read an opponent's poker face. Scenarios allow ships to show off their strong points. The battleship scenario is a good one to play just out of the expansion. The Praetus scenario teaches area denial tactics. The Kobayashi Maru gives Klingons the opportunity to explore things like Projected Stasis Field and Klingon Boarding Party, Sabotage and the like.

I think Wizkids takes a lot of flak for its decisions. I do think they at least vet their ideas somewhere before arbitrarily making decisions, because I have yet to see a major mistake in this game's implementation for all the worrying that is done on Internet forums, playing up the dangers of the Cloaked Mine menace and the unbeatable "Barrage of Absurd."

I might be biased but that's my impression so far.
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Cap'n Ginger
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oneoldgamer wrote:
It's two...two...two games in one.

(reference to a very old commercial)


It's a floor wax AND a dessert topping!

(reference to a very old parody of a very old commercial)
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FortuneFavorTheBold wrote:

Casually or in tournaments, I enjoy this game. Scenarios are great fun, particularly those that alter the playing field. OP fleets are a great exercise in maximizing synergy on ships. Playing OPs has taught me many important lessons- the advantages of maneuvering, the importance of fixing dice results on either side, the ability to read an opponent's poker face. Scenarios allow ships to show off their strong points. The battleship scenario is a good one to play just out of the expansion. The Praetus scenario teaches area denial tactics. The Kobayashi Maru gives Klingons the opportunity to explore things like Projected Stasis Field and Klingon Boarding Party, Sabotage and the like.

I think Wizkids takes a lot of flak for its decisions. I do think they at least vet their ideas somewhere before arbitrarily making decisions, because I have yet to see a major mistake in this game's implementation for all the worrying that is done on Internet forums, playing up the dangers of the Cloaked Mine menace and the unbeatable "Barrage of Absurd."


This, basically.
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    I know two game store owners that say WizKids really supports the product with their Organized Play events, something that FFG has fallen down on with X-Wing. From a sales perspective that's key, and an indication that WizKids got game.

             S.
 
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Daniel Hensel
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It really all depends on what perspective you take. Do you view Attack Wing as a casual light tactical game, a competitive league game, or a collectible game?

Casual Light Tactical Game
This is where plain battles and missions thrive. If this is how you view the game, then you have the least to worry about. There's more than enough retail material for this game to go around and keep everyone happy in a casual setting. LE ships may be neat, but they're not necessary. Also, resources tend to get in the way in this format and are more likely to detract from the fun rather than add to it.

Competitive League Game
This is the OP scene. Resources were made for this setting and play a crucial role in helping players strategize and test their mettle against other players. Everyone's eyes are on the prize ships, so you either need to be really good and take first place or really lucky and be handed the fellowship prize. Having a solid collection helps, but there's only so much you can squeeze into 100 points so you only really need what matches your strategy. This is the group that is most directly affected by controversial decisions made by WizKids such as Admirals Orders and the upcoming semi-blind tournament model.

Collectible Game
Regardless of whether you're a casual or competitive player, if you're a completionist and this game is giving you a severe case of "acquisition disorder", then you view this as a collectible game. However, the format WizKids chose for this game makes it very difficult to simply buy everything. To get the LE stuff without resorting to paying ridiculous prices on ebay or knowing someone who could "somehow" get it for you as long as you don't ask too many questions, you HAVE to go to the OP events and you HAVE to win or get lucky. For many people, that simply isn't an option.

My point here is that WizKids has done a great job so far promoting and supporting the casual and competitive aspects of the game, but they're not making it easy on people who view this as a collectible game. This is not by any measure of incompetence on WizKids' part, but by design. They want to keep the game fun by making everything that is truly important for the game available for retail while rewarding those who invest their time, interest, and money in the game with OP prizes that you can't simply buy, which is much more satisfying to win than winning something like a gift certificate or a recent-wave ship. Quite frankly, Wiz Kids doesn't care whether or not you can get one of everything. What they care about is whether or not you enjoy playing the game, both casually and competitively.
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Jonathan M D Thomas
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AW is the only game I can get my dad to play.

The nice thing is that it can be several things. Casual and competitive both.

I like playing missions and casual games with junky or thematic fleets. I also enjoy theory crafting crazy fleets for ops.

Just like magic and many other games, the game can be competitive and casual at the same time.
 
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Colin Goodman
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All games should be casual games first and foremost. OP events and tournaments should be divided into casual and competative formats to allow all players the opportunity to play to their prefered style.
 
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I thought the casual format for a tournament was, "Let's throw some fleets together and play tomorrow night.”
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Daniel Hensel
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Colin Goodman wrote:
All games should be casual games first and foremost. OP events and tournaments should be divided into casual and competative formats to allow all players the opportunity to play to their prefered style.

OPs and tournaments are by definition competitive formats. That's not to say they can't be played in a casual manner, but they do require keeping track of stats and often include prize support, which supports competitive play.
 
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