Recommend
1 
 Thumb up
 Hide
19 Posts

The Battle of Five Armies» Forums » General

Subject: Need Advice from Expirience WotR players rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Baramon
msg tools
I was looking to buy WotR 2nd ed and now this game came out.

I know it might sound silly, but how does it different besides lesser scale? I would really appreciate some advices here, like pros and cons of each game. Booth wife and i Tolkiens fans.

Thanks
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ian Madsen
United States
Kearns
Utah
flag msg tools
Trains!
badge
Houseplant?
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Is it available in stores yet?

I imagine that this game is more tactical than WotR, including things like different unit types with melee or ranged combat, but that is purely speculation on my part.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Ladson
South Carolina
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
AFAIK, Five Armies isn't out. Grab WotR and the Lords of Middle Earth expansion while you wait. Great "dudes on a map" game and is the #1 thematic game at BGG for good reason.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Björn von Knorring
Sweden
Uppsala
flag msg tools
badge
The picture is a swedish cartoon-figure Herman Hedning. English info here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herman_Hedning
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
If you're a bigTolkien-fan you will probably want both. Hopefully Battle of five armies will be good but Wotr is a master-piece and, IMHO, a must-buy for any Tolkien-gamer.
12 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Baramon
msg tools
gotcha guys. Thanks.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Raf B
United States
Oakland
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
myth1202 wrote:
If you're a bigTolkien-fan you will probably want both. Hopefully Battle of five armies will be good but Wotr is a master-piece and, IMHO, a must-buy for any Tolkien-gamer.

+1. All you need to know.

But if you want to know more about WotR, you can get a preview of how it works from some of the videos explaining the rules, or try this PDF, which walks you through how the struggle to unmake the One Ring played out between two expert players, and explains some nuances of the rules as they come up.

3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Baramon
msg tools
thanks, appreciate it.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Terence Lee
United States
Arcadia
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
While we're on the topic of what's better...is the Lords of Middle-earth worth it? Does it really add much to the game?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Josiah Leis
United States
Merino
Colorado
flag msg tools
badge
I spent 100 GG and all I got was this stupid overtext.....
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
tlee33 wrote:
While we're on the topic of what's better...is the Lords of Middle-earth worth it? Does it really add much to the game?


I would say that is a definite "no", at least certainly at the first. As a new player there will be plenty enough to take in with just the base game and there is no need to add further rules and special characters with the expansion. Plus the base game's re-playability and fun factor are both off the charts just by itself.

Later, once you're very experienced with the game it is starting to feel more "samey" or like it needs something to freshen it up (which will be quite a while), then I would look at getting Lords of Middle Earth as it will do that nicely. I definitely wouldn't start with it though, it is definitely just an optional add-on that provides some additional material and freshens things up, not at all a "must have".

*Edit* Just wanted to add that as an experienced player who has played WoTR quite a lot (I would guess somewhere in the neighborhood of 75-100 plays), I actually play the game more without the expansion than I do with it. I do like to bust out LoME when I'm looking for a change up or something a little different, but the majority of the games I play are the base game only.

One final thing to note is that the expansion increases the game's playtime considerably.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul Paella
United States
East Aurora
New York
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Kartigan wrote:
tlee33 wrote:
While we're on the topic of what's better...is the Lords of Middle-earth worth it? Does it really add much to the game?


...

One final thing to note is that the expansion increases the game's playtime considerably.


Thanks Kartigan,

Can you tell us why you prefer to play without the expansion? Also, can you let us know why it takes longer to play with the expansion? We haven't played with it yet and would like to hear what vets have to say about this. Thank you.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jamie Y
England
Manchester
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Ghorro wrote:

Can you tell us why you prefer to play without the expansion? Also, can you let us know why it takes longer to play with the expansion? We haven't played with it yet and would like to hear what vets have to say about this. Thank you.


Various players' views on this very question can be found in this thread.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1079985/poll-how-often-do-yo...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Josiah Leis
United States
Merino
Colorado
flag msg tools
badge
I spent 100 GG and all I got was this stupid overtext.....
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Ghorro wrote:
Kartigan wrote:
tlee33 wrote:
While we're on the topic of what's better...is the Lords of Middle-earth worth it? Does it really add much to the game?


...

One final thing to note is that the expansion increases the game's playtime considerably.


Thanks Kartigan,

Can you tell us why you prefer to play without the expansion? Also, can you let us know why it takes longer to play with the expansion? We haven't played with it yet and would like to hear what vets have to say about this. Thank you.


For those too lazy to click the link Jamie provided and read the thread, essentially my biggest issues with the expansion boil down to the following (as written by Jim Hansen, but I agree 100%):

1) The games generally last about 50% longer. The FP is able to defend better and the SP is able to corrupt better, so the average game takes a few more turns. 10 to 14 turns is common whereas regular 2nd edition is usually in the 7 to 9 range.

2) It feels more lucky. I can't quite put my finger on why it feels that way, but well over half of my LOME games have been completely unwinnable for one side or the other. It almost has a runaway leader problem where a turn 1 reveal gives the SP an ~80% chance of victory, but poor early hunting can give the FP an ~80% chance of victory. Also, lesser dice can leave after 1 turn or stay for 10 turns and that has a big impact. Rolling an eye with a lesser keeper die not only makes moving the FSP more difficult, but it also costs an action and possibly removes the die.

3) Lorien is basically unconquerable with Galadriel in play. This reduces Shadow military options and also accentuates the Elves small reinforcement pool and reinforcement management (which I don't particularly enjoy). Even though the Glorfindel card lets you draw a strategy card after you play it, I have found myself not playing it at all so I don't end up with a "wasted" elite in Rivendell.


Essentially the biggest reason the games go longer is the change in strategies that take place. In the base game, the shadow military is frequently trying for a "blitz" where they simply attempt to take down 10 VP worth of stuff before the Free can destroy the ring. This is a sure fire way to lose in the expansion. Instead a slow, steady approach focusing on corrupting the fellowship is usually preferred. The free peoples player also has several options that help them to defend better against the shadow military to buy the fellowship more time.

These two things combined mean that the game last more turns on average than a game of the base game. Furthermore, because each side gets extra actions in each turn (from the Keeper and Lesser Minion dice), each individual Turn takes longer, so a 7 turn game of the expansion is still longer than a 7 turn game of the base game (and as mentioned, expansion games usually take more turns to begin with).

Like I said, I enjoy having the expansion to shake up the base game a bit when I'm looking for something different occasionally, but I usually play without it. I find the increased playtime and luck factor to not be worth doing all that often.
6 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chuck Reed
United States
Jackson
Missouri
flag msg tools
I'm BullTaco and I approved this message.
badge
Mess with the Bull.....
Avatar
mbmbmbmb
myth1202 wrote:
If you're a bigTolkien-fan you will probably want both. Hopefully Battle of five armies will be good but Wotr is a master-piece and, IMHO, a must-buy for any Tolkien-gamer.



thumbsup
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Smith
United States
Bel Air
Maryland
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
bulltaco wrote:
myth1202 wrote:
If you're a bigTolkien-fan you will probably want both. Hopefully Battle of five armies will be good but Wotr is a master-piece and, IMHO, a must-buy for any Tolkien-gamer.



thumbsup

And another thumbsup
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Raf B
United States
Oakland
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Kartigan wrote:
Essentially the biggest reason the games go longer is the change in strategies that take place.

Well analyzed and thanks for reposting here. What I like about the expansion is that it tends to steer players away from a pure sprint/blitz approach and toward more balanced strategies. I'm a sucker for the thematic aspect of this game, so I don't mind that shift. But that does entail a longer playing time for the reasons you enumerate.

LoME makes both Lorien and Rivendell potentially much more difficult to conquer, if the FP invest the dice to harden those Strongholds sufficiently. This is also nicely thematic, and yet still presents the FP with difficult resource allocation decisions. (It's not as much of a no-brainer as Galadriel was in the old expansion.)

I am more in the yes camp of whether LoME is worth it, but it is by no means essential. The base game is strong and thematic enough on its own to make for many, many replays.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lee Nicholas
United States
Severn
Maryland
flag msg tools
God Be the Glory
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
In regards to the discussion of whether LoME is worth it...

One of my favorite aspects of War of the Ring is getting to glimpse 'alternate realities' of Tolkien's books. What would happen if Sauron bolstered his fortress in Mirkwood and reclaimed Dale? What would happen if the Witchking returned to Angmar and invaded the Grey Havens? Seeing those things play out is one of the most exciting parts of the game for me.

LoME strengthens those even further, featering even more 'what if' scenarios, a lot of which are very interesting.

In a recent play (I was the FP) my opponent loosed the Balrog from Moria. I forget the specific rules off-hand, but the fellowship was spotted passing through, and based on the results of the draw and the other mechanisms, Pippin was killed, but the Balrog was defeated, which lead to a good amount of laughter at the thought of Pippin playing the role of Gandalf in that famous scene...

Anyways, creating even more situations like that is why I would say LoME is as close as an expansion can get to being a 'must-buy' with the base game being as phenomenal as it is.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ian Madsen
United States
Kearns
Utah
flag msg tools
Trains!
badge
Houseplant?
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Nicholee wrote:
LoME strengthens those even further, featering even more 'what if' scenarios, a lot of which are very interesting.


In one of the games I played for the 2013 LoMe tournament, I had the Fellowship avoid the Balrog by traveling through Isengard & Rohan, with a declare in Helm's Deep to heal corruption. The Balrog proceeded to intercept the Fellowship in Gondor (Druadan Forest), which led to me revealing in Minas Morgul at a cost of 4 hunt tiles being drawn.

Re: First Lords of Middle-earth online tournament
Re: First Lords of Middle-earth online tournament
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Robert
United States
Lebanon
New Hampshire
flag msg tools
designer
Penny Press Kickstarter: 1,284 backers - $60,376! Amazing! Thank you!!!
badge
Play Penny Press!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It hasnt been my experience that LoME adds to the length of the game. Then again: WotR is already a full day experience for us.

WotR is not to be passed up, and I worry a little on the applicability of a war system to a battle game. But I have trust in Ares.

Get WotR with LoME for a great experience!
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Davis
United States
Mason
Ohio
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
WotR is my favorite game I have played and/or own - and it isn't even close. My only regret is that I do not get to play it as often as I would like to....

MM
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.