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Subject: Playing today need a few quick clarifications please rss

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Houserule Jay
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Bear with me, its late and my brain is exploding with strategic implications and rules overload! wow laugh I suspect the answers for these (rules were great!) but would rather not have doubts:

1. The rules state ONLY a train of its own colour can supply a general, correct? I found this surprising in the case of allies with all the other things going on like protecting Fortress etc, I guess the one exception is the Austrian General on the Flanders Map correct?

2. If Prussia gets the VP chit in the Schleschen box from temporary peace, what happens to the VP chit if they lose a Fortress later?

3. 17.5 Expedition Corps - If the power chooses an off-map General, he has to recruit two troops for it, what if he can't pay?

4. Political track -

a) 5 crossed out generals in the Russia track, Prussia only loses 1 general even if it crosses 2 of these correct? I think it is this way just to show where it gets it back?

b) Same with the 3 -1 cards on the Italy track, just one card or?

c) the 2 VP markers on the Italy track, I think just illustrated this way for consistency, the rules clearly state (sole) VP chit is only removed if the track gets back to the asterisk

Thanks!
 
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jayjonbeach wrote:
1. The rules state ONLY a train of its own colour can supply a general, correct? I found this surprising in the case of allies with all the other things going on like protecting Fortress etc, I guess the one exception is the Austrian General on the Flanders Map correct?

Yes.
e.g.: A mixed stack must be supplied from trains of both powers.
Special Rule: Pragmatic supply train supplys Arenberg, too.

jayjonbeach wrote:
2. If Prussia gets the VP chit in the Schleschen box from temporary peace, what happens to the VP chit if they lose a Fortress later?

The VP marker stays in the silesian VP box till the end.

jayjonbeach wrote:
3. 17.5 Expedition Corps - If the power chooses an off-map General, he has to recruit two troops for it, what if he can't pay?

In this case he has to choose an on-map general, because he can't pay the 8 TC points for the 2 troops the off-map general would need.

jayjonbeach wrote:
4. Political track -

a) 5 crossed out generals in the Russia track, Prussia only loses 1 general even if it crosses 2 of these correct? I think it is this way just to show where it gets it back?

b) Same with the 3 -1 cards on the Italy track, just one card or?

c) the 2 VP markers on the Italy track, I think just illustrated this way for consistency, the rules clearly state (sole) VP chit is only removed if the track gets back to the asterisk


a) Yes, only 1 general. On the political track you add up nothing. You only apply to the icons on the box the marker is in.

b) Yes.

c) Yes. VP symbol tells you to put a VP marker into the italy box. Symbol in the asterisk box tells you to remove any VP marker currently in the italy box.
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Houserule Jay
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Thank you for those answers. Here are a few more after playing:

(assume playing with the newest rules)

1. If someone uses a TC in the political theater (matching) and decides to conserve it, what happens to that card when the next political phase takes place and it does NOT match the suit and when?

2. If there are no cards in political theater with Prussian symbol, can they still bid? (presumable to conserve the TC)

3. If Prussia comes in 2nd in political theater, and the first player takes the only card with Prussian symbol, what happens to their card?

4. Who moves first, Pragmatic or Austria

Thanks!


 
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Ryan Keane
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jayjonbeach wrote:
Thank you for those answers. Here are a few more after playing:

(assume playing with the newest rules)

1. If someone uses a TC in the political theater (matching) and decides to conserve it, what happens to that card when the next political phase takes place and it does NOT match the suit and when?

Conserved cards are treated as matching the current turn's trump suit, regardless of whether the player played an additional card that turn, trump or non-trump. If that player gets a turn to select a political card, he may choose to again conserve the previously conserved card(s) and the newly played trump card (if applicable). If both political cards are already taken when that player's turn comes up, the previously conserved card(s) and the newly played trump card (if applicable) are returned to his hand.

jayjonbeach wrote:
2. If there are no cards in political theater with Prussian symbol, can they still bid? (presumable to conserve the TC)


Yes. If that player gets a turn to select a political card, he must conserve.

jayjonbeach wrote:
3. If Prussia comes in 2nd in political theater, and the first player takes the only card with Prussian symbol, what happens to their card?


Prussia must conserve the card.

jayjonbeach wrote:
4. Who moves first, Pragmatic or Austria


For movement:
On the Flanders map, if there is a dispute over turn order, Prag and Austria alternate moving one general at a time, with Prag moving first. Austria may move on the Bohemia map before or after the Flanders move, but cannot count Bohemia moves towards the alternating Flanders moves.

For battles:
Austria makes all of its battles first. Then Prag battles. Thus, usually a Prag/France battle will determine trump suit each turn.

I think that's all correct.
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Max DuBoff
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Just to clarify, though, as long as Austria and the Pragmatics agree on all their moves, they can move their pieces in any order. It's only alternating when they disagree (if, for example, both can go for a win).
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richard sivel
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For confirmation: All answers are correct.

One little addition

Quote:
jayjonbeach wrote:
3. 17.5 Expedition Corps - If the power chooses an off-map General, he has to recruit two troops for it, what if he can't pay?


Quote:

In this case he has to choose an on-map general, because he can't pay the 8 TC points for the 2 troops the off-map general would need.


If the player even has no general on-map, then the rules are silent acout that case. -- The obvious fix is: The player puts one off-map general into the offmap box and pays with all TCs he has left on hand, giving him the resulting number of troops (4-7 TC-points = 1 troop, 0-3 TC-points = 0 troop). [After all, the most important thing is that he lacks 1 general]
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Houserule Jay
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Thanks all and thank you Richard for the extra confirmation and addition

BTW Richard - Thank you for this masterpiece of a game and for the concise rules, some of the best rules I have read for a Wargame as I had very few questions after reading and really I suspected the answers as I mentioned
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richard sivel
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dear Jay,

I am happy that you like Maria. I hope that it will give you many hours of tense gaming.

And thanks a lot for your kind words on the quality of the rules wording. It was indeed quite a long process of writing and re-writing. Good to hear that it was worth the effort
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Kaarin Engelmann
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Clarification on Negotiations
The rules say that agreements may not change an alliance and that players may not agree on a peace treaty (except the "Annexation of Silesia"). Then there are examples. It is unclear to me if the examples demonstrate what is possible or what is not possible.

Are Austria and France allowed to make an agreement similar to the following:

France agrees to reduce military objectives and Austria agrees to not attack in Bavaria or France for two turns?

Are Prussia and Austria allowed to make an agreement similar to the following:

Austria will agree to Prussian Annexation of Silesia if the Prussians don't enter Austria for two turns (instead of the mandated one)?

I don't understand what "peace treaty" means in terms of this rule? Is it something permanent?

Thanks!





 
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Ryan Keane
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The examples demonstrate what is possible. Both of your examples are completely acceptable.

In relation to the where the rules say "Powers cannot agree on a peace treaty.." I think they specifically mean in relation to how Prussia becomes neutral for a turn after Austria agrees to the annexation. Prussia and Silesia become neutral and cannot be entered or exited, and we play that the duration of this neutrality can be negotiated (i.e. for 2 turns, exactly like your 2nd example). Other nations are not allowed to negotiate an official temporary neutrality.

Otherwise, we do play that temporary "peace treaties" in the more general sense can be negotiated. Enemy powers can negotiate to not attack each other for X turns or not move generals in a specific direction, etc. These are binding to a degree - it depends on how specific the negotiation is, usually we agree on our intentions but leave some wiggle room to be able to respond to unexpected dramatic changes in battles in other parts of the board.

We rarely offer subsidies (between allied powers only of course), but when we do, those do always come with very specific binding behaviors that the other player must uphold.

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Kaarin Engelmann
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Excellent. Thank you. All of that makes sense to me.
 
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Kaarin Engelmann
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Another question:

The rules say a General cannot Force March through an enemy-controlled fortress. The Playing Aid shows a French General Force Marching beyond an enemy-controlled fortress. The Playing Aid is wrong, correct?

 
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Federico
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The player aid is correct, because the French is marching over a Prussian fortress, so an allied fortress
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Kaarin Engelmann
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Okay, another example question: under Hussars, it shows a hussar between the generals and the supply train and starts counting from the supply train to determine distance. Can. I assume that is always the direction you count?
 
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MLeis
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As far as I know, it is legal to count in either direction as it doesn't have an effect on the resulting distance.
 
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Russ Williams
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kengelma wrote:
Okay, another example question: under Hussars, it shows a hussar between the generals and the supply train and starts counting from the supply train to determine distance. Can. I assume that is always the direction you count?

Why does it matter from which end you count? A distance is a distance. E.g. the distance from New York to Los Angeles = the distance from Los Angeles to New York.
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Kaarin Engelmann
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I suppose you are right. We used to always count only the spaces between the hussar and the supply train and not all of the spaces between the general and the supply train on the route that is blocked by the hussar.
 
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Kaarin Engelmann
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Clarification regarding Subsidy between major power
In a recent game, Prussia agreed to give France a one-card subsidy for one turn. The agreement was made during the Politics phase. The players wanted to know if France received the card on its turn or if it had to wait until the next Prussian turn for it. As the GM, I told them that they each got their part of the subsidy on their turn (i.e., Prussia one fewer card in his action phase and France one more card on his action phase). Is this accurate? Please confirm, Mr. Sivel, if possible!

Thanks!
 
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Alex Drazen
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I've always played that subsidies are distributed on the subsidizing player's turn, to all parties. It's a clean and simple way to do it because then you draw the same number of cards for each round that you normally would.
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Ryan Keane
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alexdrazen wrote:
I've always played that subsidies are distributed on the subsidizing player's turn, to all parties. It's a clean and simple way to do it because then you draw the same number of cards for each round that you normally would.


This is how we do it as well. The subsidizing country draws the full # of cards, keeping them face down, and then hands the appropriate subsidy of cards to the other country.

So in your example, France has to wait until Prussia's turn to receive its subsidy (although I don't think I've ever seen Prussia offer a subsidy to France before - I'd really only consider helping Bavaria to slow a strong Austrian westward advance).
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Alex Drazen
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Quote:
I don't think I've ever seen Prussia offer a subsidy to France before


It happen in my last game. France offered to move to a particular board location in Bohemia that was advantageous to me if I gave him a one TC subsidy. It was a pretty weird outlier case, though.
 
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