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Subject: Major Victory rss

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Matthew Looby
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Playing a game now. If one side has a Decisive Victory during the Supply Turn, is the game over, regardless of the location of the Calendar Markers?

I think so, I hope so!

Matt
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Chris Rice
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I think that's right Matt. If you get your marker onto the decisive victory box and and it's there when the supply turn starts, you've won. That's the way I read it.
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Mark Kwasny
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Rule 9.0 SUPPLY TURN says:

At the end of each Quarter, players simultaneously execute a Supply Turn. Follow these steps in the order given. A victory (4.0) is declared immediately at the end of each step if applicable.

So if the Victory marker is in the Decisive box at the end of any step in the SUpply phase, the game ends. So having it there at the start of the Supply phase does not seem to be enough - but if still there after adjusting for Towns (which probably is what put it there!) the game would end immediately, before the CSA got its VP for another turn ending.
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Chris Rice
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I don't think you're right here Mark. Victory is announced after each step of the supply turn. The first step is "supply" and the second is "Town VP". So if you are in the decisive victory box at the start of the supply turn you will never get to the second step and have to calculate Town VP.

That's the way it seems to read to me.
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Mark Kwasny
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I am right and wrong at the same time! I am right that you do not win at the start of the supply phase, you only win at the end of one of the steps in the Supply Turn. However, I forgot about the first step which is a Supply check. So yes, if someone is in the Decisive box after checking supply, the game ends.
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Chris Rice
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Mark, it would seem more logical to me that Victory be counted after the Town VP is calculated, but I'm sure the rules work fine as they are in this regard.
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Mark Kwasny
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Technically, I do not think the Town VP step is needed. The VPs for occupying a VP Town are marked immediately as players take control during Movement and Combat. I think it is there just to give a player (the USA in particular) a chance to win before the CSA gets its VP for the passage of time. So as long as Supply attrition does not remove the last unit from a VP Town, the game would really end there.
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Chris Rice
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Where does it say that Town VP are marked immediately?
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Mark Kwasny
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Rule 4.31 TOWN VP says:

The USA wins 1vp each time it occupies Winchester, but the CSA wins 1vp each time it regains control.

It does not say, each time you control a VP town in the Supply Turn - in fact, that would be a very different rule. The USA player would occupy Winchester during his Movement, and the CSA would regain control during his turn. There is no mention of waiting for the Supply Turn. Even in the Supply Turn, it says:

Town VP: Check that all Town VP have been awarded.

It does not say to award VPs now, just check to make sure they have been.

But in the end, it simply does not matter. Whether you mark VPs immediately during the Player Turns, or wait until the Supply Turn, the result is identical. The Player will win if he is in the Decisive box after the Supply Step, or after they "check" to see if all VPs have been awarded in the Town VP step.
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Matthew Looby
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Oh this is good news, thanks for all the wonderful feedback.

Matt
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Chris Rice
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Just a thought.

Is there a possible scenario where a unit occupied an enemy town during the turn and has therefore been awarded a VP. However, it is eliminated during the supply step of the supply turn due to attrition. Would its VP count for a victory. I'm guessing yes.
 
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Matthew Looby
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Wimplesaur wrote:
Just a thought.

Is there a possible scenario where a unit occupied an enemy town during the turn and has therefore been awarded a VP. However, it is eliminated during the supply step of the supply turn due to attrition. Would its VP count for a victory. I'm guessing yes.


Hey Chris,

Supply is checked first, right? Units suffer supply attrition, then VP check, so a unit could perish prior to VP determonation, right?

Thanks,

Matt
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Mark Kwasny
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Wimplesaur wrote:
Just a thought.

Is there a possible scenario where a unit occupied an enemy town during the turn and has therefore been awarded a VP. However, it is eliminated during the supply step of the supply turn due to attrition. Would its VP count for a victory. I'm guessing yes.


I have been trying to think of a sequence where this order of events could matter, but so far, I cannot. To answer your above question, no, the VP would not count.

In your example, the VP would (in my interpretation) be awarded immediately as the player takes control of the VP town, which might actually take the player into the Decisive box, but the game continues, because victory is only awarded at the end of a Supply Turn step. Once the Supply Turn begins, first players execute the Supply step. At that time, one of the player's units in a VP town is eliminated due to attrition. The town reverts to control of the opposing player, and thus the Victory marker is moved back down out of the Decisive box. (I see there is more than one time that a player can gain control of a VP town!) The original player would not win a decisive victory and the game continues.
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