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## Subject: Smaller production run than pre-orders taken?

dan h
I just received an email from my FOLGS in which they say "Wizkids severely under printed this game". My pre-order was placed in mid March and they can only supply enough for orders placed last year. Is anyone else experiencing this?

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Daniel Brown
United States
Cumming
Georgia
But don't be fooled by the radio, the TV, or the magazines. They'll show you photographs of how your life should be but they're just someone else's fantasies.
Aquatopper wrote:
I just received an email from my FOLGS in which they say "Wizkids severely under printed this game". My pre-order was placed in mid March and they can only supply enough for orders placed last year. Is anyone else experiencing this?

Which FOLGS?

I know demand is greater than supply but this seems extreme
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Jesse Olivier
Abbotsford
bc
yeah it seems silly that they are letting you know now. they should have known pretty close to when you ordered.

makes me wonder if ill get my entire order

I think a big part of the issue is this isnt like producing copys of a boardgame. many people are ordering 2+ grav feeds rather than one copy of a game. I immagine there will be sme people with alot of extra and a large group with none..

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Joel Eddy
United States
Coeur d'Alene
ID
Aquatopper wrote:
I just received an email from my FOLGS in which they say "Wizkids severely under printed this game". My pre-order was placed in mid March and they can only supply enough for orders placed last year. Is anyone else experiencing this?

Which FOLGS?

I know demand is greater than supply but this seems extreme

I'd like to know as well. Mine hasn't technically charged me yet, so I'm betting I might miss out early, even though I pre-ordered pretty much the week it became available.

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Jeff Briggs
United States
Farmington
Utah
Guess I was lucky. My local store hadn't yet started taking preorders till me. The manger had to call there main store to verify it was ok to do preorders. This was only 2 weeks ago at most. I ordered 2 starters and 1 box of boosters.

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Kevin Warrender
United States
Rockaway
New Jersey
Hmmm....so if I buy all the copies I can find at B&N, Target, Walmart, etc and sell them on BGG for $16 instead of$15.......

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Michael Wood
I received a similar message from cult of the new regarding my preorder.

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Keith Collins
United States
Seymour
Indiana
@majmalfunction
No message ... yet. I ordered from Miniature Market.

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Ken Newell
Prince George
British Columbia
I'm confused...

One of the designers came on here to defend the collectible nature of this game as a method for getting into some big box retailers. He made it sound like the deal was already done (without actually saying so in his post in his defense).

But now we are finding out that there isn't enough copies for F/OLGS' preorders, so is there not enough then for big box retailers either? I have to assume the demands for F/OLGS' are considerably smaller than the demands for big box retailers. So if there isn't enough for smaller demand is this game really going to be in big biz as well or was that just a smoke screen or perhaps a hope or pipe dream by wizkids and the designers?
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United States
Wesley Chapel
Florida
No matter where you go, there you are.
Preserve Our Wildlife!
I had a bad feeling this was going to happen. A few reputable dealers are no longer taking pre-orders. Which tells me they know how many they have ordered and stopped taking pre-orders when they sold out of what they knew they had ordered.

That leaves one to wonder if all the retailers accepting pre-orders now are accepting them while not knowing when they can be filled.

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Jason Vany
I pre-ordered early as well for the base and a box of boosters, at this point I am hoping that I will get them. The news about selling out stock and seeing the pre-orders still coming in concerns me slightly about how many copies and boosters will actually be available.

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MFK
United States
Michigan
LFITQ wrote:
So if there isn't enough for smaller demand is this game really going to be in big biz as well or was that just a smoke screen or perhaps a hope or pipe dream by wizkids and the designers?

Maybe they landed a deal for placement in Target/Walmart and are now like "OH SHI--we didn't make enough for this! Cancel the FLGS orders!"

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Ken Newell
Prince George
British Columbia
metalfacekevin wrote:
LFITQ wrote:
So if there isn't enough for smaller demand is this game really going to be in big biz as well or was that just a smoke screen or perhaps a hope or pipe dream by wizkids and the designers?

Maybe they landed a deal for placement in Target/Walmart and are now like "OH SHI--we didn't make enough for this! Cancel the FLGS orders!"

Let's hope... Maybe?!?

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koraldon
Israel
holon
Well, dice should be fast to manufacture, if they have the molds.
Question is how long will the whole process take...

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John Wiser
United States
Illinois
This is why I went ahead and preordered two of the starter sets and two booster boxes. The price point of this game is going to have these flying off the shelves...when you are able to find them. From what has been said this is already being reprinted, so the wait should not be that long.

At the price point of \$1 a booster pack you will be lucky to find them at Target/Walmart as I see people picking up the whole box. And more so if local comic shops/game stores have very little to start with. Look at the Heroclix single packs Target gets in, they are gone in a flash and from what I have seen it is not one, two, three at a time but in bigger amounts and most of the time by the box.

As for the statement about these big box stores taking preorders, Wow!, that is a first if this is true. I never heard nor seen a Target/Walmart taking preorders for these type of games...but then again I never have looked as I do not preorder these type of things from them.

Sounds like Wizkids has a hot item on their hands and now we will see if they are able to keep it going with this title. Hope so, at this price point I can collect two sets for two players to field their favorite Marvel character...well as long as he/she is in the set that is.

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United States
Wesley Chapel
Florida
No matter where you go, there you are.
Preserve Our Wildlife!
I'm actually in advertising. With the correct advertising you can literally sell a relatively useless item. "Pet Rock" being the penultimate example. It's a rock. Put it in a box, give it the correct advertising, and you have a hot item.

The grand slam is when you combine three important components in sales. Most importantly is a strong advertising campaign. This will sell an item like napkins at a ketchup festival. However, glory fades if the product itself is sub par. The second requirement for success is price point/perceived value. If you can sell what looks like diamonds for the price of coal. This again, when paired with a strong advertising campaign will move sales. However, the the one caveat to the above two rules is the product itself must be useful to maintain longevity in sales.

Dice Masters looks to have made the trifecta on the advertising front. They have advertised smartly. Wizkids put the product into the hands of people who will be vocal and public about the product. Luckily, the reviews on this product have been virtually unanimous in their praise. So they have effectively created a large buzz on this game. Look at how much activity this game has on BGG alone - and it's not even released yet! In fact, it's release has been delayed.

All of these factors have come together to create a demand that I'm guessing far surpasses what Wizkids had hoped to generate in the pre-release environment.

This actually leads to the most coveted of all advertising principles "supply vs. demand." People, by nature, usually want what they can't have. This technique is arguably honed to perfection by cell phomne companies who deliberately keep production numbers conservative in an effort to generate even more demand for the product.

Though I don't believe Wizkids deliberately under-produced the first run (I sincerely believe they could not have predicted the strong demand for this product that is already out there), it is working in their favor. I see a "in hand" Startet set on ebay with bids up to 20.00+ (plus 6.00 shipping) already! Someone is literally going to pay 100% over retail (at least) for the starter set. The only non-collectible component of the game!

rest assured, Wizkids is not Motorolla or Sony, they cannot afford to have demand outweigh supply. They are likely going gangbusters right now trying to meet the surprising demand for the product.

This is cold comfort since most of us are impatient. We watched the game played on youtube. We watched the reviews, one after another, express their enthusiasm for this new game.

Frankly I'm as excited as the next guy. I've been a member of BGG for years and this is the first game I have ever written about in a forum. I played Magic The Gathering when Legends came out. I think this game has at least that much potential. The strategy in this game is lighter than Magic, but I think this is going to attract even more players. Poker is popular because anyone can win at some time. However, like poker, I feel that the better player will win a majority of the games in Dice Masters as there are enough critical decisions in the game to place strategy ahead of luck as the determining factor in victory.

So, there's my long winded rant. C'mon Wizkids, don't drop the ball here. You got a hit on your hands. Treat it with kid gloves and do the right thing. Get the product to the customer. All things being said, the best advertising you can get is to have hundreds of people playing the game and talking it up. ...That won't happen until you get the product into our hands.

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Robert Forrest
Australia
Embleton
Western Australia
I'm actually in advertising. With the correct advertising you can literally sell a relatively useless item. "Pet Rock" being the penultimate example.

If pet rock was the second last example, what was the last one?
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United States
Wesley Chapel
Florida
No matter where you go, there you are.
Preserve Our Wildlife!
Edward J Grug III wrote:
I'm actually in advertising. With the correct advertising you can literally sell a relatively useless item. "Pet Rock" being the penultimate example.

If pet rock was the second last example, what was the last one?

second-to-last example? Originally I wrote more. Pet rock was the last example and the original penultimate example was the smiley-face shirt from the 70's. I deemed that the latter example was redundant and unnecessary to supporting my point. However I did not quite edit the text enough to remove all of my errors. As such, many errors pepper that post. If we're being picyune we could probbaly find considerably more. But hey - it's a public forum - whaddaya want for nothing?

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William Bowers
United States
Nashville
Tennessee
Edward J Grug III wrote:
I'm actually in advertising. With the correct advertising you can literally sell a relatively useless item. "Pet Rock" being the penultimate example.

If pet rock was the second last example, what was the last one?

second-to-last example? Originally I wrote more. Pet rock was the last example and the original penultimate example was the smiley-face shirt from the 70's. I deemed that the latter example was redundant and unnecessary to supporting my point. However I did not quite edit the text enough to remove all of my errors. As such, many errors pepper that post. If we're being picyune we could probbaly find considerably more. But hey - it's a public forum - whaddaya want for nothing?

I think he was just making a funny. also I think you mean "pedantic" not "picayune"

As to the original post, maybe a case of how much capital they were able to outlay for the original run. Or maybe it's a few isolated incidents. I would sure hope the hobby stores, which I imagine are WizKids backbone, are not left out in the cold while the company pursues more traditional retail markets.
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Ken Newell
Prince George
British Columbia
Edward J Grug III wrote:
I'm actually in advertising. With the correct advertising you can literally sell a relatively useless item. "Pet Rock" being the penultimate example.

If pet rock was the second last example, what was the last one?

second-to-last example? Originally I wrote more. Pet rock was the last example and the original penultimate example was the smiley-face shirt from the 70's. I deemed that the latter example was redundant and unnecessary to supporting my point. However I did not quite edit the text enough to remove all of my errors. As such, many errors pepper that post. If we're being picyune we could probbaly find considerably more. But hey - it's a public forum - whaddaya want for nothing?

: occurring immediately before the last one : next to the last
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Robert Forrest
Australia
Embleton
Western Australia
Edward J Grug III wrote:
I'm actually in advertising. With the correct advertising you can literally sell a relatively useless item. "Pet Rock" being the penultimate example.

If pet rock was the second last example, what was the last one?

second-to-last example? Originally I wrote more. Pet rock was the last example and the original penultimate example was the smiley-face shirt from the 70's. I deemed that the latter example was redundant and unnecessary to supporting my point. However I did not quite edit the text enough to remove all of my errors. As such, many errors pepper that post. If we're being picyune we could probbaly find considerably more. But hey - it's a public forum - whaddaya want for nothing?

Penultimate means 'the one before last,' not 'best possible.'
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United States
Wesley Chapel
Florida
No matter where you go, there you are.
Preserve Our Wildlife!
Edward J Grug III wrote:

Penultimate means 'the one before last,' not 'best possible.'

And circle gets the square.

And yes, "picyune" means petty or of little value. That was the intended sentiment. "Pedantic" fits as well. In fact, it was probably a smarter word choice.

As for the actual original post:

As Mr. Bowers has said, one hopes that the hobby stores take some priority over big box stores. If Wizkids did manage to get into big box retailers my guess is those orders exceed all small hobby stores combined in quantity. There's probably more big box retailers in my one state than there are small hobby stores carrying Dice Masters in the country.

I'm not even sure that Dice Masters made it into the Big Box stores. Is this confirmed? It sounds about right with the price point and the current demand for the product. I don't think I've seen any Wizkids products in big box stores. Maybe they are there as I'm just not up on the Wizkids line of products.

For what it's worth there are currently around 6,000 target and wal mart store in the US alone. If each one of these stores gets just 5 starter sets and maybe 5 booster boxes....well that's quite a bit of product not going to small hobby stores.

Regardless - oh wait, "irregardless" (wait for it) ...Wizkids will eventually produce enough product to meet demand. Just a matter of when. I want it NOW!

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Cornixt
Cheap as chips

For what it's worth there are currently around 6,000 target and wal mart store in the US alone. If each one of these stores gets just 5 starter sets and maybe 5 booster boxes....well that's quite a bit of product not going to small hobby stores.

It's possible that the order from the big box stores was bigger than expected and the FLGS availability was shrunk in response.

Quote:

Regardless - oh wait, "irregardless" (wait for it)

Don't misunderestimate the grammar pedents.
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M
United States
If you are looking to pre-order online, even though CSI, Miniature Market and others stopped taking pre-orders, you can still pre-order from Entertainment Earth.

http://www.entertainmentearth.com/prodinfo.asp?number=NC7129...

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Jesse Olivier
Abbotsford
bc
Mattrick wrote:
If you are looking to pre-order online, even though CSI, Miniature Market and others stopped taking pre-orders, you can still pre-order from Entertainment Earth.

http://www.entertainmentearth.com/prodinfo.asp?number=NC7129...

Coolstuff told me today that they will 100 % beable to fulfill all of their preorders. They said that they get an estimation of how much they can have for preorders and then only let about 90ish percent of it available for preorders.

So if you ordered from CSI you will have your stuff in the mail on the 23ed for sure!

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