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Lost Valley: The Yukon Goldrush 1896» Forums » General

Subject: Checked my E-mail, and said Whaaat Da.... rss

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Mike Putrino
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I GOT A TRACKING NUMBER!!!!!
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Wow! Had no idea the games began shipping yet. This is great news!

Anyone else find it strange that Pandasaurus hasn't sent a single Kickstarter Update to inform their backers that A) the games cleared customs, B) the games arrived at the warehouse, C) the games are at Amazon, or D) Amazon has began shipping orders????

I didn't know any of these events transpired until I checked the comments section on Kickstarter.

Lost Valley is my first and last Kickstarter project I will ever support.
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Daniel Kearns
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OverEngineered wrote:

Lost Valley is my first and last Kickstarter project I will ever support.


It would be unfortunate to hold all kickstarter campaigns to the exceptionally poor standard set by Pandasaurus.

I've pledged many campaigns and I've never seen this level of neglect combined with unexplained delays.

Kickstarting companies that value their supporters is actually a really cool experience.
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Dan Keller
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dkearns wrote:
OverEngineered wrote:

Lost Valley is my first and last Kickstarter project I will ever support.


It would be unfortunate to hold all kickstarter campaigns to the exceptionally poor standard set by Pandasaurus.

I've pledged many campaigns and I've never seen this level of neglect combined with unexplained delays.

Kick starting companies that calue their supporters is actually a really cool experience.


Agreed. While I've enjoyed the games that Pandasaurus has produced and the quality of those games, they are among the worst in communicating to backers, and really is not representative of many other KS projects. I think Nathan got burned so badly on the Tammany Hall fiasco that he's swung to the other extreme, giving almost no information until everything has already happened, which itself is a major problem.
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Mark Raciborski
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Looks like they got caught up in using the Comment option in Kickstarter rather then the Update, basically answering questions but forgetting to double post it.
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C Bazler
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You'd think this would be worthy of putting in a KS update, considering we have all been waiting for literally 18 months. I guess Nathan has better things to do...

It's sad that any information about this game we have to learn here, from each other. The level of neglect and incompetence is unbelievable.

EDIT: LOL, just got an update!
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Bob
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Just received this from the KS side:



"Project Update #33: US copies are shipping!

Posted by Pandasaurus Games ♥ Like
About 150 of you should have started to get tracking numbers from Amazon yesterday with your copy of Lost Valley en route! We expect the rest of our US backers games to start shipping shortly as you are all in the queue.

A bit of background on how Amazon shipping works: I send all of the games to a single Amazon warehouse in Kentucky. They then ship out the games that are near enough to Kentucky to be affordable to Amazon. The rest of the games are then moved around to different Amazon fulfillment centers and shipped from a closer location. These shipments can take a few days, so the further away from Kentucky you are the longer it will take to get your shipping notice. Though, in my experience everyone should have one by next week!

I know a lot of you were there for the Tammany campaign, and I promised we would take some lessons away on handling shipping. This is the process we used for Great Fire and New Amsterdam and so far Amazon has been pretty good about getting the games out there.

Canadian backers! Dear friends in the great white North. Your copies are making their way to customs now and will hopefully be shipping to you shortly. These will ship via Amazon once the games arrive so you will have tracking numbers e-mailed as well. Because we are importing the games in bulk to Canada you shouldn't get hit with any Canadian taxes or Fedex/UPS hostage fees.

EU Backers: Your copies are going to take a bit longer as shipments over land are slower than those by sea. Lesson learned, but going forward we will have the first copies sent out to the EU before the rest of the games are finished for any future projects to try and line shipping up with the US/Canadian games. These will ship via Amazon once the games arrive so you will have tracking numbers e-mailed as well. Because we are importing the games in bulk to the EU you shouldn't get hit with any VAT or Fedex/UPS hostage fees.

Rest of the world: I am going to have a giant box of about 80 games sent to me so that i can ship the games out. We are going to start building the boxes now and paying for the shipping lables so we can turn these around as quickly as possible. I *think* I have a way to get tracking info on these boxes without bankrupting the company, so if it works the way the only helpful USPS employee I've ever spoken to described you should be able to track your package as well. We will declare the games value as the production cost of the game to try and help you avoid any taxes and will ship via USPS to avoid the Fedex/UPS hostage fees.

We are super happy that these games are *finally* getting out to you and again want to apologize for the delays with the title. I know we are shipping way later than we intended, but I hope the final product that Roland, Johannes and Tobias will be worth it (if you didn't notice the new edition picked up an additional Goslar as a designer). We're incredibly proud of the final game and think we've put out a game that is going to earn a place on your shelf for years to come, and think that there is something very special here.

I also want to assure everyone that we have again taken lessons from this Kickstarter campaign. We will be using Kickstarter less frequently than we did in the past (Yedo was not, and Machi Koro will not be Kickstarted), and when we do come to Kickstarter we will be coming with a product that is 100% ready to print so that we can hand the files to the printer the second the campaign ends.

We want to thank you again for helping make this game a reality. This has been a grail game for a lot of people for a very long time, and it couldn't have happened without you. This title was Kickstarted because it couldn't have happened without you. Product Management obviously wasn't handled as well as we wanted, but at the end of the day all of you helped bring a game back into print that very likely never would have seen another printing without your help, and it means a lot to all of us at team Pandasaurus. We're just glad that you finally get to see what the fruits of your efforts created and hopefully have a blast doing so!"
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Pandasaurus Games
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My general rule of thumb is to post updates only when I know that something is happening. As of early yesterday it looked like Amazon wasn't going to get any copies out the door until early next week. Then they fired off about 100 copies earlier than expected.

A lesson I took away from the Tammany campaign is basically to not trust what back-channel suppliers are telling me. Estimates or Quotes that I am given are often wildly inaccurate, and I misled a lot of backers on the Tammany campaign by sharing that information (including that we had cleared customs almost 2 months before we actually did).

I don't know what the exact right balance is, so I've been leaning on the comments section as a place to share non-final information and the update to share hard info.
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Mark Raciborski
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cbazler wrote:
You'd think this would be worthy of putting in a KS update, considering we have all been waiting for literally 18 months. I guess Nathan has better things to do...

It's sad that any information about this game we have to learn here, from each other. The level of neglect and incompetence is unbelievable.

EDIT: LOL, just got an update!


Well there you go, looks like Nathan reads BGG threads.. (tongue in cheeck) LOL.....

I got use to reading and checking the comments without even thinking I wasn't getting Updates. I use the Kickstarter app on an IPad so I didn't think about Updates and the Comments were supplying the info.
 
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Pandasaurus Games
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danamark wrote:
cbazler wrote:
You'd think this would be worthy of putting in a KS update, considering we have all been waiting for literally 18 months. I guess Nathan has better things to do...

It's sad that any information about this game we have to learn here, from each other. The level of neglect and incompetence is unbelievable.

EDIT: LOL, just got an update!


Well there you go, looks like Nathan reads BGG threads.. (tongue in cheeck) LOL.....


I try to keep up with BGG. The more games we have the harder it gets to keep on top of, but we sometimes have someone with an issue who posts here or sends me a geekmail (which I'm awful at checking).

I've been on this forum the last week or so pretty regularly since I knew we were getting near shipping.



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This just in: My copy of Lost Valley has shipped!

Estimated delivery date: Monday, April 7!
 
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dkearns wrote:
OverEngineered wrote:

Lost Valley is my first and last Kickstarter project I will ever support.


It would be unfortunate to hold all kickstarter campaigns to the exceptionally poor standard set by Pandasaurus.

I've pledged many campaigns and I've never seen this level of neglect combined with unexplained delays.

Kickstarting companies that value their supporters is actually a really cool experience.


To be fair, I should add that this isn't the only reason why I'll never back another Kickstarter project. I simply see zero benefit in purchasing games through Kickstarter. However, I see many problems with purchasing games through Kickstarter. This experience highlights only one of those reasons -- the rest I won't get into because they're not relevant to this thread.
 
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Richard Pardoe
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Quote:
I send all of the games to a single Amazon warehouse in Kentucky. They then ship out the games that are near enough to Kentucky to be affordable to Amazon. The rest of the games are then moved around to different Amazon fulfillment centers and shipped from a closer location.

Just got my shipping notice to California, so either my state has moved closer to Kentucky or Amazon is ahead of the game with the second step.

Looking online, it appears that my parcel will actually ship from Indiana arriving sometime next week.



 
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Paul M
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Looks like somebody found the Lost Valley.
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Barry Kendall
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Mine is supposed to arrive on my doorstep this coming Monday. Woohoo!

Can't speak for anyone else, but I did receive periodic updates re Lost Valley. This certainly isn't the only project that took a long time from campaign to shipping; I assume when I pledge a KS that it's likely to be up to a year 'til I see the product.

I'm just glad it's being made available again and that there are component improvements to boot.
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Scott Cameron

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The game arrived here on Long Island today--I just got the box in. Everything is excellent quality & looks great & I think you'll all be very pleased when you get it. Definitely worth the wait.
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Bob
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No shipping notice in Nebraska yet... ninja
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Mike Weimholt
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Nathan, are the copies being sold as pre-orders by Miniature Market, CSI, et al among the copies now being shipped by Amazon? Or are those copies being shipped through other channels?
 
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mweimholt wrote:
Nathan, are the copies being sold as pre-orders by Miniature Market, CSI, et al among the copies now being shipped by Amazon? Or are those copies being shipped through other channels?


Nope.

Those will be delivered to distributors after the Kickstart copies ship. I don't know which distributors are selling to which stores or how the stores are delivering since I'm not directly involved. But, I would expect those in a few weeks.
 
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I've been really angry because without Lost Valley there have been no new games to play, no old games to pull out again. I've just been sitting here waiting... waiting... I'm so sad.

Ok, snark aside, I've wished it came sooner, but the criticism of Pandasaurus has been really sharp. I've not felt the same degree of angst over the delays and communication that some have felt. Sure Nathan could have done some things differently, but I personally have never felt like there was any duplicitous going on, just a young company going through some growing pains.

I hope the game arrives soon (still waiting on my notice). I hope that it looks great and plays great. I hope Nathan learns the right balance so that he can be successful in this industry. (Good luck, brother.)

In the meantime, I'm gonna play Tammany Hall because that game is awesome sauce!!
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Roland Goslar
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Hi all,
just my 2cent.

The delay is on many cases my fault too as I liked to include some really big changes to the old version.
Some companies would have said we just make a new printrun and get the kickstarter money.
But Nathan gave us the time to go over and over the issues we saw in the game after 10 years.

In retrospect we might have started the kickstarter a bit - a year - later, but maybe then the new edition wouldn't ever have seen the light.
So I got to say "Thank you Nathan for kicking me to get it out off the cellar and thank you all backers for enabling this new game to come to life."

I saw so many prototypes published by wellknown companies kicking out major game parts for streamlining, but Nathan never did this and the result is the game we wanted to do. (Yet some new ideas surfaced meanwhile - designer problem) I'll never play the old version again.

Of course there might be some problems left with the rules or balancing.
Just post them. I'll try to think and answer.
And maybe some backers or even all will hate the new version.
But I really love the new exploration, the fur, the skills, the claims, the team play and especially the treasure hunt.

Roland
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Daniel Kearns
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I think I would feel differently about the way the campaign was handled if you just told us what was going on once in a while.

It really isn't too much to ask.

Also, I don't read the kickstarter comments much during the campaign and never afterwards so leaving important information there won't reach me or likely most of the supporters.

EDIT: I don't recall during the campaign the idea that you were going to have to do so much extra work or that you would be making changes to the core set. I thought I was signing up for a reprint.

EDIT2: looking at the kickstarter page, they do mention tweaks to the core rules.
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Mike Putrino
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stooge wrote:
mweimholt wrote:
Nathan, are the copies being sold as pre-orders by Miniature Market, CSI, et al among the copies now being shipped by Amazon? Or are those copies being shipped through other channels?


Nope.

Those will be delivered to distributors after the Kickstart copies ship. I don't know which distributors are selling to which stores or how the stores are delivering since I'm not directly involved. But, I would expect those in a few weeks.

This is good to know. I started a thread a couple weeks ago and never got an answer from you guys.
I am happy that backers are not going to have to see it on the shelves of the flgs first, like so many other kickstarter games. I can think of a few...
 
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Deb Wentworth
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RoGo wrote:
Hi all,
just my 2cent.

The delay is on many cases my fault too as I liked to include some really big changes to the old version.
Some companies would have said we just make a new printrun and get the kickstarter money.
But Nathan gave us the time to go over and over the issues we saw in the game after 10 years.

Roland


Thanks, Roland, for this explanation. While the wait was long, I'm grateful that you and Your team poured so much into it. I'm sure the final product will be fantastic.

Can't wait to see my new game!
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James Butler
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"EU Backers: Your copies are going to take a bit longer as shipments over land are slower than those by sea. Lesson learned, but going forward we will have the first copies sent out to the EU before the rest of the games are finished for any future projects to try and line shipping up with the US/Canadian games. These will ship via Amazon once the games arrive so you will have tracking numbers e-mailed as well. Because we are importing the games in bulk to the EU you shouldn't get hit with any VAT or Fedex/UPS hostage fees."

Will Amazon (the european branch) be sent extra copies, so those of us over here who didn't back the game might be able to purchase it?
 
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