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7 Wonders: Leaders – Wil» Forums » Rules

Subject: So, exactly what does Wil do? What is the official ruling? rss

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Richard Hutnik
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I have seen a number of people speculate. At the event near where I am, I just got the card only, but no idea what the card does officially. Anyone here know what the card does officially?
 
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Richard Hutnik
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Ok, I found this page that had info on it, and I trust it is correct:
http://www.tabletopday.com/tabletop-day-swag/

So, we are super proud to announce the official Wil Wheaton 7 Wonders promotional leader. Wil’s special power in real life is to draw the best talent around him, so the game designer Antoine Bauza simulated his power in game. When played, Wil has the ability to draw all leaders to one player. You pick the best and give the rest back. Super powerful and doubly so if you get it autographed by Wil himself at one of his many convention appearances.

What would be interesting here is if you gave the cards back AND Wil, and the player who had their card taken can then be able to use Wil next round.
 
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Brian K
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What does this mean exactly? Is it just that you steal a leader in play? Do you give the others away to whomever you want, or to the original owner? Why take them in the first place? I'm not following the language, "draw them to you" then "give them back?"
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Richard Hutnik
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spiderM9 wrote:
What does this mean exactly? Is it just that you steal a leader in play? Do you give the others away to whomever you want, or to the original owner? Why take them in the first place? I'm not following the language, "draw them to you" then "give them back?"


The rules are vague, as per that website. It does look like it can be read that Wil player ends up giving back players what maybe they didn't get back.
 
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Jason Bostick
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The only way I could see this being really 'useful' would be to go through all not selected leaders (including those not dealt out) and picking the best one.

Otherwise, you may have already seen any 'best' leader and you'd have picked it before instead of picking Wil and not wasting a leaders slot.
 
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John Galietta III
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Based on the first icon, it looks like you get to look at ALL unplayed leaders, possibly in player's hands and the ones put back in the box. The second icon looks like the standard "play one for free" icon, which would make sense, since just having Wil in front of you does nothing, so he lets you play any unused leader as your leader for that turn.
 
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Steven Albano
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What is said on the website doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it's a communication issue?

What it seems like he does is have each opponent give you one leader to add to your leader reserve, then you play a leader.
 
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Bryan Thunkd
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Solelron wrote:
Otherwise, you may have already seen any 'best' leader and you'd have picked it before instead of picking Wil and not wasting a leaders slot.
If you have a choice between a great card and the Wil card, then you can keep the great card and I'll take Wil. When the cards hit the table, my Wil card will take your great card and you'll have nothing.
 
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John Galietta III
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My question is, if you take another player's leader from their reserve and play it, does that mean they are short 1 leader for the game?
 
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Scotty Mac
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Fantastic. Being the completionist I am, another promo I get to overpay for...

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Matthew Collier
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scottemc wrote:
Fantastic. Being the completionist I am, another promo I get to overpay for...



At least I've seen a bunch selling for $15 or less between the marketplace and ebay, snagged mine for $10 with free shipping
 
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Richard Hutnik
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scottemc wrote:
Fantastic. Being the completionist I am, another promo I get to overpay for...



 
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Dan Fox
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I'm trying this interpretation:

Each player gives you one of his unused leaders. You reveal them, choose any one to play immediately (at no additional cost) and return the remaining to their owners. Wil is given to the player from whom you took the leader; that player may then play Wil during the following Age if he so desires.
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Richard Hutnik
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Foxman wrote:
I'm trying this interpretation:

Each player gives you one of his unused leaders. You reveal them, choose any one to play immediately (at no additional cost) and return the remaining to their owners. Wil is given to the player from whom you took the leader; that player may then play Wil during the following Age if he so desires.


Well, that is a mix of what I had in mind and what others were suggesting. It may work. But, I was just trying to balance what was seen as the original rules, where players reveal ALL their leaders and player playing Wil ends up picking an unplayer leader and passes the leader card to the player who had a leader taken from him/her. I would activate this taking AFTER players selected a leader in a round.
 
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Steven Fouts
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Until I'm told otherwise, I'm considering this an official ruling.
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foutss wrote:




Until I'm told otherwise, I'm considering this an official ruling.

I actually like this. (I'm almost surprised.) I can discard my worst card and get a random one back. It has the potential to help me even if I don't play Wil myself.
 
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raithyn wrote:
foutss wrote:




Until I'm told otherwise, I'm considering this an official ruling.

I actually like this. (I'm almost surprised.) I can discard my worst card and get a random one back. It has the potential to help me even if I don't play Wil myself.


If this is the rule, I'd never play Wil and always hope that someone else does. He's more helpful to others than to the person playing him, since everyone else gets rid of their worst leader and get a chance at a better one, while Wil has to hope that there's a good leader among others' worst cards.

Well, he might be ok if you play him at the start of Age three when almost everyone is done playing leaders, so their bonus is wasted.
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Christopher Scatliff
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It becomes better if you have it so Wil draws randomly from each player's remaining leaders rather than that player choosing which one to give.
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Smoo wrote:
It becomes better if you have it so Wil draws randomly from each player's remaining leaders rather than that player choosing which one to give.


I consider that to be *much* worse, it would be a massively random pain in the behind, which would often completely screw up the strategies of one or more other players by stealing a central leader from him which he planned his entire strategy around.
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Christopher Scatliff
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Darador wrote:
Smoo wrote:
It becomes better if you have it so Wil draws randomly from each player's remaining leaders rather than that player choosing which one to give.


I consider that to be *much* worse, it would be a massively random pain in the behind, which would often completely screw up the strategies of one or more other players by stealing a central leader from him which he planned his entire strategy around.


Exactly. That's why it's better.
 
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Christopher Boat
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Smoo wrote:
Darador wrote:
Smoo wrote:
It becomes better if you have it so Wil draws randomly from each player's remaining leaders rather than that player choosing which one to give.


I consider that to be *much* worse, it would be a massively random pain in the behind, which would often completely screw up the strategies of one or more other players by stealing a central leader from him which he planned his entire strategy around.


Exactly. That's why it's better.


Better for the player who has Wil, worse for the general feeling of the game overall. I can't think of any other card in the game that so drastically upsets the balance. The #1 complaint about the Leaders expansion already is that you have plan your whole strategy around your Leaders.

If those are the correct rules on Wil, I guarantee I'll house-rule.
 
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Christopher Scatliff
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The game already includes the mechanism to dump critical cards that players need into your wonder or into the middle. How is this any more objectionable?
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Christopher Boat
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Smoo wrote:
The game already includes the mechanism to dump critical cards that players need into your wonder or into the middle. How is this any more objectionable?


You are comparing -choosing- to discard a card to Wil's ability to take cards at RANDOM. Cards that players have most likely spent an age or two planning all of their card selections around.

Burying a science card so a player can't have it when you pass your hand to him isn't even close to the same thing as playing a single card that undoes multiple turn's worth of actions.

Feel free to use whatever rules you like, but I would hope anyone who understands drafting or the strategy behind 7 Wonders would see the problem there.

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Christopher Scatliff
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RhodesN7 wrote:
Feel free to use whatever rules you like, but I would hope anyone who understands drafting or the strategy behind 7 Wonders would see the problem there.


I see the problem that people who need the game to be deterministic would have with it. I just assumed that was a minority and that some people prefer a little chaos and unpredictability in their games. I concede that I may be in the minority here.

I like 7 Wonders to be sure, but the one thing that it could use is a little more drama.
 
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Christopher Boat
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Smoo wrote:
[q="RhodesN7"]the one thing that it could use is a little more drama.


Outside of traitor games, I'd almost never expect to hear that statement...

I will say, however, I like the table-wide effects that the new 7 Wonders Babel expansion seems to add. That might be a kind of "drama" we could both get behind. It sounds infinitely more balanced, at least.

 
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