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Subject: Borg Tractor Beam and Cutting Beam - Thoughts? rss

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Michael S
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I was wondering what everyones thoughts were on using the Tractor Beam and Cutting Beam cards. Would you rather use target lock as your action, throw 6 dice (7 with a generic flagship card) and be able to re roll OR spend an action for the tractor beam and roll 4 (or 3 with flagship) more dice. I think for now it COULD make sense since there is so few Borg upgrades available but as more Borg ships come out I dont see people wasting the 15 points to put both these on. Unless multiple cards start to require tractor beam (which would be awesome)

What does everyone think would you rather roll ten and not be able to re-roll or roll 6 and have re-rolls?

Is it possible to get a tractor beam AND have re-rolls?

Am I missing things?


:edit: spelling stuff
 
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Will Sanchez
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Tractor beam is a great upgrade. It instantly removes cloak and disables two shields (almost as good as two free hits).

Cutting beam is situational.
Normally your main weapon gets 7 dice because of range.

If you have flagship, you're probably attacking with 8 dice (+1 Flag, +1 Range). At this point I think Cutting Beam is unnecessary.

with cutting beam, you're spending 8 points for 10 dice. 3 extra attack for 8 points isn't a bad deal.

Basically your question is
10 dice + 2 damage
vs
7 dice + reroll

Rerolls are normally a moot point because you're either using Tac Drone (which gives can give a reroll as a continuous effect), or something that gives battlestations. If you go up against cloak though, you can't target lock to begin with.
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Michael S
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delta_angelfire wrote:
Tractor beam is a great upgrade. It instantly removes cloak and disables two shields (almost as good as two free hits).

Cutting beam is situational.
Normally your main weapon gets 7 dice because of range.

If you have flagship, you're probably attacking with 8 dice (+1 Flag, +1 Range). At this point I think Cutting Beam is unnecessary.

with cutting beam, you're spending 8 points for 10 dice. 3 extra attack for 8 points isn't a bad deal.

Basically your question is
10 dice + 2 damage
vs
7 dice + reroll

Rerolls are normally a moot point because you're either using Tac Drone (which gives can give a reroll as a continuous effect), or something that gives battlestations. If you go up against cloak though, you can't target lock to begin with.



Ahhhh! Yes the removing cloak and shields is a great point, I did not have the card in front of me when writing this and forgot that and the re-rolls from the drone (which have saved me many times)
 
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Jason Jackowski
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If you use the Tractor Beam against a cloaked ship, you might as well use the Cutting Beam. Your primary weapon won't have a re-roll since you used that action on the Tractor Beam. It can be good.
 
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Daniel van de Laar
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Here is the thing:

Cloaked ships have no shields, and they get no distance dice at range one. For the cost of a tractor beam and a cutting beam (7 + 8 = 15 SP), you could buy an independent flagship for only 10 SP, and get +1 shields, +1 agility, and +1 Attack (plus BattleStations!). Now instead of 10 dice you get 8, but you have some agility, and more shields - plus you still have an extra 5 SP to play. I be just as happy rolling 8 (re-rolled) dice using BS, than rolling 10 dice without BS, - even if he doesn't get his cloaking bonus (seriously - it's only four dice - I am counting on seven or eight hits against one or two evades - which more often than not is going to be just as deadly as the convoluted tractor-beam/cutting beam combo.

Seriously - that extra shield, agility point, and an attack dice plus the BattleStations token more than make up for the once in a while range one volley.

Just saying. I think it is not a very economical way to spend squad points.
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Penguin Bonaparte
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It could potentially be devastating, but I think it also increases the amount people are going to try to avoid range 1 at all costs, so I'd opt for more consistent and reliable dice modification.
 
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Noah Sager
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I found the two upgrades almost worthless.

They only work IF you are at range 1 during your action phase AND your opponent is STILL at range 1 after their movement.

After trying to use this in several games, I could never get it to work. I'd tractor them, but their movement would remove the beam token. And it was hard to follow them because the Borg move differently.

I might try it again with a higher-skill captain. Maybe Picard.

But I got much better use out of independent flagship, feedback pulse, and ablative armor. Rolling 7-8 dice with drone (or target lock) reroll is actually good enough.
 
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Trueflight Silverwing
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Tractor beam can be useful, but as others have said, the cutting beam is overrated. I think people see that 10 attack and just want to use it, but the restrictions on it make it very difficult to use. As others suggested, close range with a flagship that gives battlestations is a much more reliable attack. * dice with BS vs 10 dice with nothing, I will take the 8 every time.
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Will Sanchez
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Danvan wrote:

Just saying. I think it is not a very economical way to spend squad points.


The problem is you're comparing apples to oranges. All resources have a higher SP efficiency than regular game cards, that's why they are limited. What if he wanted to use federation fighters instead? or the Reinforcement Sideboard?
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Daniel van de Laar
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delta_angelfire wrote:
Danvan wrote:

Just saying. I think it is not a very economical way to spend squad points.


The problem is you're comparing apples to oranges. All resources have a higher SP efficiency than regular game cards, that's why they are limited. What if he wanted to use federation fighters instead? or the Reinforcement Sideboard?


Yeah, I won't deny that. I am saying why pay for these oranges that you can only eat some times, when you can buy apples that you can eat any time, and they cost less. It's an economy thing.

I am not saying the flagship cards is better, since that argument makes itself and doesn't need me to do anything other than let it out of its cage, what I am saying is that when I have had the choice between spending 15 points on a convolution of two cards, that must work together (after acquiring a target lock in a previous round) it hasn't been worth the cost, since for less squad points, I can buy a resource that I can use throughout the combat - and one that will guarantee me one shield, a few evades, and several more hits by way of the extra attack and Battle Stations.

Yeah, it is an apple, but I didn't know that this was an orange only question...

DANVAN
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Raymond Albright
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With the ability to use the tactical drone to reroll those 10 dice it is an excellent combination

yes it is a positioning challenge to pull off, but so are several extremely destructive effects (Energy dissipation, PSF, Barrage of fire) it requires a commitment to implementing it's use but the combo is good.

Value wise? yeah it is worth it, but whether you should use it depends on what you want to accomplish with the rest of your build
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Keoki Young
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RequiemX wrote:
I found the two upgrades almost worthless.

They only work IF you are at range 1 during your action phase AND your opponent is STILL at range 1 after their movement.


I wouldn't say worthless. If I understand correctly, there's nothing in the rules that says the two shields disabled by the tractor beam come back when the target ship breaks free. This doesn't happen until the end phase. So if it does break free, the Borg have still shut down two of its shields prior to attacking. Likewise, if the target had been cloaked, its cloak is now gone and shields are still down. Not bad for an action. Whether it's worth the points is another discussion.
 
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Andrew Lepperd
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Tractor beam, yes, cutting beam, maybe.

A combo that will make theme-peeps cry is to throw the Bioship Alpha pilot on the sphere so after you establish the beam you can almost guarantee they can't break off the leash.
 
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robin bruce
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Sorry for my ignorance, but where are you getting that a tractor beam reduces shields and gets rid of cloak. I don't see it in the rule book and the tractor beam cards do not state that they do that.
 
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Stephen Thorpe
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rexydon wrote:
Sorry for my ignorance, but where are you getting that a tractor beam reduces shields and gets rid of cloak. I don't see it in the rule book and the tractor beam cards do not state that they do that.


There's a Borg Tractor Beam reference cad similar to the ones for Energy Dissipators and Muon Tokens that wasn't shown in the preview.

Basically the rules are:

1) The ship targeted must disable 2 shields or if cloaked drop cloak and raise all but 2 of it's shields.

2) While it has the Tractor Beam token it can't raise it's shields or cloak.

3) During the planning phase it mat not choose a maneuver greater than 2.

4) At the end of the activation phase if no longer in range one of the ship with the matching token remove the tokens from both ships.
 
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robin bruce
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Okay sweet thanks. I've already order the sip just haven't gotten it in yet
 
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Justin Gould
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For my single Sphere build I use Picard and the Dominion/Independent flagship. Picard for Battle Stations token, Independent flagship for the free target Lock, Leaving the ship free to use Borg Tractor Beam. I use Energy Dissipator as my attack and Cutting Beam as my second attack. Between BS token and TL re-roll, I had 4 crits and 6 hits against a ship potentially rolling 1 evade dice. Opponent didn't even bother b/c his ship would still be destroyed even if he rolled an evade. Boheeka helped in getting Energy Dissipator to hit.
 
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