Josh
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https://shine.yahoo.com/healthy-living/princeton-student-s-e...

No great debate here, just another example of insulated young adult logic in action. I see it a lot, so it just amuses me now.

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Boaty McBoatface
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Is there a touch of irony around the idea that as a Jew (a race historically persecuted (even in America)) he is benefiting from "white privilege"?

Is it not also an irony in the fact that the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952 actually has Jewish immigration quotas (indeed even universities had such quotas (as they also did not blacks and women)).
 
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Shadrach wrote:
https://shine.yahoo.com/healthy-living/princeton-student-s-e...

No great debate here, just another example of insulated young adult logic in action. I see it a lot, so it just amuses me now.



His motivation for the essay: People ignore what I say based purely on who I am and not on the content of it.

Your post: I'm going to ignore what he says based purely on who he is and not on the content of it.

Yeah, you sure showed that guy.
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Josh
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The Message wrote:
Shadrach wrote:
https://shine.yahoo.com/healthy-living/princeton-student-s-e...

No great debate here, just another example of insulated young adult logic in action. I see it a lot, so it just amuses me now.



His motivation for the essay: People ignore what I say based purely on who I am and not on the content of it.

Your post: I'm going to ignore what he says based purely on who he is and not on the content of it.

Yeah, you sure showed that guy.


His mistake in the essay:mistaking contextualization for dismissal and a lack of societal thinking.

My reaction:contextualizing his essay and ascribing it to youthful insulation rather than overt denial based on a social agenda.

Thank you for being example #2

'check your priveledge' is just that, a self check. It is a challenge to try and step outside yourself and try to put things into context. You can weigh and examine factors, and recognize invisable hand ups and out downs. As a lower middle class white male my skin tone and gender might have helped me into college. Being able to be part of a well run and equipped Boy Scout troop was a part of that. Earning Eagle I did on my own, but I had to have the chance. College tuition was more affordable than for some due to family background, but My white maleness definitely hurt scholorship and loan opportunities. This is just a 2 second eval, there's a lot that goes into us being who and where we are. It is worth examining, especially when making blanket holier than thou pronouncements in publication like this guy.
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Paul W
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It's a nice idea, but in practice I find most people use the phrase "check your privilege" in a pretty aggressive way as a sort of insult or dismissal.It's too bad, because I think that stopping to reflect on the advantages one has had in life is a worthwhile thing, but that idea of privilege is extremely counterproductive when used as a rhetorical bludgeon.
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fizzmore wrote:
It's a nice idea, but in practice I find most people use the phrase "check your privilege" in a pretty aggressive way as a sort of insult or dismissal.It's too bad, because I think that stopping to reflect on the advantages one has had in life is a worthwhile thing, but that idea of privilege is extremely counterproductive when used as a rhetorical bludgeon.


I can agree it is misused,but I put it on the shoulders of the reciever for being lazy. If someone says that to me I will gladly open up a long discussion there and then about my personal pros and cons for them. Someone looking to shut me down will find their bkuff called and have to deal with it. Who knows, they, I, and anyone listening might learn something. Make the effort.
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Richard Hefferan
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Shadrach wrote:
fizzmore wrote:
It's a nice idea, but in practice I find most people use the phrase "check your privilege" in a pretty aggressive way as a sort of insult or dismissal.It's too bad, because I think that stopping to reflect on the advantages one has had in life is a worthwhile thing, but that idea of privilege is extremely counterproductive when used as a rhetorical bludgeon.


I can agree it is misused,but I put it on the shoulders of the reciever for being lazy. If someone says that to me I will gladly open up a long discussion there and then about my personal pros and cons for them. Someone looking to shut me down will find their bkuff called and have to deal with it. Who knows, they, I, and anyone listening might learn something. Make the effort.


"The people I insult are just being lazy instead of honoring me for my arrogant assumptions about their situation."

Yeah, that sounds about right for a typical liberal mentality. And you guys have the chutzpah to act bewildered as to why people don't like you. shake
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Shushnik wrote:


Yeah, that sounds about right for a typical liberal mentality. And you guys have the chutzpah to act bewildered as to why people don't like you. shake


Every opinion is either shared by you or it is a liberal opinion. Have you got the chutzpah to act bewildered as to why people find you are stupid?

This line of thought is so tired - and tiring. If you wish to go on with that, please try to do it with some panache - try to make it fun at least.
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Now can we have Tripp back please?
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HavocIsHere wrote:
Shushnik wrote:


Yeah, that sounds about right for a typical liberal mentality. And you guys have the chutzpah to act bewildered as to why people don't like you. shake


Every opinion is either shared by you or it is a liberal opinion. Have you got the chutzpah to act bewildered as to why people find you are stupid?

This line of thought is so tired - and tiring. If you wish to go on with that, please try to do it with some panache - try to make it fun at least.


Shockingly, my aim is not to be a clown for you. There's obviously something wrong with me. Just ask Josh. He's an expert at dismissing those that think differently. I must be lazy.
 
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I love the responses in the article. They all boil down to a general assumption that since this student has a different opinion, he must not understand. If he'd have simply been educated, he'd agree with them.

Here's a tip, treating people like they're stupid for having a different set of experiences and/or opinion isn't winning any arguments or friends. You just come off as an arrogant, and ironically ignorant, douchebag.
 
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Shushnik wrote:


Shockingly, my aim is not to be a clown for you. There's obviously something wrong with me. Just ask Josh. He's an expert at dismissing those that think differently.
See? You are not bad at it.

And I think Josh and I think rather differently. I don't remember him calling me a republican. Even in this forum that is a no go anyway.
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I'm still not sure how I ended up being a liberal. I've never thought of myself as one. I mean I don't believe that people should drink beer while shooting guns wildly at anything in a Turban or with a shade of skin darker than paper, so I suppose that makes me one these days, but aside from that, I dunno.

As for the Kid. He's clueless or an arrogant asshole. I'm just being generous and figuring clueless
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Alaren wrote:
Shadrach wrote:
He's clueless or an arrogant asshole. I'm just being generous and figuring clueless


No, you're just being clueless.


That's as pointless as it is vague.
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I actually liked the essay, but it carries an implicit assumption that everyone who made it has done so due to hard work. In his case, however, as he highlights with his sentimental family story, that hard work was actually done by his father and grandparents, and while it is certainly a popular idea that one deserves to reap the fruits of one's family, that is really all that the idea of privilege is about, i.e. if his father had been put in jail for carrying around some weed, his son would probably not be in the position that he is today, writing an essay while attending Princeton. If the prisoner's son is supposed to suffer from his father's misdeeds, then it shouldn't be so hard to acknowledge that the whole deal also works in reverse, in a positive sense.

But I wouldn't deny that he was targeted by claims of "check your privilege" in a disparaging manner; arrogance is probably a regular occurrence at an elite college. I just think it's a fallacy to reject the whole concept due to a few snide loud-mouths carrying its banners.
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Simon Mueller wrote:
.

But I wouldn't deny that he was targeted by claims of "check your privilege" in a disparaging manner; arrogance is probably a regular occurrence at an elite college. I just think it's a fallacy to reject the whole concept due to a few snide loud-mouths carrying its banners.


Sure but it's getting more and more one of the favourite buzzword of the PC crowd. And you know we antisionists can't stand the PC crowd even though they love the poor Palestinian children and wear Palestinian scarves atop their Che t shirts. Do we need a smiley here?
 
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HavocIsHere wrote:
Sure but it's getting more and more one of the favourite buzzword of the PC crowd. And you know we antisionists can't stand the PC crowd even though they love the poor Palestinian children and wear Palestinian scarves atop their Che t shirts. Do we need a smiley here?

This type of anti-Zionists?

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“I do condemn them for diminishing everything I have personally accomplished, all the hard work I have done in my life, and for ascribing all the fruit I reap not to the seeds I sow but to some invisible patron saint of white maleness who places it out for me before I even arrive.”

Ah, the infamous "them". Those basstirds are at it again.

I'll admit I'm not an Ivy Leaguer but this young feller's quote has the grassy fragrance of a straw man.

On the other hand, a couple of the people who replied to him just need to get ninja-punched for this:

“Recognizing the fact that white men benefit from the kinds of racist and sexist structures on which American society is built isn’t meant to diminish his accomplishments. It’s meant to remind us that white men don’t have an inherent predilection for success — the odds have just been stacked in their favor.”
 
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As with most things, it seems to me that the concept of privilege can be used or misused. There's certainly some good in attempting to see other people's perspectives. However, it's important to keep in mind that doing so is only useful so far as it helps you to see the truth- and when you get down to it, everyone, regardless of life situation, is at least theoretically able to do that if they want to.

Personally, I think the word "privilege" has been thrown around to the point where it's no longer very useful in this regard. And in any case, I think the concept is often misleading- because when you get down to it, there's no such thing as privilege. There's blessings which God by his grace gives everybody which everyone has an obligation to use to serve God and to serve others. Checking your privilege is checking the wrong thing; we ought rather to be checking if we're being obedient to the commands of God with the blessings which he has given us. And that's something all people can do, no matter where they are.
 
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twomillionbucks wrote:
As with most things, it seems to me that the concept of privilege can be used or misused. There's certainly some good in attempting to see other people's perspectives. However, it's important to keep in mind that doing so is only useful so far as it helps you to see the truth- and when you get down to it, everyone, regardless of life situation, is at least theoretically able to do that if they want to.

Personally, I think the word "privilege" has been thrown around to the point where it's no longer very useful in this regard. And in any case, I think the concept is often misleading- because when you get down to it, there's no such thing as privilege. There's blessings which God by his grace gives everybody which everyone has an obligation to use to serve God and to serve others. Checking your privilege is checking the wrong thing; we ought rather to be checking if we're being obedient to the commands of God with the blessings which he has given us. And that's something all people can do, no matter where they are.


Leaving aside the religious stuff, which is obviously your view but not shared by everyone, "privilege" boils down essentially to thinking that something isn't a problem because it's not a problem for you. That's all. "Check your privilege" just means that before you dismiss someone else's concerns or complaints about a situation, think about whether the situation might affect them differently from how it affects you. I.e., try to understand why they might have those concerns or complaints. You may still disagree, but it will at least be a thoughtful disagreement.
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Born To Lose, Live To Win
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GLB_Lurchy wrote:

On the other hand, a couple of the people who replied to him just need to get ninja-punched for this:

“Recognizing the fact that white men benefit from the kinds of racist and sexist structures on which American society is built isn’t meant to diminish his accomplishments. It’s meant to remind us that white men don’t have an inherent predilection for success — the odds have just been stacked in their favor.”


I thought that was the best reply. People don't give a crap if he works hard. If he wants accolades he can call his mom. The point is, if someone on the short end of the stick (blacks or women) work just as hard they don't have the same or as many opportunities to succeed. Yes, he has to run hard to win the race, but he can't ignore that he got a head start by being who he is.

Yes, "check your privilege" has become a short-hand that is abused, but the actual sentiment isn't new. People from opportunity-challenged demographics have dismissed opportunity-rich people from discussions about things that affect them for a long, long time. For example, "I'ts a black thing, you wouldn't understand" is the same dismissal that doesn't help any dialogs, but it is understandable when somebody like this student is so wrapped up in their so-called "challenges" that they think they are actually comparable to young black man growing up in an urban setting. Heck, 80% of RSP is people dismissing each other for Ad Hominem reasons. But that's all the kid needs to say, he doesn't need to write a big long pat-myself-on-the-back piece to say people are illogical when they argue. If they didn't dismiss him for his privilege, they'd dismiss him for some other irrational reason (like dressing like a hobo for his article photo shoot). Instead of going down the rabbit hole with no exit of defending against ad hominems, he should just stick to his guns that inspired them. He lost the argument when he engaged the irrational. You would think someone from an Ivy League school would know some of the basics of debate.
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Professor of Pain
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Is the "check your privilege" a regional thing? I'm a sociology professor who teaches race from a critical perspective, including white privilege, and I had to google the phrase "check you privilege". It's not really a term that comes up much in the context of courses on race around here. I'm not a scholar of race so maybe I'm not fully plugged in, but it strikes me as more of a colloquialism or perhaps an anti-racist activist phrase.
 
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Born To Lose, Live To Win
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Elfbane wrote:
Is the "check your privilege" a regional thing? I'm a sociology professor who teaches race from a critical perspective, including white privilege, and I had to google the phrase "check you privilege". It's not really a term that comes up much in the context of courses on race around here. I'm not a scholar of race so maybe I'm not fully plugged in, but it strikes me as more of a colloquialism or perhaps an anti-racist activist phrase.


To be honest, I think it's an internet forums/chat/comment-section thing. I've never heard it said in real life.
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TheChin! wrote:
Elfbane wrote:
Is the "check your privilege" a regional thing? I'm a sociology professor who teaches race from a critical perspective, including white privilege, and I had to google the phrase "check you privilege". It's not really a term that comes up much in the context of courses on race around here. I'm not a scholar of race so maybe I'm not fully plugged in, but it strikes me as more of a colloquialism or perhaps an anti-racist activist phrase.


To be honest, I think it's an internet forums/chat/comment-section thing. I've never heard it said in real life.


That's plausible. Anyone who told me to "check your privilege" would probably get punched in the face. People try to avoid that, in person.
 
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I personally can't wait to hear more about privilege from an Ivy League freshman whose well-meant but moderately dimwitted and entirely-missing-the-point essay somehow got published by Time.
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