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Tuscany: Expand the World of Viticulture» Forums » General

Subject: Confused about visitor cards rss

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Gabriele Pezzato
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Hi everyone, I'm a bit confused about the various types of visitor cards included in Tuscany and Viticulture and how to mix and match them. There are regular visitors, corrected visitors, promo visitors, advanced visitors and new visitors.

The rules about the advanced visitors list 2 possible ways of including them: either adding them to the deck of the regular visitor cards, or replacing some of the old cards. I read that the aim of the advanced visitors is fixing some problems of the original cards (which sometimes can be useless and sometimes too powerful), but if you simply add them to the original deck, don't you create even more imbalance?

Are the 4 promo cards of the 1st edition included with the new visitors?
 
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J. M. Lopez-Cepero "CP"
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Hi Gabriele,

The promo visitors are the 1st edition promo cards (technically part of Arboriculture). You can add them from the get go, even if not using any of the Tuscany expansions. Similarly, if you have a 1st edition Viticulture you should swap the corrected visitors for their Tuscany versions. That leaves you with a "base" visitors deck (including the promos and the updated versions) to use with Viticulture.

Then, there are two sets of visitors corresponding to Tuscany expansions: new visitors and advanced visitors. The new visitors get added to the deck, and, as you say, you can add the advanced visitors or swap them.

Regarding the problems of the original cards, the problem of some of them being objectively too powerful is fixed by the corrected visitors. What can still happen with them is that they are very situational - they can be very good at the beginning of the game but useless at the end, or the other way around. The advanced/new visitors have a similar power level, but fix this by having two actions available in the same card, one useful at the beginning of the game and other at the end. So adding them to the deck diminishes that imbalance (as it's more likely that you'll draw something useful), and replacing the non-advanced versions diminishes it even further.

Cheers


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Gabriele Pezzato
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So, do you recommend swapping advanced visitor cards with the corresponding normal visitors or do you think simply adding them will do?
Because I think that if a player is dealt a normal visitor and another one the corresponding advanced version, this wouldn't be fair...
 
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J. M. Lopez-Cepero "CP"
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GabrielGeek wrote:
So, do you recommend swapping advanced visitor cards with the corresponding normal visitors or do you think simply adding them will do?
Because I think that if a player is dealt a normal visitor and another one the corresponding advanced version, this wouldn't be fair...


I would add them first, then take the normal versions out later, so that you can experience both options. Once that's done I'd probably play just with the advanced visitors.

That said, you draw a lot of visitor cards during the game, so it will all even out. Don't sweat it.
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Jamey Stegmaier
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I've playtested it both ways, and although I was never particularly annoyed by the original visitor cards (they're cards--they're a random element), I found that they actually mix really well with the advanced visitors. As andvaranaut mentioned, you can always remove them later (there are plenty of them), and the rules tell you which cards to leave in the game, but I honestly think you'll prefer to have a giant stack of visitor cards instead of a smaller stack. It's more satisfying that way.
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Ender Wiggins
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jameystegmaier wrote:
I've playtested it both ways, and although I was never particularly annoyed by the original visitor cards (they're cards--they're a random element), I found that they actually mix really well with the advanced visitors. As andvaranaut mentioned, you can always remove them later (there are plenty of them), and the rules tell you which cards to leave in the game, but I honestly think you'll prefer to have a giant stack of visitor cards instead of a smaller stack. It's more satisfying that way.

Is this still the advice you'd give Jamey?

According to this post, the visitor deck in the Essential Edition basically consists of the standard Viticulture visitors + advanced/new Tuscany visitors, but the standard visitors that have corresponding advanced ones were removed.

Is that the optimal visitor deck to use, or would you still advise including all the standard visitors, even those that have corresponding advanced ones?
 
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I'd just pick the cards you like best, in the combination you want. For example, after a conversation here a couple of days ago, I switched the Advanced Queen for the regular one.
 
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Jamey Stegmaier
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I think the best version of Viticulture uses only the visitor cards in Viticulture Essential (the equivalents of which are found in Tuscany and the second edition) and the cards in the Moor Visitors Expansion.

However, I think the game is fine if you use all visitor cards--as I noted, it's nice to have a giant stack of visitor cards.
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