Michael Collarin
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Charlotte
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A fellow local gamer had inquired in our Facebook group whether he would be able to play this without the main game Panzer. My initial reaction was no, it's an expansion, it would require the main game. Seemed pretty cut and dry, right?

Then I looked at the GMT site.

Panzer: Game Expansion Set, Nr3 Drive to the Rhine The 2nd Front wrote:
Ownership of Expansions 1 & 2 is not required to field the German forces, they are all included here. However, this expands on those German units included in the first two expansions, no unit IDs are duplicated. Combine the German units from all three expansions to create customized scenarios on either the Western or Eastern Front.


Okay, I could see if he glanced quickly at only the bold (my emphasis), he might think, if it has the Germans and obviously the new Allied forces, why would I need the main game?

My guess would be generic counters/markers. And maybe some combat tables.

However, if that's the only distinction (not saying it is as I don't know what's not included here vs the main game), then why not include those and offer this as a stand-alone game?

If you look at the price on the GMT site, the main game's retail price is $80. This one is $75. That's a big price tag for an "expansion" when compared to the base game. (Yes, you are getting a lot here). But that parenthetical comment is also part of the confusion, if all they need to do is add some generic markers and charge an extra $5 (if only it were that simple) they could satisfy the market for those wanting to add to their base game AND bring in new players not interested in the Eastern Front.

I suppose in a way it's similar to Combat Commander: Mediterranean and Combat Commander: Europe. The former being the expansion, requiring the latter to play and actually costs MORE than the base game.

Back to the game at hand...

The obvious argument that would arise by the folks that already have Panzer is that they don't want to pay the extra $5, $10, whatever it may be to get an expansion and duplicate status markers. I can appreciate that perspective as well.

Perhaps the best folks could hope for is that GMT would offer a p500 for an "upgrade" kit to make this one a complete game in lieu of having to buy the complete Panzer game which covers a theater that does not interest them...

Hey if it meets p500, it means there was obviously a market for it, right? It would likely cut into sales of Panzer as well, so I guess that would have to be factored in... we shall see.

In any case, it would be interesting to hear from the powers that be to see if there's any possibility here for an "upgrade" kit, if this was ever considered to be stand-alone (or would require too much additional content), or if it's just a bad business decision in general to even consider anything but the way it's been done.
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Art Bugorski
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My guess is that if they had included everything it would have been much more $ so they'd have to cut down to avoid pricing themselves out of a market.

IMHO, more companies should do what Dominion with Dominion: Base Cards where you can pick up the base and every other expansion is now playable. So a $40 Panzer core and then lets say $55 expansions or whatever the numbers work out to be. It would prevent the case where you are only really interested in one of the expansion theatres and not the base.

Also if you "core" had a few learning/training scenarios that'd lessen the "risk" when trying a new system.
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Jim Day
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Art is correct. If all of the necessary items from the base game were included, e.g., charts and counters, the price would be much more. Note that while you don't need Expansions 1 & 2 for their German units, one still needs the German units from the base game.
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