Adam
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Sorry, posting this with my phone and could not seem to find an answer.

So I rolled a double burst Force Beam which says "deal 1 Damage to each player and 2 damage to each character"

I have the Hulk Jade Giant which says "While Hulk is active, when either you or the Hulk takes damage, knock out one of your opponent's level 1 characters"

The way I read this is:
-I take a damage from force beam, Hulk KO's a level 1
-Hulk takes 2 damage from force beam, Hulk KO's another level 1

Is this correct? My thought basis is loosely based on the example in the rule book on page 16 where they walk trough an example of a level 1 Force Beam hitting the Hulk Jade Giant and Iron Man Playboy. Hulk triggers first, then Iron Man triggers doing damage to the Hulk, who then triggers again.

Thoughts? I want to make sure I am not double dipping illegally.
 
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Soren Hedberg
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It doesn't say "The first time either you or Hulk takes damage", so I believe you are correct. Each time either of you takes damage, you knock out a level 1 character.
 
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Erik Smith
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Each different source for the damage counts as damage being dealt once. So force beam would only trigger Hulk once.
 
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Mike Beiter
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You are correct. He triggers twice.
 
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Henry Ho
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I think Hulk would only trigger once.
 
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Brandon M
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I am no authority, but this is how I read it.

1) There is no limit on the Jade Giant ability (eg "the first time")

2) There are two separate triggers: (1) Hulk takes damage & (2) controlling player takes damage

3) The requirement for trigger (1) is met by the play of Force Beam.

4) At the same time, the requirement for trigger (2) is met at the same time by Force Beam

That is two instances of the ability being triggered: 1x(1) and 1x(2).

IMO, Hulk gets to KO two level 1s.

If you pull the trigger of a gun twice, it doesn't shoot one bullet.

 
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Adam
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Seems like the community is split on this one...
 
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Hector Lopez
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I'm with the camp that it should activate twice but I would just like some official confirmation. Any ETA on the FAQ yet?
 
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Adam
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Not that I know of. I sent a PM to
Eric Lang
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to see if he could chime in on the subject. I see this happening a lot with my deck so I could use an official response.
 
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I'm going with twice, but seeing all that damage occurs a part of a single source & damage is simultaneous...it definitely is a tough one.

Seems like this game will need a stack order just like MTG, joy of joys
 
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Tim Ford
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With triggering conditions I usually assume if there's a limit to the trigger it will be explicit on the card - once per turn, first time each turn, whatever restriction they want to put on it.

I don't see why the damage being done simultaneously would change it. I mean, if I am attacked by 2 characters, one I block with the Hulk and the other is allowed through, does it trigger for both? Damage is still just as simultaneous as using the action; the only difference is multiple sources dealing it. If we treat these situations differently we are adding in a conditional rule that isn't mentioned anywhere (only one trigger per source of damage)

I was damaged and Hulk was damaged. Hulk smashes 2 things.
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Adam
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deathhq wrote:
With triggering conditions I usually assume if there's a limit to the trigger it will be explicit on the card - once per turn, first time each turn, whatever restriction they want to put on it.

I don't see why the damage being done simultaneously would change it. I mean, if I am attacked by 2 characters, one I block with the Hulk and the other is allowed through, does it trigger for both? Damage is still just as simultaneous as using the action; the only difference is multiple sources dealing it. If we treat these situations differently we are adding in a conditional rule that isn't mentioned anywhere (only one trigger per source of damage)

I was damaged and Hulk was damaged. Hulk smashes 2 things.

Well said. I agree.
 
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Big Rob
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Interesting....

Is there a difference between this:
"While Hulk is active, when either you or the Hulk takes damage, knock out one of your opponent's level 1 characters"

and this:
"While Hulk is active, when you or the Hulk takes damage, knock out one of your opponent's level 1 characters"

?

does "either" being included or removed change anything?

 
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Tim Ford
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Either A/B can be used inclusively or exclusively depending on how you want it to work. If it's "choose either a or b" it's usually exclusive (you can't pick both a and b) but if its "when either a or b is true" it usually is open to the possibility of both being true.

My guess is they want it to work inclusively - A or B or A+B - because if the intent was "I take damage" or "Hulk takes damage" but not "Both of us take damage", neither my example of blocking nor the ** version of Force Beam would trigger Hulk at all. Hulk would get damaged, I'd get damaged but since both sets of damage happen simultaneously Hulk would smash nobody.

I don't think that's what they intended for the ability. Probably another thing they'll need to clarify in the FAQ whenever it gets released.
 
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Adam
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Abysmul wrote:
Interesting....

Is there a difference between this:
"While Hulk is active, when either you or the Hulk takes damage, knock out one of your opponent's level 1 characters"

and this:
"While Hulk is active, when you or the Hulk takes damage, knock out one of your opponent's level 1 characters"

?

does "either" being included or removed change anything?


Being a long time magic player (but not a pro mind you), the word either is crucial.

Force Beam says "1 Damage to each player and 2 Damage to each character," Because this says and not then, Force Beam does its damage to players and characters at the same time.

The difficult part is Hulk's ability. The Hulk Jade Giant says "While Hulk is active, when either you or the Hulk takes damage, knock out one of your opponent's level 1 characters." Well, there is no either, or then in the Force Beam 2 burst effect. It says and. In my head, both happened at the same time, but both are separate triggers.

d10-1 The Hulk received damage from Force Beam, triggering Hulk's ability.
d10-2 I received damage from Force Beam, triggering Hulk's ability.

His ability should go off twice because there are two separate triggers.
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Jake Fernandez
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Does it matter that the source of damage was just one card? Effectively there was only one triggering card. So you can argue that though that one card satisfied 2 triggers, it really was just once card and thus one trigger.

But admittedly if we apply occalm's razor, simplest explanation is that the word "either" means it triggers twice.
 
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chris ward
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I just checked a bunch of online dictionaries and they all defined "either-or" as strictly a choice between two conditions. I'd say that force beam should pretty clearly only trigger hulk once per use.

For some reason my tablet isn't copying text right now or I'd paste in some of the relevant quotes.

Of courses ruling from the designers could over-ride this, but the dictionary definition is quite specific.

Chris

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