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Subject: How to get out of the brig? rss

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Ecosmith Ecosmith
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Hiya!

I've got a 6P base game on Sat. BSG is my fave game, sadly my group doesnt often get a game due to length wtc. But Sat's looking good.

We've all played enough base game to get it by now, but some players have experienced the unfun 'brigged for half a game' experience. I was wondering if there's any sort of strategy for someone who's brigged to pursue to get out on their own. I was thinking that if more expert players could advise, I could give a little bit of general advice beforehand. Maybe there are better skill cards etc to go for, possibly people could aim to grab them and do a bit of hoarding or something in case they're brigged. At the very least it would provide some hope or guidance. Nobody likes being innocent and brigged lol. It's happened to me a few times!

Obviously, brigged culons can reveal, but humans dont have that option.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Eco
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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You generally won't get out unless there are a few other players that want to help you get out. The best thing to do is to convince the others that you are innocent.
Anyway, why are you getting thrown in the brig in the first place?
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It's specifically made so that brigged players are unlikely to get out without assistance.
Even Zarek lowering the difficulty to 5 each time her tries, still makes it quite hard to do with just 1 card. You have to rely on destiny being in your favour and players not sabotaging your attempt.

Keep an eye on what the destiny deck is likely to hold.
I'm on a PBF game at the moment where an ally has already failed to get out twice because of destiny being unlucky, but with only 4 cards left in the deck, i've worked out that it's likely to be 75% positive for a brig escape, for example.

Sometimes even if you cant persuade people to help, you can persuade them to at least not play in at all, if they have doubts about your loyalty. If you've worked out that destiny is likely to be positive, then you can sometimes get out on your own.

 
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Ernest Chua
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While being brigged for half a game (or more) may seem like fun for an individual, one has to always keep in mind that this is a (hidden) team game. Players in the brig whose team (cylon or human) win are still on the winning team - there are no levels of winning (at least not in the rules).

My following comments are situationally specific and may also depend on the nature of the players in your group - one group's 'that's fine, we understand why s/he is going that' is another groups 'what are you doing?!? Cylon!'

If playing as Boomer and the player knows s/he will be going to the brig at the sleeper phase, one idea I've seen suggested and sometimes used is to make sure one goes to the Press Office (Room?) to pick up a couple of yellows for a turn or two. Once brigged come sleeper phase, there will at least a positive colour to help and hopefull a decently high numbered one (compared to just trying it via the standard hand draw).

Normally, getting out of the brig (for any character) requires the help of others given that one can only play one card into a skill check from the brig. The people I play with tend to do this when some trust has been established (helping in skill checks, playing positive actions from cardm helping with die rolls etc.) This is not a definite method of gaining trust, but as a human in the brig, you want to help the humans as much as you can anyway. Naturally, helping from the brig is no certainty of someone's humanity (as getting let out and then revealing with the reveal power is always possible).

Additionally, having a human in the brig is long term bad for the humans. To win, humans need jump preps. In the base game, jump preps can only be gotten through crisis cards. You only get crisis cards when not in the brig. Long term, the lack of jump preps helps the cylons. There may be times where, especially if there are several people in the brig, one has to take a leap of faith and trust someone to be gotten out of the brig. This is especially true when there is at least one revealed cylon, as every turn a human spends in the brig is another turn closer to the revealed cylon/s having a turn of which to choose how to try damage/destroy humanity.

In this respect, it may come down to the players you play with and how you best persuade them that while you (or anyone) in the brig can't guarantee your humanity, the game sitaution (which will vary from game to game) means that there is a better chance of the humans winning with you out than in.

The game situation may also help tip things one way or another. For example, if many civilian ships are out, there have been several crisis cards putting out many cylon ships and a few bad activations may plunge population down (or even bring it to 0), it may be worth freeing the pilot/s to help protect the civilians.

Ultimately, if a player is in the brig, it is up to that player to try advance his/her team as best they can, whether by trying to get out (by convincing others through actions and/or persuation) or helping from the brig.

Expansions give other options to brigged humans.

I hope this has given you some things to think about
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Michael Aldridge
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A common misconception about the Brig is that you can't do ANYTHING in the Brig except try to get out. That's not true. Sure, you lack mobility and you're limited to one card during skill checks, but you can still do several things that can help the humans while you're in the Brig. Rather than constantly bang on the bars to try to get out, you can:

- contribute positively during skill checks, especially during Investigative Committees
- play Strategic Planning, Declare Emergency, and Calculations at appropriate times
- use your once-per-game and always-on abilities to the humans' advantage
- scout out obviously good Crises and/or Destinations
- play XOs, particularly on those who have shown that they're obviously human
- play helpful Quorum cards, if you're the President

You need to do enough of these things to convince enough people to help bust you out... or, at a minimum, you need to convince the President to play a Pardon on you.
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Kwijiboe
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Everyone here is right. It's hard to get out without some help.

However, I've found that players with engineering and at least a politics/tactics draw have the easiest time getting out by themselves. The reason is they can increase the odds that destiny will help with the brig check by playing Scientific Engineering and can put in 1 politics/tactics card towards the check. However, you have to play scientific engineering before anyone throws in to the skill check: a player may decide to put in a leadership/piloting card to keep you locked up.

For the most part, remind players that, if they're human they can still play skill cards to help their team. If you're a cylon, consider how much time you want to waste trying to escape: depending on the circumstances it may be time to reveal. If you're a Boomer Cylon you can still do a significant amount of damage in the brig. Remember your OPG and your Recon ability, you can even launch scouts while brigged.

The brig isn't the "time out" people perceive it to be. Make sure to stress that people: it's not over if you're brigged. You can still help/hurt a lot.
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If you're playing with daybreak then the mutiny card 'make a deal' can get you out of the brig.

There's also that 6 strength political prowess card from the Exodus expansion that you can use to automatically escape from the brig if you have it.

As a politician in the brig you could keep fishing until you get it, and keep consolidating power for more politics cards to increase your chances of getting it.

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Kwijiboe
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Another thing to note: it's especially hard to get out of the brig if the crew put you in there. If you got brigged because everyone knows for certain you're a cylon, don't waste your turns doing brig checks.

In Daybreak, the game throws people into the brig via multiple game effects. As a consequence, it's much easier to get the help to get out. As a Cylon, I've had humans help me get out of the brig because I opted to take a Mutiny card and go to the brig: when what I really wanted was a juicier Mutiny card.
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Alas, being brigged for extended times is sort of like being virtually eliminated in other games. As necessary as the Brig is, for some take on crippled turns, which is not fun, more so for newbies. It's akin to being a crippled cylon via the Cylon Sympathizer. All I can say is, try to enjoy it, as it is an authentic BSG experience

MasterDinadan wrote:
You generally won't get out unless there are a few other players that want to help you get out. The best thing to do is to convince the others that you are innocent.
Anyway, why are you getting thrown in the brig in the first place?


You do one thing that others misconstrue as being a cylon and you're now in. Not necessarily due to a skill check, but b/c of a crisis. There has been some wiggle room and varying thresholds when briggins occur. It can be quite different among 2 different trains of thoughts.

BosonMichael wrote:
A common misconception about the Brig is that you can't do ANYTHING in the Brig except try to get out. That's not true. Sure, you lack mobility and you're limited to one card during skill checks, but you can still do several things that can help the humans while you're in the Brig. Rather than constantly bang on the bars to try to get out, you can:

- contribute positively during skill checks, especially during Investigative Committees
- play Strategic Planning, Declare Emergency, and Calculations at appropriate times
- use your once-per-game and always-on abilities to the humans' advantage
- scout out obviously good Crises and/or Destinations
- play XOs, particularly on those who have shown that they're obviously human
- play helpful Quorum cards, if you're the President

You need to do enough of these things to convince enough people to help bust you out... or, at a minimum, you need to convince the President to play a Pardon on you.
I've only activated Brig when I didn't have anything else to do...
No XOs, no CP, no LS, and you can't use any of the reds nor blues while in the Brig on your turn.
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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If other people are expecting you to make certain choices or take certain cations, and don't communicate those expectations, then it is their failure.
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MasterDinadan wrote:
If other people are expecting you to make certain choices or take certain cations, and don't communicate those expectations, then it is their failure.
That still won't stop you from getting brigged even if you're right and they're wrong.
 
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Ecosmith Ecosmith
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BosonMichael wrote:
A common misconception about the Brig is that you can't do ANYTHING in the Brig except try to get out. That's not true. Sure, you lack mobility and you're limited to one card during skill checks, but you can still do several things that can help the humans while you're in the Brig. Rather than constantly bang on the bars to try to get out, you can:

- contribute positively during skill checks, especially during Investigative Committees
- play Strategic Planning, Declare Emergency, and Calculations at appropriate times
- use your once-per-game and always-on abilities to the humans' advantage
- scout out obviously good Crises and/or Destinations
- play XOs, particularly on those who have shown that they're obviously human
- play helpful Quorum cards, if you're the President

You need to do enough of these things to convince enough people to help bust you out... or, at a minimum, you need to convince the President to play a Pardon on you.


I'll print this out and hang it in the bsthroom aling with the 'Cylon? Wondering how best to reveal?' Hint sheet. Thsnks for all the great advice, folks!

Eco
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Ecosmith wrote:
...the 'Cylon? Wondering how best to reveal?' Hint sheet.


Can you post that, please?

And you can add to the 'stuff you can do from the brig' list:
Pilots can play things like evasives on unmanned vipers, and if you're playing with expansions then they can play 'combat veteran' from the brig as well.
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Adam Lucas
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In the base game the use of some of the character abilities (or in Roslin's case, lack of) should be enough to convince the other players that you are a human, but a lot of it comes down to why you were in the brig in the first place. If you get there from a Crisis then players (at least in my group) are really good about letting people out. If you got brigged for being suspicious then you're looking at an uphill battle. If you're Boomer and got brigged during the Sleeper Phase then hopefully you saved your OPG (my group likes to hold Boomer in the brig until she uses it).

If you're human then make yourself useful. There's a card in every colour that you can play from the brig to show that you are playing as a human, so you can usually spend a turn or two in the brig making your case before you try to escape. The useful cards are Investigative Committee, Executive Order, Launch Scout (on the Crisis deck. Most people will never know what you do to the Destination deck), Evasive Manouevers, and Scientific Research. For the others Consolidate Power is a tough sell to convince other's you are loyal, Strategic Planning is great if you can use it, and Maximum Firepower and Repair can't be used while brigged.

If you are in the brig and people suspect that you are a Cylon then cutting your losses and your wrists is probably the smart way to go. If your reveal power won't make much of a difference then don't worry about wasting it. When you are using the Cylon locations you can usually choose what you want to target, which is often better than -1 morale or sending some one to sick bay.
 
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Svengaard wrote:
If your reveal power won't make much of a difference then don't worry about wasting it. When you are using the Cylon locations you can usually choose what you want to target, which is often better than -1 morale or sending some one to sick bay.

The sickbay one is actually really good. Use it on the person just to the left of you so that they cant be XO'd before their turn.

They have to lose 5 cards, and then they only draw 1 card on their turn as well.

It leaves them crippled for a long long time, and they pretty much cant help in skill checks at all.

The -1 morale one is pretty good too. If you get it, then you should start targetting morale as much as you can. If the humans start to catch on that you're intentionally dropping morale at every opportunity, then if you can reveal before you get brigged you get to drop it by an extra point as well.




 
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Robert Stewart
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Until a Cylon reveals (hard or soft), it's actually beneficial to team Human to have someone in the Brig - particularly if they draw 2+ Leadership so can be counted on to have an XO most of the time - you skip one Crisis each time around the table, giving you more cards and actions to deal with the remainder. The only possible exceptions are Roslin and Baltar, who have moderately powerful abilities that require them to draw a Crisis, and possibly Boomer who can't usually XO.

There are also downsides to having humans in the Brig - it sets up for a more devastating soft reveal from a Cylon President, and it costs to get them out once a Cylon tips their hand.



Easiest human win I ever had was a 4-player game as President Roslin alongside Baltar, Adama and Boomer - Baltar used his Cylon Detector on Adama on his first turn, and accused Adama of being the lone Cylon, so Boomer and I just locked them both up to wait and see who revealed. For most of the rest of the game, both of them fed me XOs, letting me draw the entire Quorum Deck. Boomer got the Sympathiser card at Sleeper, and I briefly considered leaving her locked up so our one Crisis per round would be thoroughly Scouted, but Pardoned her instead. Adama eventually revealed and Baltar got released, but by then it was far too late for one Cylon to do any harm...

Reasons why this doesn't apply to more games:
- Adama really should have revealed as soon as he realised we were happy to let them both rot (and right to do so)
- With a second Cylon Loyalty in the game, there would have been mild pressure to keep things more balanced
- Even though you end up winning, the game is less fun when you spend most of it as a human in the Brig, waiting for your cell-mate to reveal.
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Richard Pickman
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"Brig politics" is a large part of this brilliant game. There are a lot of great suggestions in this thread, so I'll just say this:

Do your best to figure out "what a human would do," and do that for a few turns. Many cylon players don't have the patience to keep that act up, and would rather reveal. Of course, a very clever cylon might do it, but the strategy has a cost.

And above all, enjoy the ride.
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Dan
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I too am curious about the "how to best reveal" bit.
 
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skribs15 wrote:
I too am curious about the "how to best reveal" bit.


Practice makes perfect. Spot an opportunity... take it... see if it works. Eventually, you'll get good at it... really good. I've seen all of the following:

...killing 5 civilian ships in a nuclear blaze of glory
...brigging all three humans at once
...the Chief repairs the Airlock, then XOs someone... who then activates the Airlock on the Chief

Ah, yes, all wonderful reveals which will be talked about for years... robot
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BosonMichael wrote:
skribs15 wrote:
I too am curious about the "how to best reveal" bit.


Practice makes perfect. Spot an opportunity... take it... see if it works. Eventually, you'll get good at it... really good. I've seen all of the following:

...killing 5 civilian ships in a nuclear blaze of glory
...brigging all three humans at once
...the Chief repairs the Airlock, then XOs someone... who then activates the Airlock on the Chief

Ah, yes, all wonderful reveals which will be talked about for years... robot


Ohh, soft reveal, not hard reveal.
First and foremost, be careful about some of those reveals, as you need to line up a lot of ducks in a row before you can kill them off in one fell swoop. At any rate...

.

Well, with Chief, I'd repair the Airlock, and then activate it, and use Pol. Prowess to get a freebie execution. Nice thing about Chief is that he can do it all alone, whereas others would either need 2 actions, or 2 people working in tandem.


Speaking of Galen, Low Supplies 7YG, with Peg + Exo
-1 morale. If food is less than 6, -1 additional morale.
Food was 4, Morale was 5
Tory played IC. Well, I was 2nd in turn order to contribute skill cards, so they'd get to react to what I do. I ended up spiking heavily with purple into this that I got from CP and other means, and some Treachery. They'd lose 2 Morale since Food was also low enough to trigger the 2nd Morale loss. I also slipped in an Iron Will to potentially lose a 3rd Morale. Tory hit up Press Room A LOT, and Baltar, happened to have a largish hand.

Thanks to the IC coolrobot, I was able to see what the best color to "0 out" with Galen's OPG was, so I choose yellow. Yeah, DD didn't do much to help them, and they ended up with -11 or something like that.

So down to 2 Morale, but 2 full jump cycles left meeple
To my surprise, Apollo who helped Brig me after this stint ended up revealing with the -1 Morale reveal power.


With just Daybreak, one situation was pretty much "we need to jump. If you're human, you'll do FTL Control". I ended up playing Feed The People (Mutiny) to -2 the jump track from -3 to red2, which bought enough time for the cylon ships to do more damage.
 
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ackmondual wrote:
Ohh, soft reveal, not hard reveal.


Well, as you know, some hard reveals can be pretty brutal to the humans... but it doesn't take as much practice to "get them right". The good soft reveals are what take some practice.

Whether a soft reveal or a hard reveal, you have to get the humans to believe that you're on their side... not just by blindly accusing others... but by trying to show that you're the guy who helps out. Don't be TOO helpful... help do things that are pro-human, but perhaps aren't AS beneficial as they could be. Prevent a morale loss when morale is high... but oh, sorry, I can't help out on this food crisis, even though we've only got 3 left. Shoot down three Raiders that are about to attack a civilian ship (and pop is at 11)... but no, sorry, I don't have a Declare Emergency to help pass that crisis. If you see a really good opportunity to do some damage, you might even prepare for it by helping them a lot, just to "prove" your loyalty. Then SLAM the door on their hopes and dreams! Muahaha! MUAHAHAHAHAAA!!! devil

...hypothetically speaking, of course... whistle
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