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Romance of the Nine Empires» Forums » General

Subject: New Article - Arcane Fire! rss

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Sean Geraghty
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http://www.alderac.com/r9e/2014/05/12/arcane-fire/

Still no mention of release date.
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Sean Geraghty
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Dueling is back!

 
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Sean Geraghty
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And so are Djinns!

 
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Richard Linnell
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Can someone who understands talk a little more about the dueling? Is it like the L5R duels or something else? Do the cards come from hand or deck, or either?
 
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Sean Geraghty
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I haven't seen the rules from Arcane Fire yet, but here is how it worked in Legend of Burning Sands (the game upon which R9E is based):

LBS Rulebook wrote:
Challenges and Duels
Some cards permit one Hero to challenge another. When you play a card that creates a challenge, select an unbowed Hero
you control and a Hero controlled by another player. The other player can decide to refuse the challenge; if he does,
nothing happens. If the challenge is accepted, a duel ensues.

Once a challenge is thrown down, it is too late to use any actions (other than appropriate Reactions) to increase or
decrease a Hero's stats. Like any other action, the challenge must be completely resolved before any other actions can be
taken.

Once the challenge has been issued and accepted, a duel begins. This is the only point at which Reactions referring to a
Hero who "is entering a duel" can be produced.

Both players announce their Heroes' Ka values. A Hero's Ka is the value in the upper right corner of the card, plus any
effects in play, plus Ka bonuses added by any attached cards with "+X" bonuses. If a card becomes involved in a duel for
which it has no printed stat, it is considered to have a 0 in that stat.

Thrusting
The challenged Hero begins the duel by thrusting. To thrust, place a card from your hand face-down. You do not have to
thrust in a duel. If a player does not thrust, he passes and his opponent can thrust.

Parrying
When a thrust is played, the opposing player must parry by drawing and playing face-up the top card from his deck or
playing a card from his hand face-up. Parries played from your deck are Buried, unlike parries from your hand or thrusts,
which are Saved after use. Although you can parry from your deck, you cannot thrust from it.

Resolving a Round of Dueling
After the parry card is played, reveal the thrust card. Compare the Fate value of the parry card to that of the thrust card. If
the parry value is different than the thrust value, the Defender subtracts the difference from his Hero's Ka. (If the parry
value is greater than the thrust value, the Defender over-extended his defense). The loss of Ka lasts until the end of the
duel. If the parry value equals the thrust value, the defending Hero takes no damage.

After a parry card is played and both cards are discarded or Buried, the Defender now becomes the Attacker and can play
a thrust card or pass. The Attacker becomes the Defender, and so on. When a Hero is reduced to 0 Ka, that Hero loses the
duel.

If neither Hero has lost the duel by the time both players have consecutively passed their opportunity to play a thrust
card, compare the Heroes' Kas. The Hero with the higher Ka wins the duel. In the case of a tie, both Heroes suffer the
loser's fate. Unless otherwise noted on the card, the loser of a duel is destroyed and the winner is unaffected. Ka lost in a
duel is restored after duel resolution.

Example: Round 1

Rashat, with 4 Ka, challenges Nemet, with 3 Ka. Nemet begins the duel by playing a

2-Fate-value thrust card face-down. Rashat parries blindly from his deck and pulls a

2-Fate-value card. When Nemet reveals her card, Rashat takes no damage, but his parry card is Buried.

Rashat now plays his thrust card, with a Fate value of 3, face-down. Nemet defends by playing a 4-Fate-value parry card
from her hand. Because her parry card's Fate value is 1 greater than the thrust card, she loses 1 Ka.

Example: Round 2

Rashat now has 4 Ka, Nemet 2. Nemet plays a 5-Fate-value thrust card face-down. Rashat takes a gamble and parries with
the top card from his deck instead of using one from his hand. He pulls a 1-Fate-value card and takes 4 points of damage.
He loses and is destroyed because now has 0 Ka. The duel ends and Nemet's Ka returns to its usual value of 3.




Rulebook found here:
http://www.lackeyccg.com/lbs/LBSRules.pdf
 
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Richard Linnell
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Thanks! I like it - sounds a little bit more intriguing than the L5R system to me, although it is a little hard to build for - in L5R you just want high numbers. Here, it looks like 2 and 3 are best for parrying, but 1 and 4 (or higher, if they go higher) are going to be best for attacks.

Playing a parry against a random opponent, any card give you a 25% chance to block, but a 2 or 3 gives you a 50% chance of taking 1 damage and a 25% chance of taking 2 damage. This averages out to 1 point of expected damage. Playing a 1 or 4 gives 25% no damage, 25% 1 point, 25% 2 points, and 25% 3 points for an expected damage of 1.5.

Playing a thrust is slightly different, since the opponent may choose not to parry, the expected value of a 4 is going to be higher than that of a 1.

So my first thrust at tackling the system looks like the best parry to play is typically a 3 - which would then skew the value of 4 down and the value of 1 upwards. Eventually will turn into a Nash equilibrium, but don't want to bother doing that work right now.

Are there any ways to mitigate the "risks" of dueling? I suppose that starting a duel when your opponent has no/few cards is good, since you can thrust and they will have to bury cards from the deck in order to try and parry, and will have no way to thrust themselves....
 
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Richard Linnell
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Also, this all makes me sad that I missed out on LBS - and those cards are crazy hard to find nowadays. R9E seems like a good way to use the system again, but I liked the setting of LBS better.
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Sean Geraghty
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solidhavok wrote:
Also, this all makes me sad that I missed out on LBS - and those cards are crazy hard to find nowadays. R9E seems like a good way to use the system again, but I liked the setting of LBS better.


I loved the setting of LBS. R9E hasn't taken hold of me yet. I have a ton of LBS cards, and I'm just waiting to find somebody locally who wants to play either game.
 
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Richard Linnell
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Yeah, the disjointedness of R9E really throws me off. Which is a little strange, since I liked the Heroscape "battle of all time" thing for what it was. It's just so difficult to build coherent "story" or "theme" around R9E's setting since the setting itself is a fairly minor point. Perhaps watching the movie would help, but for now it just leaves me going "Why are there WWII soldiers fighting against Medieval Undead?"
 
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Sean Geraghty
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solidhavok wrote:
"Why are there WWII soldiers fighting against Medieval Undead?"


Because reasons!
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Jessey
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I also purchased this and do not know what to do with it!
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tkpope wrote:
solidhavok wrote:
"Why are there WWII soldiers fighting against Medieval Undead?"


Because reasons!


Some of which are that the movie the game is based on is (in part) a parody of L5R (and LBS for that matter) in so far as they are story driven. The game theme can be summed up as "Imagine L5R except the story team never said no to a player story decision" and you get Countermay.

Having seen the movie, and having been an avid L5R player, the setting of R9E is - for me - part of the game's charm. It's extra nice that there's a fun game under the hood.
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Ron Fonck
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FLGS just called and he is holding a copy for me right now. Just waiting for the wife to get home so I can run out and pick it up. Super excited!
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