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Subject: An X-Wing Player's Questions About Attack Wing Game Mechanics rss

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Christopher Goodman

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My apologies if this has been answered before. I also don't really want to rehash old debates so again, I apologize if I am doing so. I'm just finding it hard to find clear cut answers that aren't mixed in with details I'm less concerned with.

I am a big, big fan of X-Wing. I play it competitively. I would like to try Attack Wing but I generally shy away from minis games as I don't like the investment it takes to be competitive. However, my FLGS does Attack Wing weeklies but not X-Wing weeklies (they're going to try it out with the Imdaar Alpha event) With that, I'd like to ask a few questions about the game mechanics of Attack Wing.

First a bit about what I am and am not concerned with:

-I'm not concerned with how well Attack Wing reflects or feels like Star Trek.
-I'm not concerned with component quality.
-I'm not interested in missions unless they are repeatable tournament styles or something. I'm not interested in X-Wing style missions or mission-based special OP events.
-I'm only really concerned with competitive tournament play.

My questions are with the game mechanics & balance and how they translate to competitive play:

-How well balanced is Attack Wing when you consider all of the captains and upgrades? Are there examples of builds that are just terrible? Also, are there ships, captains, or upgrades that are just plain broken?
-Along those same lines, is this game susceptible to min-maxing?
-Does anyone know how well tested the game is? Captain and upgrade costs, swapping factions on ships, how various factions interact, etc.
-What's the typical tournament point cost and how many ships do players tend to field in those games?
-Is it safe to assume tournament play is just dogfight or are there non-combat or even mission styles of tournament play? If so, what do they entail?
-If dogfight tournaments exist, do players get to match up builds against their opponent or do you use the same list for the entire tournament?
-As Attack Wing seems to lend itself to variety, how much variety in builds is actually seen in tournaments?
-Are there any really cool special abilities, concepts, or units that Attack Wing has compared to X-Wing?
-Are there any significant rule deviations between X-Wing and Attack Wing?
-I've heard ship costs are just double the sum of the ship stats. Is this true? If it is, does anyone have an argument as to why this is not a bad thing? It would seem to me that ship costs would then not be considering maneuvers, abilities, upgrade slots, or even the distribution of stat points.
-In X-Wing, being able to field a wide variety of competitive lists requires owning many copies of ships. With Attack Wing having such a wide variety of ships, is this still the case or can you field versatile and competitive lists by owning, say, one of each ship?

I really hope to not cause an X-Wing vs Attack Wing flame war but I am interested in how the two games compare.

Thank you so much in advance and again, I sincerely apologize if this is rehashing old questions. I just don't want to start collecting Attack Wing ships until I'm sure it's a game for me.
 
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Rob Tsuk
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I am not touching this thread with a ten foot pole other than to say that you should go to your FLGS Attack Wing weeklies, borrow some ships and try it. That way you'll learn about the game system as well as whether that group of players are folks you'll enjoy spending time with.
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David Montgomery
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EvaUnit02 wrote:
-How well balanced is Attack Wing when you consider all of the captains and upgrades? Are there examples of builds that are just terrible? Also, are there ships, captains, or upgrades that are just plain broken?


There are a lot of good builds, with good variety based on what you want your fleet to do. There are some terrible builds as well, moreso than X-Wing. There are a lot of ships, captains, upgrades that seem powerful, but I've never found anything broken. There are some arguments that can be made for the Borg and a certain set of upgrades, but I won't get in to that right now.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Along those same lines, is this game susceptible to min-maxing?

You certainly want to have an effective fleet, and not pay too much for it. There are cards that have a better return on investment than others, but pretty much the same as X-Wing

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Does anyone know how well tested the game is? Captain and upgrade costs, swapping factions on ships, how various factions interact, etc.

It was said that the first 27 ships were all tested together, that's the starter 3, and waves 0,1,2,3,4. Basically everything that is out right now.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-What's the typical tournament point cost and how many ships do players tend to field in those games?
It's been 100 points so far, most people are running 2-3 ships, sometimes 1 or 4.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Is it safe to assume tournament play is just dogfight or are there non-combat or even mission styles of tournament play? If so, what do they entail?

Tournaments are rarely just dogfights. Every organized play event has a specific mission to it, that adds to the game. Some more successfully than others. At the end, it does come down to destroying your opponent's fleet, but other factors play in to that.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-If dogfight tournaments exist, do players get to match up builds against their opponent or do you use the same list for the entire tournament?

Depends on the event and the organizer.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-As Attack Wing seems to lend itself to variety, how much variety in builds is actually seen in tournaments?

Because every mission is different in a tournament, you're probably taking a different list every month. There are certainly some recurring cards that show up, but there's a good amount of variety.


EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Are there any really cool special abilities, concepts, or units that Attack Wing has compared to X-Wing?

One of the big differences is that any captain can go on any ship.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Are there any significant rule deviations between X-Wing and Attack Wing?

The big one is that ships can still fire at each other if bases are touching.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-I've heard ship costs are just double the sum of the ship stats. Is this true? If it is, does anyone have an argument as to why this is not a bad thing? It would seem to me that ship costs would then not be considering maneuvers, abilities, upgrade slots, or even the distribution of stat points.

It is true. I don't have a good argument for or against it. You have to consider all things when making a fleet.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-In X-Wing, being able to field a wide variety of competitive lists requires owning many copies of ships. With Attack Wing having such a wide variety of ships, is this still the case or can you field versatile and competitive lists by owning, say, one of each ship?

You can get by with buying 1 of everything, and a select amount of duplicates. Not everything is needed, not even duplicates are needed. It all depends on what you want to do with a given fleet. A lot of unique upgrades help with this concept.
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EvaUnit02 wrote:
-How well balanced is Attack Wing when you consider all of the captains and upgrades? Are there examples of builds that are just terrible? Also, are there ships, captains, or upgrades that are just plain broken?

Answers to this question will vary wildly, but I'll chime in by saying that, while I do think the point formula is overly simplistic, I haven't noticed serious balance issues between ships in spite of that fact. For the most part, point values seem like a pretty good reflection of how good/useful something is, or how well it is likely to stack up against an equally-priced opponent. Synergy is important in this game, so of course there will be terrible builds if you just grab cards/ships based on which one you think looks cool, or whatever, rather than based on their effect in the game.

Quote:
-Along those same lines, is this game susceptible to min-maxing?

Most definitely, but that's not necessarily a bad thing IMO. Especially if you're interest is more in the competitive play environment than in thematic games. It is definitely a game where a big part of being competitive is building a good fleet, and of course the other big part is being able to play that fleet effectively.

Quote:
-Does anyone know how well tested the game is? Captain and upgrade costs, swapping factions on ships, how various factions interact, etc.

From a brief interview I heard with one of the game designers, it sounds like it's reasonably well play-tested.

Quote:
-What's the typical tournament point cost and how many ships do players tend to field in those games?

100 points, which will most frequently get you either 2 ships that are pretty heavily-laden with upgrades or 3 ships that are a bit more frugally upgraded. You could, feasibly, run a single-ship build with the Borg, or a swarm of weaker ships, but I don't think either is particularly competitive, so probably wouldn't interest you.

It sounds like the next storyline OP series will be a 90-points constructed, 30-points sealed format, although participation in the sealed part is optional on the part of the venue. Basically, there will be 5 different ships in blind boxes, and you will buy one at the start of the tournament, adding up to 30 points, to add to your 90 point fleet.

Quote:
-Is it safe to assume tournament play is just dogfight or are there non-combat or even mission styles of tournament play? If so, what do they entail?

No, tournament games have so far always had some sort of special scenario, based on events from the show. The goal is still to wipe out your opponent's fleet, but there are various other things (like beaming troops to a planet to support a ground battle, or having to deal with orbital weapons platforms) that keep it from being too much of a "point and shoot" game, and can contribute to the victory conditions.

You can read the OP scenarios on the Wizkids website.

Quote:
-As Attack Wing seems to lend itself to variety, how much variety in builds is actually seen in tournaments?

This will vary group to group, I'm sure, so really you're better off checking in on one of the weekly games played at your venue. In my experience so far, certain elements might pop up frequently, but there are still a wide variety of competitive builds.

Quote:
-Are there any really cool special abilities, concepts, or units that Attack Wing has compared to X-Wing?
-Are there any significant rule deviations between X-Wing and Attack Wing?

Sorry, haven't played enough X-Wing to answer these questions adequately. I do think that Attack Wing feels like Star Trek, and X-Wing feels like Star Wars, but you already pointed out that that's not something which particularly concerns you. One big difference is that ships and captains aren't integrated, though, so I could put Cpt. Kirk at the helm of whatever ship I wanted, for example, rather than only on the Enterprise.

Quote:
-I've heard ship costs are just double the sum of the ship stats. Is this true? If it is, does anyone have an argument as to why this is not a bad thing? It would seem to me that ship costs would then not be considering maneuvers, abilities, upgrade slots, or even the distribution of stat points.

It does appear to be the case, but as I mentioned, I haven't noticed significant balance issues as a result of this. Some people feel that the Borg kind of push the limits on balance in this regard. I personally don't have enough experience with them to say, but I think it's a "time will tell" matter, and people often find decent counters to seemingly overpowered stuff as the game grows.

Quote:
-In X-Wing, being able to field a wide variety of competitive lists requires owning many copies of ships. With Attack Wing having such a wide variety of ships, is this still the case or can you field versatile and competitive lists by owning, say, one of each ship?

I would say you can easily get by with just one of each ship, and there is no absolute must-buy ship to be competitive, either. Attack Wing de-emphasizes the role of ships, and emphasizes the role of upgrades, compared with X-Wing. The result, I find, is that many of the best upgrades are unique, and therefore you don't get any benefit from having multiples of them. You are also likely to run fewer ships in a fleet, also reducing the need for multiples of the same type of ship.

I will conclude by saying that, if you are interested primarily in tournament play (as you seem to be), then Attack Wing is probably an excellent game for you. Not to say that it can't also be enjoyed purely as a casual game at home or whatever, but there does seem to be a thriving tournament scene with a pretty enthusiastic player base. WK offers really cool participation prizes for most tournaments, too.
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Xander Fulton
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EvaUnit02 wrote:
-How well balanced is Attack Wing when you consider all of the captains and upgrades? Are there examples of builds that are just terrible? Also, are there ships, captains, or upgrades that are just plain broken?


Much moreso than X-Wing, it's definitely the case where ships or builds are unworkable, and some are OP.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Along those same lines, is this game susceptible to min-maxing?


Many would argue that's the entire point of the game.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Does anyone know how well tested the game is? Captain and upgrade costs, swapping factions on ships, how various factions interact, etc.


All ship stats in Attack Wing are granted a flat 2 points. For comparison, an 'Academy Pilot' TIE Fighter in Attack Wing would cost 16 points; while an X-Wing Rookie Pilot would cost 20 points. Does a fight between 5 X-Wings and 6 TIE Fighters sound balanced to you? Then you've got a spot in Attack Wing!

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Is it safe to assume tournament play is just dogfight or are there non-combat or even mission styles of tournament play? If so, what do they entail?
-If dogfight tournaments exist, do players get to match up builds against their opponent or do you use the same list for the entire tournament?


Something Attack Wing does REALLY well vs X-Wing is that the tournaments are not the 'endless string of dogfights' that X-Wing is. Any given event will have each player use the same list throughout all three rounds, but the mission you are playing each month is often quite a bit different.

And a lot of those events do sometimes shake up the goals and objectives that a list which is an obvious-go-to in an empty-space-dogfight...doesn't work quite as well.

So while the obviously inadequate pointing system doesn't work in a vacuum...the individuals missions are often SO different that what 'works and is OP' one month...may well suck balls the next month.

It exaggerates the importance of 'deck building' time (vs X-Wing), but does work to make the overall game feel...if not necessarily 'balanced'...at least enjoyable.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Are there any really cool special abilities, concepts, or units that Attack Wing has compared to X-Wing?


Ohh...gods, yes. Like...wow, lots. Tons are borrowed (Picard is pretty much Vader; Valdore is pretty much Backstabber; etc), but there are quite a bit of unique abilities or talents vs X-Wing.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Are there any significant rule deviations between X-Wing and Attack Wing?


Biggest ones may have been covered, but the cloak system works very different from X-Wing. And collisions in Attack Wing only lose your actions - you can still shoot the ship you hit.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-I've heard ship costs are just double the sum of the ship stats. Is this true? If it is, does anyone have an argument as to why this is not a bad thing? It would seem to me that ship costs would then not be considering maneuvers, abilities, upgrade slots, or even the distribution of stat points.


Yeah, the point cost is a flat 2x the stats. Theoretically, WizKids has balanced this with the abilities and fire arcs of the ship (IE., if your "2x stats" point cost seems too good to be true, you'll get a crappy dial or poor action list or something)...but, in practice, they do pretty badly at that. There are definitely "good" ships and "useless" ships in the game.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-In X-Wing, being able to field a wide variety of competitive lists requires owning many copies of ships. With Attack Wing having such a wide variety of ships, is this still the case or can you field versatile and competitive lists by owning, say, one of each ship?


Yup. In Attack Wing, the named (unique) ships have a 'special ability' in addition to whatever their captain/crew ability is. It's usually powerful enough that you'll never want to run a generic version of the ship (as it's free for the unique/named ship), so there's a good argument to never run generics at all - IE., one of every ship is all you'd ever want.
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The missions are incredible. Here in the link below 25 of the missions are given complete reviews with videos of each in play as well as background info of what episode or movie each scenario refers to.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1112810/compile-reviews-and-...

Watch the videos and you'll get a good idea of the gameplay.
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-How well balanced is Attack Wing when you consider all of the captains and upgrades? Are there examples of builds that are just terrible? Also, are there ships, captains, or upgrades that are just plain broken?Fairly well overall. There are a few examples of crew and upgrades that are better overall general (Picard, Dukat), most have a purpose, and a few are a dud. Nothing is out right broken as you'll often hear on here.
-Along those same lines, is this game susceptible to min-maxing?As there isn't really any force charts there isn't any true min-maxing there is however well thought out builds and poorly thought out builds. And there are some builds that will be hard-counters to others.
-Does anyone know how well tested the game is? Captain and upgrade costs, swapping factions on ships, how various factions interact, etc.Don't know the timing wise for how long they tested, but my experience is that the game keeps close to the 60-40% winrate that shows a solid balance. that means that if you take any single list up against a variety of lists with similar player skill you can expect it win between 60-40% of its matches
-What's the typical tournament point cost and how many ships do players tend to field in those games?100pts or soon 90pts Constructed/30pts out of a blind pack. Average ships is usually 1-4, I've seen 5 and 6 ship lists done up but never seen them played.
-Is it safe to assume tournament play is just dogfight or are there non-combat or even mission styles of tournament play? If so, what do they entail?You can check all the Organized play scenarios up on the Wizkids website. While there are some that are more straight up fights with minor twists, some are really different with the Arena OP coming up being pretty cool with your captains fighting to the death onthe planet.
-If dogfight tournaments exist, do players get to match up builds against their opponent or do you use the same list for the entire tournament? all of the OPs so far its a single list for the entire tournament.
-As Attack Wing seems to lend itself to variety, how much variety in builds is actually seen in tournaments?Actually quite a few, I've seen a few dozen lists that are pretty good, some have cycled in and out and some have been fairly constant
-I've heard ship costs are just double the sum of the ship stats. Is this true? If it is, does anyone have an argument as to why this is not a bad thing? It would seem to me that ship costs would then not be considering maneuvers, abilities, upgrade slots, or even the distribution of stat points. While the point costs are determined by Total stats x 2, The ship ability, maneuver dial. slots, fire arcs are all balanced off each other and the stats of the ship to balance the ship at the points determined by the stats.
-In X-Wing, being able to field a wide variety of competitive lists requires owning many copies of ships. With Attack Wing having such a wide variety of ships, is this still the case or can you field versatile and competitive lists by owning, say, one of each ship?2 of each ship is often the max with few exceptions. I personally only have 1 of each with a few rare exceptions.
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1) There is a significant disparity in some of the ships. You will not win by just throwing any old combination of ships together. You'll need to do at least some research or asking around to establish the good ships. There are also some hotly debated balance issues with the borg faction in general (wether or not they are OP).

2) I'm not sure how the term "min-maxing" actually is meant to apply outside of an RPG game. There are certainly a number of incredibly poweful synergies and combos within the game that can be used.

3) All we know is what the Designers have told us and they assure us it was "extensively tested".

4) Currently 100 points, going to 120 in the near future (90 preconstructed, 30 draft). Effective fleets will be mainly 2 or 3 ships, rarely 4. May see more 4 ship builds with the higher point cap.

5) The only official tournament play so far has been Organized lay scenarios. Standard dogfight rules are 1v1 with a planet obstruction in the center of the field.

6) Wizkids has a tacit policy of "whatever the running venue says, goes" so unofficial tournaments can vary wildly. A typical tournament however will be 3 rounds and you use the same squad all 3 rounds.

7) Prior to Borg, With faction-mixing, the selections were fantastic. I hear there was alot of variety on the faction pure side as well.

8) The wildnesss of abilities in Attack wing far outstrip X-Wing. Ships that can Quantum Jump to the other side of the board, Pull reverse maneuvers, steal opponents upgrades for your own, or build a web of energy in space your opponent has to avoid are just a few.

9) Biggest difference is bumping and hitting obstacles does not prevent you from attacking. Everything else comes from the wide array of available actions.

10) its just how they are. There are definitely some ships that are a better value for the cost and whatever your "style" of play may be. Refer to point 1 above.

11) You can get by with owning one of each ship very easily. There are only a few you would really want multiple copies of and there are also a fair number you can skip entirely without any significant hindrance to your competitiveness. Again, a little research or just asking around the forums will help you find these.

Something you didn't ask: This game has limited edition promotional items that you get for free from attending Organized Play events called "Resources". These are not significantly hard to get, but do require some effort and they are all but a necessity to be competitive in a tournament that allows them. They have a higher effectiveness vs cost ratio than the usual ships and cards, but you are restricted to only using one in your fleet.
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Christopher Goodman

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Is the complete list of these listed on the BGG Attack Wing page under "Promos and Exclusives"?
 
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yes
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I like your handle!

Anyhow... sounds like you've heard a lot of naysaying from the X-Wing fans about why Attack Wing may not be for you. If you're going to hang out among a lot of parochial types, then it may not be a good fit. Generally perception and human interaction and bias trump objective reality. So as Rob said, if you don't like the Attack Wing players, or if you're constantly hanging around X-Wing fanatics who are threatened by your Attack Wing play... well, in the words of a very wise man, "You're gonna have a bad time."

That said I'll answer a few of these from my perspective.

EvaUnit02 wrote:

-How well balanced is Attack Wing when you consider all of the captains and upgrades? Are there examples of builds that are just terrible? Also, are there ships, captains, or upgrades that are just plain broken?


Just as in X-Wing, there are terrible terrible builds, and there are a much smaller number of very good builds. Given the constantly changing meta I've personally found that there is a *far* greater variety of competitive uber builds in Attack Wing than there was in X-Wing - at least until the Borg showed up. Now, my experience with X-Wing was with the first three waves and that meant that there were very few uber builds (a half dozen at most). As I am very eager to get X-Wing on the table again it seems that now there is more variety - *BUT* - the style of variety is very different. X-Wing seems to have blunted the Tie swarm dullness, but still favors permutations of ship classes with a pilot / upgrade variation here and there. Attack Wing *STRONGLY* favors a very small number of unique ships, coupled with several unique captains and *MANY* upgrades mixing into a very optimized and unique combination.

That was prior to the Borg. Now nobody knows which way is up. It may be the case that for competitive play (all theme and other considerations aside) for a few months at least the Borg will dominate. Given the games track record I'm sure that won't last, but if you're sensitive to that then you may not want to get into it at this time.

Quote:

-In X-Wing, being able to field a wide variety of competitive lists requires owning many copies of ships. With Attack Wing having such a wide variety of ships, is this still the case or can you field versatile and competitive lists by owning, say, one of each ship?


Given that I'm looking into getting back into X-Wing so I've actually paid attention to how many of what ships I'd have to buy, I have to say Attack Wing *feels* much easier on the wallet. There's only a handful of ships you want doubles of, and certainly no nonsense like wanting to get four Lambda shuttles just to get a single card.

All that said, your milage may vary.
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Jon NyD

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As I've been playing more X-Wing lately, I'll echo some of the thoughts up to now.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
My questions are with the game mechanics & balance and how they translate to competitive play:

-How well balanced is Attack Wing when you consider all of the captains and upgrades? Are there examples of builds that are just terrible? Also, are there ships, captains, or upgrades that are just plain broken?


Like X-Wing, there are good and bad captains. There are good and bad builds. But a LOT of this is going to depend on the rules your TO has set forth at your store. The biggest question you have to figure out first is if they're playing faction pure or not. If they are faction pure, is it just ships or whole fleets? Arguably the best captain is available in the starter: Picard. And arguably the best ship is the borg sphere. Up until the borg, it was the Valdore. Things will feel "broken" compared to x-wing because of the number of attack dice that can get involved. But just like x-wing, it will boil down to how many of those dice you can reliably convert to hits/crits.


EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Along those same lines, is this game susceptible to min-maxing?


Of course it is. This game is more like a cross between X-Wing and MTG. X-wing for maneuvering and dice mechanics, MTG for fleet building. When you combine the two its a very explosive game! Check out some of the "building challenge" threads to see all the different directions you can go with your min/maxing.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Does anyone know how well tested the game is? Captain and upgrade costs, swapping factions on ships, how various factions interact, etc.


The designers have assured us it has been tested in a mixed-faction environment very extensively with waves 0-4.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-What's the typical tournament point cost and how many ships do players tend to field in those games?


Typical (suggested) is 100 points right now. With the collective event, suggested is 90 points + 30 points of a blind ship that could buy as your entry fee. If your store isn't doing the blind portion it could still be 100 points. (You have to check)

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Is it safe to assume tournament play is just dogfight or are there non-combat or even mission styles of tournament play? If so, what do they entail?


Check out the scenarios laid out thus far:
http://wizkidsgames.com/startrek/star-trek-attack-wing/
Look at the storyline events, right now Tholian Web (episode events) is out and next month is the arena. Both are detailed.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-If dogfight tournaments exist, do players get to match up builds against their opponent or do you use the same list for the entire tournament?


Usually you use the same list the entire tournament, but as always the TO (Tournament Organizer) is given great power to vary it as they see fit.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-As Attack Wing seems to lend itself to variety, how much variety in builds is actually seen in tournaments?


With the Borg out right now you may not see many variations in tournament builds. The borg are equivalent to a millennium falcon that can move in any direction.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Are there any really cool special abilities, concepts, or units that Attack Wing has compared to X-Wing?


TONS of cool special abilities, combos, units, ships, etc. Each ship has quite the number of different cards. While some are functionally the same, I now need a 2nd Binder (20 page) to store it all.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-Are there any significant rule deviations between X-Wing and Attack Wing?


The biggest one you'll find is that if ships bump, they can still fire on each other. Cloaking used to be pretty good too but its waning in popularity and effectiveness with the borg.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-I've heard ship costs are just double the sum of the ship stats. Is this true? If it is, does anyone have an argument as to why this is not a bad thing? It would seem to me that ship costs would then not be considering maneuvers, abilities, upgrade slots, or even the distribution of stat points.


The ship costs are exactly that, and they don't appear to take into account any of the other items you mentioned. Generic ships are rarely worth the 2 points less than you'd pay for a named ship with a special ability.

EvaUnit02 wrote:
-In X-Wing, being able to field a wide variety of competitive lists requires owning many copies of ships. With Attack Wing having such a wide variety of ships, is this still the case or can you field versatile and competitive lists by owning, say, one of each ship?


Until the borg you could field a competitive list with just the starter. Post borg, you really only need the starter plus 2 spheres. I've meticulously collected at least one of every ship, but that is far from necessary. The ones I have doubles and triples of are ships I like (B'Rel and Miranda) You could easily pick one faction and pick up a few different ships to create a competitive list. If your store is faction pure ships/fleets its even easier.


The X-Wing crowd asks me about attack wing all the time, and I give them the most honest opinion I can: Its a different game based on similar movement mechanics. They each have their strengths and weaknesses. If you're thinking about this game, join the attack wing night and ask to borrow a klingon fleet. I say klingon because they are pretty straightforward and have similar movement dials. See if you like the mechanics involved (cloaking, higher dice, potentially higher defense dice) then start customizing from there. Let us know what you think!
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Jared Voshall
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EvaUnit02 wrote:
-I've heard ship costs are just double the sum of the ship stats. Is this true? If it is, does anyone have an argument as to why this is not a bad thing? It would seem to me that ship costs would then not be considering maneuvers, abilities, upgrade slots, or even the distribution of stat points.


As one of the more vocal posters wanting a more robust costing scheme for the ships (as well as double or triple the point values to allow a more granular balance between the various upgrades), I can also see why they went with the simple cost formula that they did.

For the ships that the game focuses on (Attack 3-6, Agility 1-2), the end cost of the ship is very close to most recost formulas that have been attempted, and most of the imbalances are smaller than the variances in player skill and luck of the dice (though with many of the upgrades that are out now, the latter is becoming less and less of a factor). This, in turn, allows them to quickly generate ships, using the Maneuver Dial, Upgrade Slots, Ship Action Bar, and Unique Ability (where applicable) to balance each other out. Thus far, they have done a solid job in balancing these out (with one or two notable exceptions), though the Borg may be on the outside edge of balance, with their range 1-3 360 degree firing arc (and, previously, Cloak had gotten a lot of flack for it's nearly-free +4 defense).
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Xander Fulton
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jonnyd76 wrote:
With the Borg out right now you may not see many variations in tournament builds. The borg are equivalent to a millennium falcon that can move in any direction.


To clarify: the Borg are like the Millenium Falcon, if it was on a 'small' base, could move in any direction (like a rook) at any time with no penalty, and had an 'attack 5' primary weapon (remember the Spheres and cubes base attack is equal to the most powerful weapon in the game at the time they were released).

Could you imagine anyone NOT running a dual-Falcon list in that environment?

So, yeah, everyone is running Borg. Last OP event I went to, 5 of the 8 fleets were dual-sphere, and one was a Sphere + Klingon ship. Two of us brought non-Borg lists, and lost (prize ships for top 2 places both went to Borg-fielding lists).
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