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Subject: 2014 FIFA World Cup Brazil rss

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Winner Of World Cup Hammered Out Just In Time For Tournament

http://www.theonion.com/articles/winner-of-world-cup-hammere...
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You are ruining my suspension of disbelief.
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The ref didn’t even speak English. I asked him why did he give the penalty and he just mumbled something. My team-mates tell me the same thing – how can you have an international ref who is officiating the opening match, but he doesn’t speak English and you can’t even speak to him?”
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For those who have no idea what this thread is about:
A Brazilian player took a hilarious dive in the box in order to get a penalty shot, which became the game-winning goal against uber-underdog Croatia in the opening game of the World Cup. The ref is taking a lot of heat for buying the dive.



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To be fair, from the ref's angle that is a really superb dive. He timed it very well with the tug on his shoulder. From the back it's very obviously a dive. That's why soccer needs replay. FIFA argues that it would slow the game down too much, but if you're going to give a penalty that slows the game down anyway just let the fourth official take a peek at the live feed which surely will have good angles of the replay and notify the ref immediately if there's a problem. In 95% of cases it shouldn't take any longer than it already does because you can make a good determination in the time it takes to set up a penalty kick. It's just asinine that FIFA has still not found a good way to do this.
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thermogimp wrote:
To be fair, from the ref's angle that is a really superb dive. He timed it very well with the tug on his shoulder. From the back it's very obviously a dive. That's why soccer needs replay. FIFA argues that it would slow the game down too much, but if you're going to give a penalty that slows the game down anyway just let the fourth official take a peek at the live feed which surely will have good angles of the replay and notify the ref immediately if there's a problem. In 95% of cases it shouldn't take any longer than it already does because you can make a good determination in the time it takes to set up a penalty kick. It's just asinine that FIFA has still not found a good way to do this.


It would make cheating much harder. Plain as that.
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Asur wrote:
thermogimp wrote:
To be fair, from the ref's angle that is a really superb dive. He timed it very well with the tug on his shoulder. From the back it's very obviously a dive. That's why soccer needs replay. FIFA argues that it would slow the game down too much, but if you're going to give a penalty that slows the game down anyway just let the fourth official take a peek at the live feed which surely will have good angles of the replay and notify the ref immediately if there's a problem. In 95% of cases it shouldn't take any longer than it already does because you can make a good determination in the time it takes to set up a penalty kick. It's just asinine that FIFA has still not found a good way to do this.


It would make cheating much harder. Plain as that.
Something that FIFA is obviously as interested in as battling corruption.


Ahahaha ha. I'm so funny shake
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I often find myself in need of examples of injury in sport to make salient points to rooms full of people who believe the human body is some kind of unassailable fortress, and so I'm always on the lookout for footage of human-on-human wreckage. I don't know from soccer but something I learned pretty quickly is that I have to hold those clips to a much higher standard, like an actual bone poking out.*

Could it not be said that flopping expertly, while not good play, is actually effective play? QED


*Although I'll also accept a foot pointing the completely wrong way.
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Asur wrote:
thermogimp wrote:
To be fair, from the ref's angle that is a really superb dive. He timed it very well with the tug on his shoulder. From the back it's very obviously a dive. That's why soccer needs replay. FIFA argues that it would slow the game down too much, but if you're going to give a penalty that slows the game down anyway just let the fourth official take a peek at the live feed which surely will have good angles of the replay and notify the ref immediately if there's a problem. In 95% of cases it shouldn't take any longer than it already does because you can make a good determination in the time it takes to set up a penalty kick. It's just asinine that FIFA has still not found a good way to do this.


It would make cheating much harder. Plain as that.


Yep for times when the ball goes dead the fourth official could easily take a quick look at a video feed.

I also wouldn't mind a citing system a bit similar to Rugby Union. After the game has finished certain offences can be brought to the citing official's notice and players can get retrospective red and yellow cards etc. In the Brazil match that probably means a yellow card for diving here, and possibly Neymar facing sanctions over his challenge on Modric.

Once players start missing games they will eventually start to come round and cutting such foul play out of their game.
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thermogimp wrote:
To be fair, from the ref's angle that is a really superb dive. He timed it very well with the tug on his shoulder. From the back it's very obviously a dive. That's why soccer needs replay. FIFA argues that it would slow the game down too much, but if you're going to give a penalty that slows the game down anyway just let the fourth official take a peek at the live feed which surely will have good angles of the replay and notify the ref immediately if there's a problem. In 95% of cases it shouldn't take any longer than it already does because you can make a good determination in the time it takes to set up a penalty kick. It's just asinine that FIFA has still not found a good way to do this.


It's not really asinine... more like cynical.
You must realise that, before being a sport, football is nowadays an industry.
The newspapers depend on having something to write about, the TVs need something to constantly replay, etc...

All the dubious refereeing, the subjective criteria rules and several other aspects contribute to keeping football a matter of discussion, feeding endless debates amongst the fans and fuelling absurd comments shows.

When there is such a clear example of good implementation of technology, such as what happens in Rugby, not following the examples is either absolute stupidity (which I find hard to believe) or a desire to continue with something for more "obscure" reasons.
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HiveGod wrote:
Could it not be said that flopping expertly, while not good play, is actually effective play? QED


Well, cheating usually is effective. Does that make it acceptable?
Would you be willing to play boardgames with a cheater?
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All in all though it really would not have made a difference. Croatia wouldnt have won even without that bum call. On top of that they more than likely would have been beaten 3-0 if it hadnt been for Marcelo kicking the ball into his own goal. (I say this as someone who was pulling for the Croatians)
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Luftwaffe Flak wrote:
All in all though it really would not have made a difference. Croatia wouldnt have won even without that bum call. On top of that they more than likely would have been beaten 3-0 if it hadnt been for Marcelo kicking the ball into his own goal. (I say this as someone who was pulling for the Croatians)


Winning is not the point. They could have finished with a draw which would have been a big result against Brazil. Brazil's third goal probably doesn't happen either if Croatia wasn't pushing for an equalizer.
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Mallgur wrote:
HiveGod wrote:
Could it not be said that flopping expertly, while not good play, is actually effective play? QED

Well, cheating usually is effective. Does that make it acceptable?
Would you be willing to play boardgames with a cheater?

As I said, I don't know anything about soccer—but as an outsider looking in, flopping and histrionics appear to be pretty standard procedure.

If it's expressly forbidden by the rules (and I'm guessing it is, given your response) I suppose I'm surprised FIFA hasn't taken steps to police it better.

Unless money's involved, in which case the rabble should just maintain minimum safe distance from my limo lest they wind up tear-gassed and rubber-bulleted.
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HiveGod wrote:
Mallgur wrote:
HiveGod wrote:
Could it not be said that flopping expertly, while not good play, is actually effective play? QED

Well, cheating usually is effective. Does that make it acceptable?
Would you be willing to play boardgames with a cheater?

As I said, I don't know anything about soccer—but as an outsider looking in, flopping and histrionics appear to be pretty standard procedure.

If it's expressly forbidden by the rules (and I'm guessing it is, given your response) I suppose I'm surprised FIFA hasn't taken steps to police it better.

Unless money's involved, in which case the rabble should just maintain minimum safe distance from my limo lest they wind up tear-gassed and rubber-bulleted.


The point of problem is the refeeres and the fact that there descision on the field will stay. Btw that ref was about three times as good as any of the referees I ever seen in Sweden. And acctually I am quite sure his linesman said it was a pentaly (also is putting your hands on somebody shoulder allowed?)

There also been a few other situations discussed, like the one where Julius Cesar was challenged in the air and got a free kick. From the replay it quite clear that he got a elbow in the back but as the ref was so bad at that pentaly situation all the bad things blow on him.

In reality I hate refs.

Also let's not get all RSP but FIFA could well deserve a thread in there as a lot of what they to relates to poltical stuff.
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One of the main reasons I hate watching Soccer...and Basketball.

If I wanted to watch fictional drama, it had better have a Transformer being washed by Megan Fox in a pair of daisy dukes.
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The NBA has taken flopping to new heights. Vlade Divac was the master. He wouldn't get touched, flop and let out a grunt of pain so loud you could hear it 20 rows back. Magic Johnson was a close second with John Stockton third although Stockton gets extra points for dirty play. Saw him once flop and throw an elbow as he went down at another player's knee. Heard another player once say if he ever saw John Stockton in a parking lot he'd floor it.
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1. The defender has his hands on the forward in the box - illegal. Look it up under Holding, pg. 37 on the current FIFA rules. Dumb thing to do, either way and also illegal.

2. Dives shouldn't happen in ANY sport

3. EVERY US sport has this type of thing and easily just as bad - NBA flopping, traveling, holding. NFL has CBs fouling WRs, DBs hammering QBs. MLB has arbitrary strike zone determination and other crap. Gripe about something else or risk looking hypocritical.


All this is, from my perspective, is a new and fairly clever (I'll admit) way for US sports fan to shit on the sport. Gotta find some reason to dislike it, right? shake
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fightcitymayor wrote:
For those who have no idea what this thread is about:
A Brazilian player took a hilarious dive in the box after being pulled on illegally, even if it was a small tug, in order to get a penalty shot, which became the game-winning goal against slight underdog Croatia in the opening game of the World Cup despite the fact that Brazil outplayed them most of the match. The ref is taking a lot of heat for buying the dive despite the fact that in real-time, anyone would have thought it was a foul.





FTFY
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Asur wrote:
Quote:
The ref didn’t even speak English. I asked him why did he give the penalty and he just mumbled something. My team-mates tell me the same thing – how can you have an international ref who is officiating the opening match, but he doesn’t speak English and you can’t even speak to him?”


Because it's not up for discussion. Maybe you're unfamiliar with the sport but in general, you don't get to sit down and have a polite discussion about why a call was made and/or get to debate it. shake
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thermogimp wrote:
Luftwaffe Flak wrote:
All in all though it really would not have made a difference. Croatia wouldnt have won even without that bum call. On top of that they more than likely would have been beaten 3-0 if it hadnt been for Marcelo kicking the ball into his own goal. (I say this as someone who was pulling for the Croatians)


Winning is not the point. They could have finished with a draw which would have been a big result against Brazil. Brazil's third goal probably doesn't happen either if Croatia wasn't pushing for an equalizer.


Absolutely no way to know that - though, in fact, if Oscar's forays, which had been getting consistently more dangerous, were any indication, they WOULD have scored anyway.
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virre wrote:
HiveGod wrote:
Mallgur wrote:
HiveGod wrote:
Could it not be said that flopping expertly, while not good play, is actually effective play? QED

Well, cheating usually is effective. Does that make it acceptable?
Would you be willing to play boardgames with a cheater?

As I said, I don't know anything about soccer—but as an outsider looking in, flopping and histrionics appear to be pretty standard procedure.

If it's expressly forbidden by the rules (and I'm guessing it is, given your response) I suppose I'm surprised FIFA hasn't taken steps to police it better.

Unless money's involved, in which case the rabble should just maintain minimum safe distance from my limo lest they wind up tear-gassed and rubber-bulleted.


The point of problem is the refeeres and the fact that there descision on the field will stay. Btw that ref was about three times as good as any of the referees I ever seen in Sweden. And acctually I am quite sure his linesman said it was a pentaly (also is putting your hands on somebody shoulder allowed?)

There also been a few other situations discussed, like the one where Julius Cesar was challenged in the air and got a free kick. From the replay it quite clear that he got a elbow in the back but as the ref was so bad at that pentaly situation all the bad things blow on him.

In reality I hate refs.

Also let's not get all RSP but FIFA could well deserve a thread in there as a lot of what they to relates to poltical stuff.


Thank you for bringing some common sense and experience with the sport to this topic. Well said, sir.
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wytefang wrote:
Asur wrote:
Quote:
The ref didn’t even speak English. I asked him why did he give the penalty and he just mumbled something. My team-mates tell me the same thing – how can you have an international ref who is officiating the opening match, but he doesn’t speak English and you can’t even speak to him?”


Because it's not up for discussion. Maybe you're unfamiliar with the sport but in general, you don't get to sit down and have a polite discussion about why a call was made and/or get to debate it. shake


The Croatian professional player is unfamiliar with the sport? Yes, that must be it.
So you're defending it's not important a referee to be able to communicate with the players? ok.
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wytefang wrote:
thermogimp wrote:
Luftwaffe Flak wrote:
All in all though it really would not have made a difference. Croatia wouldnt have won even without that bum call. On top of that they more than likely would have been beaten 3-0 if it hadnt been for Marcelo kicking the ball into his own goal. (I say this as someone who was pulling for the Croatians)


Winning is not the point. They could have finished with a draw which would have been a big result against Brazil. Brazil's third goal probably doesn't happen either if Croatia wasn't pushing for an equalizer.


Absolutely no way to know that - though, in fact, if Oscar's forays, which had been getting consistently more dangerous, were any indication, they WOULD have scored anyway.


Sure, but you have to admit that the whole tone of the game is changed by that call. And there really is not a penalty there. I know what the rules say, but you know as well as I do that there is a threshold of holding that is tolerated and it usually needs to be a clear, blatant foul to be called for a penalty.

I'm not saying that Croatia played better than Brazil. Brazil could very well have still earned a win afterward. But that play could just have easily been a card for the Brazilian player for diving as it was a penalty. And those kind of situations could easily be cleaned up with clear evidence if FIFA cared about it.

Also, the linesman in the Mexico vs. Cameroon game today have absolutely jobbed Mexico. At least they're still winning by a goal at this point but it should really be 2-0 or 3-0.
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